So what are you trying to say? Some guy says one is hard pressed to miss with hipfire at 25 (which is absolute bs to be honest), I say I have seen people who shoot thousands of rounds miss aimed shots at 5m.
You don't believe me or what?
remove ability to hip-fire while circle strafing
- Thread starter realninja
- Start date
So what are you trying to say? Some guy says one is hard pressed to miss with hipfire at 25 (which is absolute bs to be honest), I say I have seen people who shoot thousands of rounds miss aimed shots at 5m.
You don't believe me or what?
Wait, there is no conefire in this game is there? They wouldn't do that would they? Or do you mean they go everywhere because the weapon is moving so much due to free aim?
The thing is that you wont be running around like a headless chicken and shoot people from the hip in a war. That's the best way to die though.
Just try it. Get yourself a PPSH, run into a place where you might see Germans at close range, then sidestep while spraying from the hip. You might be hitting him in the arms and legs but he will probably kill you and bandage up. Standing still and bringing up the ironsights when running into someone at extremely short range massively improves your chances of winning the close encounter. The bobbing of the gun while sidestepping seems to affect the aim a lot.
If I'm moving sideways while spraying from the hip it's like tossing a coin. If I stop and bring up the sights while my opponent is spraying it is probably around 80% certain that I am going to kill him first.
I believe you, but I haven't bought it yet. It sounds like conefire, so I wanted to be sure it wasn't. RO1 has free aim with no cone fire, is this the same way?
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Poor booboo, have you considered melee? i heard it helps in CQC, or perhaps take out a pistol, also an option you have.
On a hipfire, serious note:
Unless you have some serious problems with eye-hand coordination, you can hit at 50 yards (~50 meters) from the hip. If you dont believe me, ask someone who owns firearms to let you go with them to an open range. I'm able to hit at 50 yards from the hip with AK, quick fire with spread about half a meter in diameter. Granted, that isnt full auto, but it's a burst, and thats REAL.
If you want to argue anything, argue the fact that hipfire weapons should have much more recoil than the ones against your shoulder (which is true). But don't say that hip-fire while strafing is unrealistic.
Reality: Get your head out of the computer game, and imagine someone standing and pointing an 8mm round in your face, and you have nothing to hide behind, nor protect yourself with. What will be your first reaction? Will you continue to stand still as they go to pull that trigger? Most likely you will be trying to "dodge" the bullet.
Now apply logic, whats the best way to "dodge" a bullet at such distance? Correct, force the person to do tasks that will decrease their ability to aim. So probably rather than moving directly up to them, you will be moving in a spiraling motion to get close to them while demanding from them to turn their whole body to continue aiming at you, right?
Now that we've established the reality of it, we give you ... lets start with paintball gun, fairly low recoil (especially compared to firearms).
Will you just run with this paintball gun in your hands, or will you take a chance, even though most likely you will miss, to shoot at the person?
If it's me - you can be 200% sure i will be running and gunning, you just caught me in a life threatening situation.
Now we swap out that paintball gun for a real sub-machine gun. What are you going to do? Will you run with gun in one hand to increase your running speed, or will you run a bit slower and spray the threat with your gun into the widest part of their body?
^^^ Your answer to this thread lies there
Just reduce PPSH's accuracy at long distance so it would never come close to rifle.
I don't mind PPSH spraying in CQC. It was designed for that.
But in a respectable range, the spray bugs the crap out of the rifle aim and you're as good as dead.
It's life or death and at that range I would prepare to die and aim down the sight with rifle regardless of whether bullets are whizzing 2 feet away from me.
I'm talking at range of 20 meters or so
I don't mind PPSH spraying in CQC. It was designed for that.
But in a respectable range, the spray bugs the crap out of the rifle aim and you're as good as dead.
It's life or death and at that range I would prepare to die and aim down the sight with rifle regardless of whether bullets are whizzing 2 feet away from me.
I'm talking at range of 20 meters or so
Woah woah... PPSh has sh%t for accuracy. Leave the damn gun alone. Only thing it's good for is the spray and pray, and believe me, you're praying even when you're shouldering and sighting the damn thing. Because most of the time, you will miss. I am lvl 32 with it, and i end up dying to MP40's sniping me from 100+ meters, when i cant even land a hit on them at that distance.
