SdKfz 251 variants

[Teufel Hund]

Which variant of the SdKfz 251 would you most like to see added to the game?

 

[M_W]

If it is as brutal as in CMBB I vote for 251/21.

But this poll lacks of many variations as the 251/16 FT or the 20mm but this is a must thread.

 

[Saturnalia]

I'd for the 75mm L26, based on the lack of penetration by rounds currently. Most tanks don't bother to load HE rounds, which is something that this variant could provide. I think that a mostly HE load would be appropriate, unless someone has other information.

 

[Teufel Hund]

If it is as brutal as in CMBB I vote for 251/21.

But this poll lacks of many variations as the 251/16 FT or the 20mm but this is a must thread.

Haven't the devs stated that they will not (or can not) add a flamethrower? That was why I didn't include the 251/16.

The 251/21 was very effective in a ground support fire role (and I even found a pic of it being used in such a role). I've taken out entire companies with it in CMBB.

I left out the 251/17 because it would require more of a change to the basic model in game (drop down side pannels in firing mode), and therefore it's less likely for us to see it. The others would be much easier to add from a modeling perspective. The 251/2 would probably be the easiest to add, since it would require the least modeling.

 

[[5.SS]Strother]

The 251/21 would certainly be the most fun and add the most HOLY **** moments into the game.

 

[M_W]

Yeah sweet weapon...chasing routed troops I ve done half batallion casualties. But remember its only avaivable on late war and only on certain months of 44...I think its a variant with very few unit released. I think the 20mm is more common...anyway the main purpose of both were AA duties and in this game can be Anti-Infantry...but as the game is limited to 32 players I think its too powerfull unless they rise the limit.

 

[SchutzeSepp]

i bet this poll is because of my comments on the update forum huh?

why don't people pick the most powerfull ( 251/22) or isn't it? such vehicles could lead to nice infantry battles without having those annoying tanks ruling the field, plus it could make the sdkfz 251 actually "USEFULL"!

 

[2M|Bivoj]

251 with 75mm L24 would be nice infantry support vehicle.

 

[Teufel Hund]

Yeah sweet weapon...chasing routed troops I ve done half batallion casualties. But remember its only avaivable on late war and only on certain months of 44...I think its a variant with very few unit released. I think the 20mm is more common...anyway the main purpose of both were AA duties and in this game can be Anti-Infantry...but as the game is limited to 32 players I think its too powerfull unless they rise the limit.

I'm fairly sure that the 15mm version was the most common, they used the old guns aquired when the Luftwaffe switched to 20mm and mounted them in a modified naval pedastal. It's my understanding that they were used primarily in the ground fire role in spite of having been originally designed for low altitude anti-aircraft support. In the 45th Panzer Division every armour reconnaissance group and every company in the panzergrenadier battalions was equipped with 3 units. So I'm not sure how rare they were. I couldn't find any production numbers.


It probably would be overkill in this game... But it would be so much fun to use

Nothing like a squad of Russians coming around a corner to find one of these sitting at the end of the street... although at 700 rounds per minute, it wouldn't take long to go through the 2000 rounds it carries.

 

[Teufel Hund]

i bet this poll is because of my comments on the update forum huh?

why don't people pick the most powerfull ( 251/22) or isn't it? such vehicles could lead to nice infantry battles without having those annoying tanks ruling the field, plus it could make the sdkfz 251 actually "USEFULL"!

In a combined arms battle with no tanks around, the sdkfz 251/21 would be the most powerful by far. Three 15mm guns firing HE rounds at 700 rounds per minute is some serious firepower against infantry and light vehicles.

The 251/22 is just a mobile anti-tank gun. I don't think it even carried very many HE rounds. The 251/9 was designed for infantry support fire.

 

[M_W]

Anyway....as we cant penetrate thin trees, wood fences or crappy building the power of the weapon as well of the tanks is relative. I still feel that nowadays in RO Tank and Light Armoured vehicles is unconnected to the infantry battle. And the sad thing is that if they were connnected the need of making the game 64 or even 128 players could be obvious.

 

[ROMMEL34]

Sd Kfz 251/21
Crew: 4-6
Armament: Three 15 mm MG 151/15 or 20 mm MG 151/20.
Ammunition: 2,000
This anti-aircraft vehicle was created by mounting three heavy machine cannon from fighter aircraft on a pedestal. Each gun was fed by belt from a seperate ammunition box. The rate of fire was 700rpm. Production of the Sd Kfz 251/21 commenced in August 1944.
From: Encyclopedia of German tanks of World War Two

 

[Field Marshal Rommel]

You forgot the Sdkfz 251/1 Wurfrahmen40:

Crew of 7. Had 2 MG34s or MG42s. Had 5: 28cm Sprengranate (HE round) and 1: 32cm Flammgranate (incendiary round). After France in 1940 J. Gast KG, Berlin were ordered to create a projector for the Wurfger

 

[RoclorD]

Actually I would like to see them all

 

[SchutzeSepp]

when i was commanding my battlegroup in the ardennes ( in close combat V ofcourse ) i particularilly enjoyed using the /22 variant in ambush as a mobile pak gun. and when there was no enemy armor left it completely ruled the battlefield supporting the infantry from a safe distance keeping the enemy down with its mg... its only enemy were 50 cal mg's AT guns, but its biggest threath was mortar fire...
any of its variants could be a great input into infantry maps, at least when its not infinately available. 1 per battle, if it gets destroyed you don't get a new one

 

[Teufel Hund]

You forgot the Sdkfz 251/1 Wurfrahmen40:

I didn't forget it, I just feel it's not appropriate. 28cm HE and 32cm incendiary rockets are way outside the scope of this game. In addition it also had a minimum range of 300m.

It's a mobile artillery piece and really has no place in a tactical level game.

I also left out:
SdKfz 251/3 - wireless vehicle
SdKfz 251/4 - ammunition carrier for le.I.G. (light infantry gun)
SdKfz 251/5 - engineer (troops) vehicle
SdKfz 251/6 - command vehicle
SdKfz 251/7 - engineer (equipment) vehicle
SdKfz 251/8 - armoured ambulance
SdKfz 251/11 - telephone vehicle
SdKfz 251/12 - survey section instrument vehicle
SdKfz 251/13 - sound recording vehicle
SdKfz 251/14 - sound ranging vehicle
SdKfz 251/15 - flash spotting vehicle
SdKfz 251/16 - flame throwing vehicle
SdKfz 251/17 - 2cm Flak (Sf.)
SdKfz 251/18 - observation post vehicle
SdKfz 251/19 - telephone exchange vehicle
SdKfz 251/20 - infra-red searchlight vehicle

 

[george]

Because Telephone service and InfraRed is soooo important in RO...

 

[Teufel Hund]

Because Telephone service and InfraRed is soooo important in RO...

Well, I'm sure the 251/20 with an infrared searchlight would be great for night battles. But then we'd need the Panther with the FG1250 IR Scope. Then people would complain because the Russians would have no chance at all...

Remember that the Germans were using IR scopes as far back as 1934, and used them in combat in limited numbers back in 1939. But it wasn't until 1944 that they started getting serious about it. But like so many of the incedible technological advances they made, by the time they decided to get serious about using it, it was too late to make enough of a difference.

 

[mat69]

There is not really a sense in adding IR without adding flares.
Tanks are very loud so you can not use that well during an attack because the defenders would use flares to light the area up.

 

[SchutzeSepp]

i heard that sherman tanks would have two blue flames coming out of their exhaust when driving at night... so the germs could easilly pick them out!