Small ideas for bolt action rifles.

[Nicholas]

Since the K98 was generally a better made gun than the Mosin Nagant, I think it should be portrayed as slightly more accurate, while the Mosin Nagant should have the advantage of being sighted in with bayonets, and already have bayonets attached before going into battle, as was practice with the Russians.

Also with the leveling system, I want to see it where raw recruits start out with shinier cleaner rifles, and as you progress your rifle gets dirtier and more worn, hence making it harder to see.

 

[Extension7]

Since the K98 was generally a better made gun than the Mosin Nagant, I think it should be portrayed as slightly more accurate, while the Mosin Nagant should have the advantage of being sighted in with bayonets, and already have bayonets attached before going into battle, as was practice with the Russians.

Also with the leveling system, I want to see it where raw recruits start out with shinier cleaner rifles, and as you progress your rifle gets dirtier and more worn, hence making it harder to see.

Accuracy > Bayonets when spawned.

 

[Nicholas]

Accuracy > Bayonets when spawned.

But the Mosin Nagant is sighted in with bayonets, while the K98 is slightly more accurate but is less so with the bayonet on.

 

[Karabiner98k]

If the accuracy was done realistically would there be any noticeable difference in-game?

 

[I Faw Down]

If the accuracy was done realistically would there be any noticeable difference in-game?

No

 

[Krator]

Are you really sure that kar98k wasn't sighted with bayo on too?

I've heard that kar98k works smoother than mosin and german ammo is of noticeably better quality. So if pixel hunting is in game, I think there would be a little bit of a difference in accuracy if modeled realistically - sometimes you have to hit quarter of somebody's face at 100m.

 

[Flogger23m]

No

Pretty much. Even with this new zoom feature, I doubt people will be shooting past 300 meters very often.

 

[VariousNames]

I have no clue which firearm was more accurate,

but one thing is obvious, the Mosin has a longer barrel and a lighter bullet, ergo a faster muzzle velocity.

Would also be wobblier, with less recoil, given its increased weight.

 

[RedGuardist]

Are you really sure that kar98k wasn't sighted with bayo on too?

Yes. And that is because the German regulations did not dictate soldier to keep bayonet mounted virtually all the time. The Soviet regulations did.

Also the Mosin-Nagant rifles beginning from the M91 (which did not even have bayonet scabbard in accesories when it was introduced) were designed to be shot with bayonet mounted. Without the bayonet M91 and M91/30 are ill-balanced. On the other hand the K98k is perfectly balanced without the bayonet mounted.

 

[Chekhov]

my mosin rifle's shoot more accurate with the bayonet off,I never shoot with a bayonet fixed as the balance is heavy and akward.... In photos I see most Red Army rifleman during WWII without the bayonet fixed too,When they had the chance I think most soldiers removed that tent stake of a bayonet

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

No

At long range, 300+ m, there will be a noticable difference, esp. if the rifle mounts a scope.

The K98k is 1) made to tighter tolerances 2) features a heavier stepped barrel 3) features a more sensive trigger and 4) fires higher quality ammunition with a much higher ballistic coefficient (less affected by wind an other factors)

For the above reasons the K98k is the more accurate rifle, esp. during WW2 where it in general was feeded much higher quality ammunition than was the Soviet rifles.

Now below 300 meters, with iron sights, there probably wasn't any very noticable difference, but beyond that range the K98k definitely was a noticably more accurate rifle.

 

[Reise]

Yes lets continue talking like we were there and knew the differences between both rifles past 300m.

For the game's purposes there should be no differences. Both rifles were often well made and did their jobs. I'm not sure where this myth comes from that the Mosin Nagant is such a poor quality weapon. If you want a truly cruddy WW2 rifle, check out the Carcano carbines.

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

Yes lets continue talking like we were there and knew the differences between both rifles past 300m.

?? One only has to examine examples of both rifles from the period to see & understand the difference, you need not have been in the thick of it during WW2 to notice the differences in quality and construction of a weapon.

For the game's purposes there should be no differences. Both rifles were often well made and did their jobs.

I disagree, this game is about realism, and as such the difference should be modelled.

I'm not sure where this myth comes from that the Mosin Nagant is such a poor quality weapon.

