Stalkers

[Temstar]

Noobs? What about you running out of ammo with scar. It has about 375 rounds and decent damage how do you manage to just run out? The only reason I can come up with why you would need two assault rifles worth of ammo is because you're a spammer. Really, learn to use semi-auto and aim to the head before judging.

It was six man suicidal manor, the team was camping the middle cave. We had two support holding the back facing the trader (two because their sucked), a medic healing them full time because they sucked. A useless firebug at the front with me (he should've just changed perk, there's just not enough distance for DOTs to work). A crossbow sharpshooter who's actually good but had to deal with scrake and FP from both direction and therefore only used crossbow and me, sweeping the front.

So I had to kill about 75% of the specimen every wave, with the remaining ones coming from the back taken care of by the supports and FP and Scrakes by the sharp. I kept both SCAR and AK-47 on semi the entire game and scored mostly headshoots and still on wave 9 I ran out of ammo for both guns with about 20 specimens left, so had to get the 9mm for the last handful. My kill was well into the 4 digits by then already.

Now that I think about it, you probably never tried such combination and are only trying to look pro by immediately calling noob any kind of thinking outside the box or playing in a way that wasn't directly intended by the creators. Really just think a little before making such dumb statement as the commando/scar/M32 combination turns out to be one of the most powerful considering it doesn't use overpowered sharp weapons.

No, no experienced commando use it because it sucks. It doesn't even kill gorefast on a direct hit even in the hands of demo 6. Against crowds you're much better off just shave off all their heads with an assault rifle. Not to mention it's pointless against Scrakes because of the explosive resistance (here's a hint: two assault rifle + katana), and I doubt it will kill and FP even with 6 nades. Better off just letting the sharpshooter kill it with one bolt.

God help you if you were around in early retail, were commandos have to try to beat suicidal where the ONLY assault rifle around was bullpup.

 

[CandleJack]

(here's a hint: two assault rifle + katana)

Friendly info: the SCAR-H Mk17, the one found in Killing Floor, is actually a Battle Rifle due to the fact it fires 7.62 NATO. So the L22 and AKS47U are the only assault rifles

The more you know.

 

[Temstar]

So the L22 and AKS47U are the only assault rifles

Well no, if you want to be precise, both L22 and ASK-47U are carbines, not assault rifles.

/k/ommandos brofist

 

[human_gs]

Try playing suicidal, you'll need two assault rifle worth of ammo for one wave.

It was six man suicidal manor... So I had to kill about 75% of the specimen every wave, with the remaining ones coming from the back taken care of by the supports and FP and Scrakes by the sharp. I kept both SCAR and AK-47 on semi the entire game and scored mostly headshoots and still on wave 9 I ran out of ammo for both guns with about 20 specimens left, so had to get the 9mm for the last handful. My kill was well into the 4 digits by then already....

Ah I just love it how you first tell me you NEED 2 assault rifle worth of ammo for suicidal in general and then start telling me of a specific case in which all your team dropped the ball and you had to go rambo on thousands of ZEDs.
Really if 2 rifles worth of ammo is almost enough to kill 75% of the ZEDs on a later wave on a six man suicidal then I gotta say it's VERY excessive.
You just proved my point.

No, no experienced commando use it because it sucks. It doesn't even kill gorefast on a direct hit even in the hands of demo 6. Against crowds you're much better off just shave off all their heads with an assault rifle.

I doubt you would know if no experienced commando uses it. Yes, it doesn't kill a gorefast on one hit, that's why you can quickly fire two on a group. Or better yet, fire one and then easily sweep the remaining gorefasts with you scar, which should only take a shot or 2.

Not to mention it's pointless against Scrakes because of the explosive resistance (here's a hint: two assault rifle + katana), and I doubt it will kill and FP even with 6 nades.

And scar is pointless against FP, so what's your point? Every type of gun has it's weaknesses that's why it's effective to carry a grenade launcher over a weaker assault rifle.

Better off just letting the sharpshooter kill it with one bolt.

