I do too, but it seems that the people that are capable of doing a good job don't browse the ideas forum.
Redesigning the "Gunslinger" idea
- Thread starter Aze
- Start date
I do too, but it seems that the people that are capable of doing a good job don't browse the ideas forum.
The gunslinger perk is redundant. It's like the old Sharp Shooter and the commando had a baby. I will play by the OP's rules and post how it could be implemented.
1)recoil reduction and reload bonus for pistols
2)damage and rate of fire increase ONLY during zed time (all weapons)
3)greatly increase ammo capacity for pistols
4)head shots landed have a much greater chance of triggering zed time.
5)discount on ammo only
The numbers would have to be worked out. This class would mainly be for fun as it adds nothing new to whats already available. If gunslinger is too "American" for you, call the class "pistolero" for some spanish flavor.
1)recoil reduction and reload bonus for pistols
2)damage and rate of fire increase ONLY during zed time (all weapons)
3)greatly increase ammo capacity for pistols
4)head shots landed have a much greater chance of triggering zed time.
5)discount on ammo only
The numbers would have to be worked out. This class would mainly be for fun as it adds nothing new to whats already available. If gunslinger is too "American" for you, call the class "pistolero" for some spanish flavor.
And the firebug is like a cross between commando and support. Point?
The classes play different. Recall the time when the back damage bug wasn't fixed. The medic and berserker had similar strenghts. Zerker was redundant and passed over for the superior medic. After the balance zerker had his niche(plus more:IS2
. I don't feel the Gunslinger is adding new play mechanics. It is like suggesting a M-16 for commando. I still suggested a idea to make it work like the OP asked. 
Honestly I think a perk SPECIALIZING soley in using dual weapons is kinda silly.
I can understand a perk that uses and is better with dualies, but a perk based around seems kind of a waste.
What I was thinking was aclass that can use dual pistols/pistols well but having that as a back up/secondary edition and making a more intel/leader based position.
They 'could' get that tracer dart mentioned in another thread but primarily they'de have another tool in their arsenal (not a heart beat monitor) but something that allows them to detect if something big has popped up globally (in a large area) and to detect locations of bigger things and or crawlers locally.
This way they'de be able to prepare a team for an FP/multiple scrakes/etc before most teams even notice one. On top of that, so HoE teams don't lose a whole ****load of DPS loss having one guy that essentially has low damage and is just for damage, he could be able to some how amplify damage to one thing (and one thing at a time).
Sorry if it seems like i'm derailing but i'm just putting the idea out that dual pistol/pistol specialization in most games tends to be a side benefit and there is a bigger primary role, which is why they are given lesser weapons. You can completely disregard whatever I said but I stress that dual pistols shouldn't be the primary use of a class that they are perked to.
I can understand a perk that uses and is better with dualies, but a perk based around seems kind of a waste.
What I was thinking was aclass that can use dual pistols/pistols well but having that as a back up/secondary edition and making a more intel/leader based position.
They 'could' get that tracer dart mentioned in another thread but primarily they'de have another tool in their arsenal (not a heart beat monitor) but something that allows them to detect if something big has popped up globally (in a large area) and to detect locations of bigger things and or crawlers locally.
This way they'de be able to prepare a team for an FP/multiple scrakes/etc before most teams even notice one. On top of that, so HoE teams don't lose a whole ****load of DPS loss having one guy that essentially has low damage and is just for damage, he could be able to some how amplify damage to one thing (and one thing at a time).
Sorry if it seems like i'm derailing but i'm just putting the idea out that dual pistol/pistol specialization in most games tends to be a side benefit and there is a bigger primary role, which is why they are given lesser weapons. You can completely disregard whatever I said but I stress that dual pistols shouldn't be the primary use of a class that they are perked to.
That's actually a good idea too. And it gives me more ideas haha! There was a guy way back who had an idea for a new perk, called "Survivalist", who could have some kind of detection/minimap ability, including seeing weapons/armor/ammoboxes on the minimap. I guess that could work (in top of detecting big threats) for a pistolbased intel-perk?
