RedOktober not designed well

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DingDong09

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 4, 2011
74
102
0
This map is just plain bad, the Russians get a mere 10 minutes lockdown to take the first cap, but get this:
Once you take the cap you then have to deal with all the entrenched Germans in it. This really slows down momentum as capturing a point is essentially meaningless. I was on a very good team as assault and my job wasn't so much to assault as to simply keep points clear of enemies because after a capture there would be so many left over. This really ruins the momentum of the gameplay and also makes it so assault soldiers become security guards. This is very bad for gameplay since the timer would suggest you wouldn't have time for this nonsense but it ends up absorbing all of my time since the rest of my team needs to get the next 2 objectives to get 5 minutes back.
 
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Kipper

Kipper

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 25, 2006
707
114
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Connecticut, United States
If you can take the first two objectives as the Soviets the Germans usually have a hard time regrouping and mounting an effective defense until the last objective. Go fast and hard early on and make sure to push the right flank of the first objective with automatics. You can catch the Germans in a crossfire and roll up their line.
 
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DingDong09

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 4, 2011
74
102
0
I think it's just plain boring, I think what should happen is that the moment objective A is taken the German team instantly respawns right on C and are ready to defend the next 2 objectives. This way we keep up a nice sense of momentum.
 
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Westernesse

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 11, 2011
406
68
0
mowskwoz said:
My only complaint on this map are the German spawns. It's frustrating to spawn in Moscow just to have to run all the way back to Stalingrad.
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Actually something I used to love on this map is the cap zones don't go instant protected like some maps. For instance sometimes I've been in C lost it and not been killed and spent the next 5 minutes mowing down Russians going to D. I've mostly played Russians lately though. The spawns work ok for germans imo and are needed for game balance. Russians are usually running longer to get on the objective than the germans.
 
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DingDong09

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 4, 2011
74
102
0
Westernesse said:
Actually something I used to love on this map is the cap zones don't go instant protected like some maps. For instance sometimes I've been in C lost it and not been killed and spent the next 5 minutes mowing down Russians going to D. .
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Yeah this is why people like me get left behind to mop people like you up, it ruins the momentum - instead of me assaulting the next position it's me killing people like you on old objectives. It ruins the gameplay.

In real life you wouldn't have to be in such a huge rush and an objective wouldn't be considered secure until every last enemy in it was eliminated. By allowing you to take an objective but then having to clear it as well you ruin the motion of the battle. Once an enemy losses an objective it needs to be the end unless they can take it back, if they can't then they need to be cleared off of it.
 
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Westernesse

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 11, 2011
406
68
0
DingDong09 said:
Yeah this is why people like me get left behind to mop people like you up, it ruins the momentum - instead of me assaulting the next position it's me killing people like you on old objectives. It ruins the gameplay.
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Well I think its unique to this map, but it can actually lead to a huge attacker advantage if your lucky because Germans are stuck on the last objective which they can't retake and you don't have to run through it from your new spawn on the way to the next objective. D and E often fall really easily for me as Russians because a substantial number of Germans are inside of C, but instead of shooting out towards D or E or the spawns are focused on hiding there and killing Russians that wander inside to kill them.

Goten said:
You really played this map ?
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At least 10 times on each side.

Well it depends on how you assault the points and which points your considering. For instance I was thinking of Russians have A and are attacking C. They spawn before A have to run through A and can get on C somewhat quickly if they spawn right flank, but have to run way further if they spawn left flank and attack C left flank (which a lot of Russians do in pub games). Compare this to the Germans who spawn in E/Just beside D and have to run to the back of the C building to get there. It seems like german run is a bit shorter especially vs rushing taking the slower route, but still attacking a valuable flank. You also have to consider that Russians are much more likely to not be able to take the most direct route due to germans sitting on it. I'll quickly outline which team I think gets to a cap point quicker off the re-spawn.

A - Russians (Should be true for attackers on every map)
B- Russians
C - Germans
D - Germans
E - Pretty even
F - Pretty even
G - Germans
 
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Goten

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 1, 2011
432
230
0
If I have time and remember I'll screenshot every spawn on both sides. Trust me, german spawns are further and it's logical: they are the defending team. Now it's a discussion how much closer/further can they spawn ... I'll not get into that ... for now at least.
 
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Westernesse

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 11, 2011
406
68
0
Goten said:
If I have time and remember I'll screenshot every spawn on both sides. Trust me, german spawns are further and it's logical: they are the defending team. Now it's a discussion how much closer/further can they spawn ... I'll not get into that ... for now at least.
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Maybe your right if its measured strictly as the crow flies, but like I said where the germans can run directly into say the back of G (never died getting there except to arty) Russians cannot just run into G, unless they practically have it capped. Now where this gets muddled is Germans usually don't need to just get into G, but rather they need to be on the south side of G which adds a good more distance of running.
 
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Goten

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 1, 2011
432
230
0
Westernesse said:
Maybe your right if its measured strictly as the crow flies, but like I said where the germans can run directly into say the back of G (never died getting there except to arty) Russians cannot just run into G, unless they practically have it capped. Now where this gets muddled is Germans usually don't need to just get into G, but rather they need to be on the south side of G which adds a good more distance of running.
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"As the crow" flies is valid for every map on this game, on both sides. I don't calculate (and it's also impossible) the spawn distances by the time you need to "secure" that route.

I don't get it: you have shorter distances and now you also want them more secure ? And the other team is playing for what ?

If you talk specifically about G, let me tell you axis can still die before reaching the cap zone.
 
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Icey_Pain

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 8, 2011
706
304
0
I don't really have any significant problems with Red October factory, though the lack of momentum seems to plague this map a little bit. It's a difficult map to play in, though that doesn't stop me from enjoying it.
The lockdown timer is just barely enough after the first few objectives but it usually gets down to the tanks being able to support the advance.
They are really a terrifying presence on that map.
 
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