YES I get it, letting FPs to the sharp is always easier but what if there's no sharp around or he's dead? Or if your team has no sharps on purpose to make the game harder? Sometimes it's more fun to play that way. If you just wanna win just choose a team entirely made of lvl6 sharp and spam with EBR.

God help you if you were around in early retail, were commandos have to try to beat suicidal where the ONLY assault rifle around was bullpup.

WTF?

Ever heard of the phrase "Jack of all trades, master of none"?

Either play Commando or Demolitions, don't try and do both.

Or play commando with it's most powerful weapon and all bonuses, but also have an M32 as secondary, turning you into master and jack.
And I just love it how you tell me I MUSTN'T mix perks like it's some kind of blasphemy, although the game let's you do in effectively.

 

[Temstar]

Ah I just love it how you first tell me you NEED 2 assault rifle worth of ammo for suicidal in general and then start telling me of a specific case in which all your team dropped the ball and you had to go rambo on thousands of ZEDs.
Really if 2 rifles worth of ammo is almost enough to kill 75% of the ZEDs on a later wave on a six man suicidal then I gotta say it's VERY excessive.
You just proved my point.

That's the only time I've ever run out of both assault rifle ammo. That said, as a commando you're expected to sweep, so that's clot/gorefast/bloat/crawler/stalker/siren and maybe husk. That's a good 7/9 specimens that you're suppose to handle for the team, not to mention the lower specimens spawn in larger numbers. Just like how a good medic should aim for the buttom of the score board, a good commando should aim to be the first by a wide margin. At least 50% of the time I play suicidal I'll be out of SCAR ammo by the end of the round, and that's all semi and aimed at heads. If you don't run low/out of SCAR ammo on suicidal (give or take other commandos and/or sharpshooter with M14) then you're not doing your job as a commando well enough.

I doubt you would know if no experienced commando uses it. Yes, it doesn't kill a gorefast on one hit, that's why you can quickly fire two on a group. Or better yet, fire one and then easily sweep the remaining gorefasts with you scar, which should only take a shot or 2.

Or just you know, take off all the gorefast heads with 1 shot each with the SCAR? Yes, obviously you're going to miss some, but you have a 25 round magazine, plus 37 or 50 round more with another rifle. With the max spawn being 32 specimen at a time, you should be able to comfortably handle any mob from a single direction as long as there's a sharpshooter or medic with crossbow to take out the heavies.

And scar is pointless against FP, so what's your point? Every type of gun has it's weaknesses that's why it's effective to carry a grenade launcher over a weaker assault rifle.

You throw that "weaker assault rifle" term around like as if it's actually have meaning. Before SCAR came out people were winning suicidal with AK and bullpup, with AK being their main gun. Not to mention with SCAR and one of the two carbines, you have 3 weight left over for a katana, which gives you a hard counter against scrakes. Rather than "oh maybe I'll just fire 6 nades, take off half of a FP's hp, make him rage, make a nice smokescreen for him so sharpshooters can't take a shot and get someone on the team killed, AND one less assault rifle to boot.

YES I get it, letting FPs to the sharp is always easier but what if there's no sharp around or he's dead?

That's no argument. That's like saying "oh, we're taking a lot of damage every round, so we need healing. There's no medic around, everyone go buy MP7".

Alternatively what if say it's down to you and the sharpshooter with 100 specimen left. He's got the big stuff covered. You're already running low on SCAR and your precious M32 because you've been fighting all round. What are you going to do? Fight it out with 9mm? A second assault rifle means you'll have plenty of ammo do deal with these kind of situations.

Or if your team has no sharps on purpose to make the game harder? Sometimes it's more fun to play that way. If you just wanna win just choose a team entirely made of lvl6 sharp and spam with EBR.

That's up to you but we're not arguing which setup is more fun here, we are arguing which will actually help the most in winning the game.

WTF?

No there's a good point there. You're saying AK and bullpup are crap. I'm telling you before there was AK and SCAR, bullpup was the only in perk weapon Commando had, and people beat suicidal with THAT and a chainsaw. Chainsaw for Scrake and FP with bullpup for the rest. Now if people can do fine on suicidal with a bullpup then that's hardly a bad weapon is it?