And about the tracer dart (which i think is a neat idea and which i think fits the perk if it has something of a name like "Agent") i agreed that only one dart can be put out per person, and also that they do NOT stack if you shoot more than one on the same target.
About this tracer dart, how about these small ideas:
* It has some kind of electrical device on it, shooting small electric shocks in the target (displayed by having teeny, tiny lightnings sometimes eminitating from the dart over the targets body)
* It slows the target down as much as flame does (20%)
* It makes the target more visivle somehow (Aura a la Left 4 Dead?)
* It eminates a distinct beeping noise, thus you also hear if the target gets closer / runs away
* It gives a small damage boost (5%?) to all attack on that target.
Is that good enough? Should it provide with something more, intel-wise?
Just wanna say, before anything else, this was a very nice, thorough and constructive response, which makes me really impressed due to this being your FIRST time posting! Big thanks man!
All good points. These are only example numbers though, keep that in mind
But yes, i agreed that they might possibly be too high. 70% discount is what most perks get though, and the discount could apply to all pistols except maybe the cheapest ones (like buying Dual 9mm, doesn't really need a discount...)? But, yes, all the numbers needs a careful look ofc, agreed.I understand your concern, but with a low number like 15%, i don't think it's that much of a problem. The Sharpshooter has the 50% general headshot bonus, and do you see lots of people running around as that perk with tons of different offperk weapons? I guess not, and it has to do with the lack of reloadspeed, ammobonuses etc, so it won't be too much to worry about.Personally, I do not think is bad idea. Only thing I personally feel is that it should be perk weapon only. I have the feeling that if its general, it could create another medizerk type thing. We do not want to give noobs the wrong idea do we?
If it DOES prove a problem, it could be changed from general to perkweapons only ofc.
Actually, no?
All this does (or, is intented to do) is that if you and another person are shooting at a target, your shoots are less noticed by the enemy, and the enemy still focuses on your other teammate, allowing you to attack them in the back.
You mean that the weapons are equally accurate when hipfiring as when ironsighting? That's intended (as far as i know at least).
Interesting PoV. However, i actually only thought that the recoil bonus would be "huge". The others would be lower, like 20%-ish reload speed and movement speed. So you would still only be reloding one weapon during ZED time, it's not meant to be a ridiculous boost xD
About the berserker/commando + "agent", you could already do that with those 2 previous perks... Also, the autofire in ZED time doesn't mean that you get a boost in RoF, you just get your MAX RoF by holding down the button, rather than having to click that fast manually.
Hehe, to compress it, i understand, numbers popping up (ESPECIALLY if it's provided by the tracer) is a BAD idea
It was just an idea of what the Intel-bonus could do *shrugs*I would definitely say that the Tracer should have limited ammo, as that encourages to save it for bigger enemies. Also, one person can only have one dart active at a time. So, there can max be 6 darts on enemies, and that is only if all 6 players each have a tracer pistol. (Will add these things to the initial post
)EDIT: Hmmm but wait, if only one dart can be active per person (which limits its spammability), it could actually use unlimited ammo in form of recharging... no?
Once again, it was just an idea. And autopistols, while they DO overlap a bit with the Commando, the Commando is more about assault rifles and big SMG's. The Agent would be more around pistols and autopistols (aka, very small SMG's). So, meh. Still just an idea among others, to make the weapon a bit varied. Besides the perk is supposed to be kinda versatile (but ofc still weaker than the direct perks). You could say that the weapons are like this:
Handcannon = Shotgun (cuz of the power + piercing)
Autopistols = Assault Rifle (cuz of the automatic fire)
Revolver = Sniper Rifle / Crossbow (cuz of the power / low ammo / possible scope / piercing)
Tracer pistol = Flamethrower (cuz of its possible electric dot + slowing debuff)
And yes, the Revolver would be something like that (6 shots and very likely with penetration)
EDIT: Also, the Autopistols doesn't need to be fullauto, they could also just be shooting 3-round-bursts?