So you wanna tune down SMG - go after German weapons
That's not my experience at all. I've been sniped with PPSH at 100+ range and harassed at 50+ range. When you burst fire with PPSH, the accuracy is just sick.
I've used the autos and it's just too easy.
What's especially annoying is when I lay low to scan the area and I get sniped by a PPSH. Just a simple 'doo doo doop' and I'm dead. I can't even see muzzle flash or determine the direction of the bullets.
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Believe it or not, the -real- PPSh is effective (as in both accurate and lethal) out to 150m:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPSh-41
RO1 had a stupidly unrealistic depiction of SMGs as uncontrollable bullet fountains. I felt like Charlie Chaplin wrestling with an out-of-control fire hose.
And maybe you can't hear the direction of the bullets or see the muzzle flash because he's firing in short, controlled bursts, and he didn't fire before the killshot?
We need bigger maps. Plain and simple. CQC is dangerous and fast, and a lot of people aren't liking it.
I have exact opposite experience, while i have killed someone at 108m with ppsh, it's such a rare event for me, i've even screenshotted it. I control my shots to have 2-3 shot bursts, and still, PPSh climbs up insanely quick even with those 2 shots.
While you take that MP40, and you can snipe with it, all... day... long.... I have been killed by MP40 at 190meters. (i shoot him with SVT, and he takes my head off with MP40, simultaneously)
On side note - how can you say you're killed by it at 100+ meters when you admit you dont hear it?
So lets not put any crazy idea's on nerfing Russian weapons any more, than they already are (compared to German)
Citing youtube videos (even wildly popular ones like FPS Russia, I even have a t-shirt from him LOL) doesn't make what you say true. In fact, the opposite is true. Police firearms training includes all sorts of information and research on just how hard it is to hit a CQB target when both target and shooter are moving in an intense situation. It is more likely to fire 8 or 10 and one case I know of 18 shots (reloaded a magazine) and not hit a person less than a street away. Armed forces training is a bit different but they learn the same thing, just a lot more practice creates more muscle memory etc etc....
In real life, it is very hard...in game not so hard, but the answer is not to dumb down the game to solve what is a player problem. Just circle the opposite direction. The answer in this game is as always, to think outside ones own box.
If you keep getting killed, don't keep doing the same thing. My answer to the circle strafe is to circle the opposite way, in effect making both the guy shooting at me and me move in a parallel line, much easier to counter and shoot him then.
Sitting in the circle and trying lead and shoot the circle strafer will just get you killed.
I think the point is that in life threatening situation, you will do anything in your power to increase your chances of survival, by most likely attempting to do both, lower chances of being hit, while trying to shoot the enemy.
Hip fire seems to be the optimal trade off, between speed to avoid being shot, and semi-existing accuracy.
Reason why you cant bring police/swat/etc into the conversation - generally they are entering the territory on their terms. Whereas in this particular situation, you have to get across the street under fire... you are sure as hell aint going to get across that street while looking down the sights slowly "tactical walk"ing it with bullets wizzing by.
Hip fire seems to be the optimal trade off, between speed to avoid being shot, and semi-existing accuracy.
Reason why you cant bring police/swat/etc into the conversation - generally they are entering the territory on their terms. Whereas in this particular situation, you have to get across the street under fire... you are sure as hell aint going to get across that street while looking down the sights slowly "tactical walk"ing it with bullets wizzing by.
Agree. If a guy headshots you with a PPSh at 80m and out, it's only because he fired five or ten other bullets that missed. It's like the aimpoint starts climbing even before the first bullet leaves the barrel. Even with two-round bursts and firing from an elevated position down at a guy behind a car at 70-80m, it still took three bursts to hit him.
That's why I use the AVT whenever I play as Assault nowadays — the PPSh is useless in open battle.
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It is a well known fact that hitting is extremely difficult:
"Over the past 10 years, city cops fired 4,702 bullets, accidentally pulled the trigger 323 times, and missed 78 percent of their intended targets, according to data The Post culled from a decade's worth of NYPD annual firearm-discharge reports. "
<a href="http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/oh_shoot_cops_fire_off_target_ZqMbx38FZnt4GWaaGWJBfN" target="_blank">http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/oh_shoot_cops_fire_off_target_ZqMbx38FZnt4GWaaGWJBfN
IIRC average shoot-out distance for NYPD was in the neighbourhood of couple of meters, not more. I wonder how could they miss, since I am so good in RO2? Maybe real world is more difficult?