Or play commando with it's most powerful weapon and all bonuses, but also have an M32 as secondary, turning you into master and jack.
And I just love it how you tell me I MUSTN'T mix perks like it's some kind of blasphemy, although the game let's you do in effectively.

I'm not saying it's not effective, I'm saying it's not as effective as two assault rifles

 

[Azukki]

Why should you gain experience for one perk just by playing the game and killing stalkers out of necessity/accident with unrelated perks/weapons...
Maybe the Stalker requirements should be lowered again, but this idea is just silly in my opinion.

I agree that the dual machine gun combo is indeed handy on Hard and nearly necessary on suicidal. It always gives you a better potential for contribution to the team, and is, in my experience, the most effective weapon load-out for a commando. (exception: SCAR > [Bullpup + AK])
I prefer Bullpup + SCAR, which give three nice options: Well aimed and powerful individual shots, fully automatic yet accurate bursts, and the ace in the hole: high DPS spray-down. One could also plink trash zeds' heads, but, egh, I wear out left click on my mice too fast as-is.

 

[human_gs]

That's the only time I've ever run out of both assault rifle ammo. That said, as a commando you're expected to sweep, so that's clot/gorefast/bloat/crawler/stalker/siren and maybe husk. That's a good 7/9 specimens that you're suppose to handle for the team, not to mention the lower specimens spawn in larger numbers. Just like how a good medic should aim for the buttom of the score board, a good commando should aim to be the first by a wide margin. At least 50% of the time I play suicidal I'll be out of SCAR ammo by the end of the round, and that's all semi and aimed at heads. If you don't run low/out of SCAR ammo on suicidal (give or take other commandos and/or sharpshooter with M14) then you're not doing your job as a commando well enough.

Just because commando is good against 7 out of 9 ZEDs doesn't mean he should take out all of them on big teams, making every other perk but medic and sharp obsolete. That is just a ridiculous way of thinking. You are talking about rambo-ing, a tactic the game should't allow.

Or just you know, take off all the gorefast heads with 1 shot each with the SCAR? Yes, obviously you're going to miss some, but you have a 25 round magazine, plus 37 or 50 round more with another rifle. With the max spawn being 32 specimen at a time, you should be able to comfortably handle any mob from a single direction as long as there's a sharpshooter or medic with crossbow to take out the heavies.

I'm not saying you should carry M32 over scar, but over AK47, which is too underpowered to take body shots and has poor sights to land headshots.

You throw that "weaker assault rifle" term around like as if it's actually have meaning. Before SCAR came out people were winning suicidal with AK and bullpup, with AK being their main gun. Not to mention with SCAR and one of the two carbines, you have 3 weight left over for a katana, which gives you a hard counter against scrakes. Rather than "oh maybe I'll just fire 6 nades, take off half of a FP's hp, make him rage, make a nice smokescreen for him so sharpshooters can't take a shot and get someone on the team killed, AND one less assault rifle to boot.

Weaker=comparative, it is weaker than Scar that's all I was saying. And if you stack nades along with some allies (depending on number of players) and then use M32 you can take the FP easily, no need to call the sharp.

That's no argument. That's like saying "oh, we're taking a lot of damage every round, so we need healing. There's no medic around, everyone go buy MP7".

If there's no medic around, you can still and should heal, if there's no sharp, you can't still take out FPs if you carry a M32. Really you can't play without a sharp to save you? Have you at least tried?

Alternatively what if say it's down to you and the sharpshooter with 100 specimen left. He's got the big stuff covered. You're already running low on SCAR and your precious M32 because you've been fighting all round. What are you going to do? Fight it out with 9mm? A second assault rifle means you'll have plenty of ammo do deal with these kind of situations.

If there you are two guys against 100 ZEDs and you're already running low on the excessive scar ammo I'm afraid you are either a spammer or your team sucks. And I don't think you should choose your equipment based on the assumption your team sucks, that's just silly.