That could ofc work too. The reason i didn't say dual 9mm is because it's a tier 0 item weapon (like the Syringe, Welder, Handgrenades and Knife), because it's a starting weapon. The spawn "system" is that, generally, at level 5 you start with your tier 1 weapon (which the Mk23 would fill well) and at level 6 you start with your tier 2 weapon (which the HC would fill well). That's why i suggested that
Hahaha! I actually thought of that at first, but then i was like "nah, i don't think it would be liked" lol xD
And that would be level 3
Thanks again. This was really constructive advice
Please feel free to comment more
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Well alot of perks ALREADY overlap a lot, so i don't really see the harm...
Piercing exists in Sharpshooter (Xbow + HC), the Support's shotguns and the Firebug's flamethrower.
Full auto exists in LOTS of perk's weapons (MP7, AA12, Flamethrower, MAC10), not only the Commando.
Medic + Berserker = Both have faster runspeed and bloat-resistance.
Sharpshooter's dual weapons and M14 + Commando's weapons = Spammy kind of weapons
and so on...
New and interesting ideas. Good thinking!
But we are not in Spain are we?
Don't you think my name-idea, "Agent", is more generally fitting (helloooo James Bond! ) and has more room for making it more than just another damage perk? (as Agent, the federal kind, sorta makes you think of intel and espionage, no?)
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Agreed, I guess I was concern more about the stronger weapon if it can stun scrakes and what not.
Actually, no?
All this does (or, is intented to do) is that if you and another person are shooting at a target, your shoots are less noticed by the enemy, and the enemy still focuses on your other teammate, allowing you to attack them in the back.
Basically, when the FP only ran in a straight line to the targeted player. Other players could have jumped in between the FP and the player and creat a wall. I remember using this against the FP and made him stuck between the wall and me so he would get jammed in and pretty much he was helpless. Just do not want to recreate the cheap tactic that was fixed.
No, during ironsight and walking around, your aim is actually not being infected by moving around. Take a crossbow or M14 and try it. Aim down the sight with the crossbow and walk forward. You will notice that the scoop's image is actually not moving. Even with M14, the red dot will not move. True that this will make it hard to aim but, if it always aim at the center of the screen, whats the point?
Okay, I understand it now. Since the 9mm or HC does not really have a huge recoil (Looking from the old SS HC recoil reduction) this would benefit bigger weapon such as revolver?
Hehe, to compress it, i understand, numbers popping up (ESPECIALLY if it's provided by the tracer) is a BAD idea
I would definitely say that the Tracer should have limited ammo, as that encourages to save it for bigger enemies. Also, one person can only have one dart active at a time. So, there can max be 6 darts on enemies, and that is only if all 6 players each have a tracer pistol. (Will add these things to the initial post
EDIT: Hmmm but wait, if only one dart can be active per person (which limits its spammability), it could actually use unlimited ammo in form of recharging... no?
Let me just start off by saying I do like the tracer idea. I did not put that much negative thing so that I can shoot it down, rather to make it better.
I guess we need to keep one idea and trow the other. Ammo and make it stackable, with limited amounts that can be used. Or, recharge unlimited uses and not stackable. When I say stackable, I'm referring back to your original post saying that make it stronger when two are in one enemy. Personally, I would go with limited ammo. Then you will need to choose which one you want to tag. That should stop people from tagging a clot.
On another random note that I thought after my first post. Do you think its a good idea to give this perk bonus for the tracer? For example, medic gets a huge discount on the medigun vs none perked. I rather not see a berserker using it to scrake just to get a bonus damage. None perk gets like 2 sec vs level 6 gets like good 7 sec. (Random number I just thought from my head). Or maybe level 6 gets more damage bonus, etc etc. With those perk bonus, should make the chainsawing the patty even easier.
3 round bursts I can live with. Its not something new but at least unique in the KF world. Also, I think the tracer should do no damage. Assuming that if it has a damage boost bonus. That is already a extreme strength.