Have you ever actually held or seen one? The craftmanship of a wartime Mosin isn't exactly what some would describe as 'good'. The Mosin was crudely made, one needs only take a close look at how the various parts were milled to see that. Add to this the very crudely made ammunition available to the Mosin during the war, and you've got yourself a recipe for subpar accuracy.

The Karabiner 98K on the other hand was amongst the best crafted rifles of the war, alongside rifles such as the Swedish M96 (Also made in Germany) and the Swiss Karabiner 31. In addition to this the Mauser was fed ammunition made to very high quality standards.

It all makes a difference, one that should be felt ingame if it is to call itself realistic.

If you want a truly cruddy WW2 rifle, check out the Carcano carbines.

Now that IS a myth, having shot several of these rifles I can tell you that the Carcano is definitely not as crudely made as the Mosin. And the Carcano is also a very accurate rifle, heck Kennedy was in the head by one whilst on the move in a car.

 

[Nicholas]

my mosin rifle's shoot more accurate with the bayonet off,I never shoot with a bayonet fixed as the balance is heavy and akward.... In photos I see most Red Army rifleman during WWII without the bayonet fixed too,When they had the chance I think most soldiers removed that tent stake of a bayonet

It must have been resighted in.

At long range, 300+ m, there will be a noticable difference, esp. if the rifle mounts a scope.

The K98k is 1) made to tighter tolerances 2) features a heavier stepped barrel 3) features a more sensive trigger and 4) fires higher quality ammunition with a much higher ballistic coefficient (less affected by wind an other factors)

For the above reasons the K98k is the more accurate rifle, esp. during WW2 where it in general was feeded much higher quality ammunition than was the Soviet rifles.

Now below 300 meters, with iron sights, there probably wasn't any very noticable difference, but beyond that range the K98k definitely was a noticably more accurate rifle.

Yes lets continue talking like we were there and knew the differences between both rifles past 300m.

For the game's purposes there should be no differences. Both rifles were often well made and did their jobs. I'm not sure where this myth comes from that the Mosin Nagant is such a poor quality weapon. If you want a truly cruddy WW2 rifle, check out the Carcano carbines.

So what I'm saying is that both these rifles should be mostly the same, just that the K98 should be a little more accurate at longer ranges, and the Mosin Nagant should spawn with and be sighted in with a bayonet.

Thus giving them slight advantages/disadvantages, and also supporting the fact that the Germans generally preferred long range and the Russians close range.

Germans = Slightly more accurate rifles, better LMG's, tanks with better optics.

Russians = Rifles catered to bayonets, better SMG's, tougher tanks.

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

Worth watching:
http://www.youtube.com/user/mag30th#p/u/37/rGOQ2oebB2M
http://www.youtube.com/user/mag30th#p/u/37/rGOQ2oebB2M

http://www.youtube.com/user/mag30th#p/u/10/YLOEt3yrcHM

 

[RedGuardist]

Have you ever actually held or seen one? The craftmanship of a wartime Mosin isn't exactly what some would describe as 'good'.

Yep. Emphasis on the word wartime. I think there

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

So what I'm saying is that both these rifles should be mostly the same, just that the K98 should be a little more accurate at longer ranges, and the Mosin Nagant should spawn with and be sighted in with a bayonet.

Thus giving them slight advantages/disadvantages, and also supporting the fact that the Germans generally preferred long range and the Russians close range.

Germans = Slightly more accurate rifles, better LMG's, tanks with better optics.

Russians = Rifles catered to bayonets, better SMG's, tougher tanks.

Agreed.

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

Yep. Emphasis on the word wartime. I think there

 

[Extension7]

Even if this WAS true with accuracy and all, I wouldn't like it.

Having the K98 with more accuracy does not match up to just simply having a bayonet when you spawn. They can just both attach it if they wanted to. I always do when I spawn.

Even if it was a regulation for Russians, it's not a fair balance for what you're giving the Germans.

 

[Unus Offa Unus Nex]

Balance should not be achieved through tweeking of weapons, but through numbers of reinforcements and map starting positions.

The point of this game is realism, esp. in the way the various weapons function & perform. If you go on a compromise with this in an effort to achieve equality on the battlefield at equal numbers, then you'd be throwing out the window the concept this game was all about to begin with.

If you want perfect weapon balancing then go play Call of Duty, or some other arcade shooter..

In RO:HOS the developers should strive to have the weapons perform as they do in real life, with all their advantages & disadvantages. Anything else will kill the whole point of the game for most fans of the series.