That's up to you but we're not arguing which setup is more fun here, we are arguing which will actually help the most in winning the game.

The two setups are useful for different kind of teams. If you just wanna win I'm surprised you even use commando, when spamming EBR gives you the best chances.

No there's a good point there. You're saying AK and bullpup are crap. I'm telling you before there was AK and SCAR, bullpup was the only in perk weapon Commando had, and people beat suicidal with THAT and a chainsaw. Chainsaw for Scrake and FP with bullpup for the rest. Now if people can do fine on suicidal with a bullpup then that's hardly a bad weapon is it?

For the last time, I'm not saying they are crap, I'm just saying they are way less powerful than Scar, and what's the point of carrying a weaker version of a weapon you already have, which has already enough ammo to go around.

I'm not saying it's not effective, I'm saying it's not as effective as two assault rifles

Well I beg the differ, as much as you like assault rifles and the commando itself, sooner or later you will encounter a situation in which the M32 is just ideal.

 

[Temstar]

Just because commando is good against 7 out of 9 ZEDs doesn't mean he should take out all of them on big teams, making every other perk but medic and sharp obsolete. That is just a ridiculous way of thinking. You are talking about rambo-ing, a tactic the game should't allow.

I'm not talking about rambo-ing, I'm talking about the team holding a position. The commando should be out in front sweeping the majority of the specimen that shows up. If you're not doing that then you're not playing commando to the fullest.

I'm not saying you should carry M32 over scar, but over AK47, which is too underpowered to take body shots and has poor sights to land headshots.

I'm actually a bullpup person. But AK-47's sight is prefectly adequate for headshot. If you can't land them, that's the fault of you not the gun.

If there's no medic around, you can still and should heal, if there's no sharp, you can't still take out FPs if you carry a M32. Really you can't play without a sharp to save you? Have you at least tried?

If there you are two guys against 100 ZEDs and you're already running low on the excessive scar ammo I'm afraid you are either a spammer or your team sucks. And I don't think you should choose your equipment based on the assumption your team sucks, that's just silly.

If the team doesn't have at least one sharpshooter or medic with crossbow, then that is a similarly bad team isn't it?

For the last time, I'm not saying they are crap, I'm just saying they are way less powerful than Scar, and what's the point of carrying a weaker version of a weapon you already have, which has already enough ammo to go around.

That's what I've been saying, if you do your job as the commando you shouldn't have spare SCAR ammo. Carrying an extra assault rifle allows you to save up SCAR ammo for the few times where you need to full auto a scrake in the face or the like.

Well I beg the differ, as much as you like assault rifles and the commando itself, sooner or later you will encounter a situation in which the M32 is just ideal.

I actually think demo the perk itself is pretty bad, it produces too much smoke which kills the team's DPS. But that said, it has it's place because a demo 6 can kill a FP by emptying the M32. A commando can't, so it's all smoke for nothing.

 

[Evilsod]

I have played with many demos that just wasted grenades constantly on single zeds or smaller numbers of zeds that could easily be handled by a Commando (me at the time). Hell 1 time i was doing a Suicidal Offices with 3 demolitions on the team, the saving grace was at least i could see health bars. Was this the perks fault? No, merely the players using it. Demo is a great perk if the player knows its strength but alot just waste grenades in situations that its not required.

 

[YoYoBatty]

Weapons I use per veterancy;
Medic: MP7M + Katana + LAR/HandCannon + Dualies
Beserker: Katana + Crossbow
Support: Hunting Shotty/AA12 + Shotgun + (M79 + Pipebomb/ Dual handcannons)
Commando: SCAR + Bullpup/AK47 + MP7M
Sharpshooter: (LAR + Dual Handcannons + Duallies) / Crossbow + Handcannon
Demolitions: M79 + M32 + Pipebomb
Firebug: Flamer + Dual Handcannons

 

[Olivier]

Can we all stop to make 432 quotes and start using paragraphs?

 

[Unit-05]

Personally I love the ak47, set it to semi auto and use it how a m14 should be used and it is amazing.