That could ofc work too. The reason i didn't say dual 9mm is because it's a tier 0 item weapon (like the Syringe, Welder, Handgrenades and Knife), because it's a starting weapon. The spawn "system" is that, generally, at level 5 you start with your tier 1 weapon (which the Mk23 would fill well) and at level 6 you start with your tier 2 weapon (which the HC would fill well). That's why i suggested that
I see your point and its a good one. Also, I just remembered something that dual weapon is not a good idea after all. When I was Level 5 SS back when KF (retail) was new. I remember SS got dual HC. (Side note, back then dual HC counted as shotgun damage) I would always give one of my HC to somebody. Now with this perk, is it a good idea? I have no idea, I guess it's one of those thing that needs to be tried out.
On the flip side, how about spawning with tracer and another pistol?
Hahaha! I actually thought of that at first, but then i was like "nah, i don't think it would be liked" lol xD
And that would be level 3
Well, I guess it could not hurt to speak out.
Thanks again. This was really constructive advice
No, thank you for reading my post. I'm rather enjoying this discussion then some of the other discussion I had with another forum.
Finally adding one thing to debate about.
To make coop part stand out more, why not make the tracer a level up requirement. Not just tagging but, how much damage is done to the player after tagging the enemy by ANYBODY in your team. If you want to you can solo it. Sure, it would take forever but then, this is a coop game.
In the tracer dart suggestion thread ( http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=50934&highlight=tracer ), it was already desided it would do no damage AND the damage multiplier wouldn't apply to the person who shot it.
Also, giving this perk bonuses for the tracer seems like a very good idea.
I think more ammo (6 non perk, 12 at lvl 6? +1 per level) and discount is enough. It should be like how the MP7 is generally only bought by medics and if some one wants one a medic can buy it for them and not like M79 price.
This would further encourage people to work together, and prevent some one drom dumping a ****load of money into a tracer unperked and taking away alot of money from the entire team's income.
Also, giving this perk bonuses for the tracer seems like a very good idea.
I think more ammo (6 non perk, 12 at lvl 6? +1 per level) and discount is enough. It should be like how the MP7 is generally only bought by medics and if some one wants one a medic can buy it for them and not like M79 price.
This would further encourage people to work together, and prevent some one drom dumping a ****load of money into a tracer unperked and taking away alot of money from the entire team's income.
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I don't feel the Gunslinger is adding new play mechanics. It is like suggesting a M-16 for commando
Aye, I understand your angle on that, but what is really wanted is for the GS to take advantage of ZED time, thus making it become the only class that does (extensions don't quite count). Of course, there are other alternatives.
I rather liked my rework of the Gunslinger (who doesn't like their own brand to be fair? ), but I won't repost it because I remember we've already argued the toss about it, and I don't think it would be appreciated dredging it up again
), but I won't repost it because I remember we've already argued the toss about it, and I don't think it would be appreciated dredging it up again
Glad you like it
And yeah, Agent can make you think of many things i guess *shrugs* But at least it doesn't remove the thought of a intel/spy-ish person dressed in a suit imo
Ok, i understand
Ah you mean that, well I don't think that would really happen. He would just be LESS likely to be attacked, not COMPLETELY removed from the Fleshpound's attackable targets.
Ahaaaa, i see! Well, i guess that is ALSO intended? What it DOES though, is that when you shoot while moving, your RECOIL goes way up the roof, and what does the Agent have as a general bonus?
Yup, thus he would still be the best run n' gunner ^^
For example yeah, but also to make sure that while dualwielding handcannons (for example) and utilizing the fullauto during ZED time, it would basicly just be "point and hold M1" for some easily aimed mayhem
Hmm ok. Well there are many ways to go with this:
Limited ammo - Agent gets more ammo
Unlimited ammo - Agent recharges much faster
Bonus damage - Agent provides a higher %
Cost - Agent gets a big discount (HUGE discount + huge baseprice if it has unlimited ammo, imo)
Stackable - Imo, no, would make it too strong. Or at least to a certain cap of bonus damage.
Okidoki. Personally, i see no problem with the tracer having a minimal electrical dot though
Starting with dual weapons might be too valuable (in terms of starting money), so i guess it's not fair to start with dual pistols? Meh
Oooooh, but i like that last thought a lot! Spawning with the Tracer seems like a great idea
Would you go with
A) Level 5 = Spawn with Tracer, Level 6 = Spawn with Tracer+OtherPistol
or
B) Level 5 = Spawn with OtherPistol, Level 6 = Spawn with OtherPistol+Tracer
No, no, it's my pleasure to discuss with you
Nice idea!
Level requirement 1 = Pistol damage done
Level requirement 2 = Tracer-dart bonusdamage done/provided (Meaning, whatever bonus damage you have provided, wether it's bonusdamage you yourself have done or your teammates has gotten from your darts, it adds to your levelling progress, making it a requirement that can be done solo AND by assisting your teammates!)
However it DOES sound like a little of a hassle to level, but it's still a good idea!
EDIT: The 2nd requirement could just be "Bonus damage done/provided", so you get progress if you
1) Shoot a tracer dart at a target and shoot at it yourself
2) Shoot a tracer dart at a target and someone else shoots it
3) You shoot a target in the back while playing the Agent (Since the perk has a backattack bonus!)
Would lessen the NEED to use the Tracer all the time, but would still be the fastest way
And who says those who discussed there make all the calls? Things can change.
Yeah stuff like that seems like the right way to go.
Thanks a lot guys (and girls?) for all the good ideas
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Okay, I'm just worried that if they get ignored, they can exploit it.
Ahaaaa, i see! Well, i guess that is ALSO intended? What it DOES though, is that when you shoot while moving, your RECOIL goes way up the roof, and what does the Agent have as a general bonus?
Yup, thus he would still be the best run n' gunner ^^
I did not know that, understood.
For example yeah, but also to make sure that while dualwielding handcannons (for example) and utilizing the fullauto during ZED time, it would basicly just be "point and hold M1" for some easily aimed mayhem
Okay, I think I understand. In that case I still vote for perk weapons only. Only because they can be using M14 or Scar, and THAT can be game breaking. But then, thats just in words and do not know what will happen if it was implied.
No stack, got it. But any bonus if there was two of this perk and both used the tracer on one target?
Starting with dual weapons might be too valuable (in terms of starting money), so i guess it's not fair to start with dual pistols? Meh
Oooooh, but i like that last thought a lot! Spawning with the Tracer seems like a great idea
Would you go with
A) Level 5 = Spawn with Tracer, Level 6 = Spawn with Tracer+OtherPistol
or
B) Level 5 = Spawn with OtherPistol, Level 6 = Spawn with OtherPistol+Tracer
I vote the second one. Only because I just do not see the reason tagging a clot. At the same time when you get to level 6, you get to save little money. Might not be much but, that little can help in HoE.
Nice idea!
Level requirement 1 = Pistol damage done
Level requirement 2 = Tracer-dart bonusdamage done/provided (Meaning, whatever bonus damage you have provided, wether it's bonusdamage you yourself have done or your teammates has gotten from your darts, it adds to your levelling progress, making it a requirement that can be done solo AND by assisting your teammates!)
However it DOES sound like a little of a hassle to level, but it's still a good idea!
EDIT: The 2nd requirement could just be "Bonus damage done/provided", so you get progress if you
1) Shoot a tracer dart at a target and shoot at it yourself
2) Shoot a tracer dart at a target and someone else shoots it
3) You shoot a target in the back while playing the Agent (Since the perk has a backattack bonus!)
Would lessen the NEED to use the Tracer all the time, but would still be the fastest way
I like that. In that case with the limited amount of ammo on the tracer, you can still increase the perk level.
I understand but, I think the idea is to encourage using the tracer. I think that it should have some kind of bonus. Only reason is that if the tracer only track the enemy, whats the point of using it? Might as will get on a mic or chat and say theres a big enemy coming. The bonus does not have to be anything big. It could be 1% damage increase. Its not big and ground breaking but enough to encourage team member to take out that enemy. Or it can be something like X% income increase. Again, that increase can be something very low that could or even could not make that much of difference. Also, the tracer can be like the Mac10. No perk means that its just another weapon with no bonus that does not ignite enemy on fire. With perk it does little damage and/or bonus.
If and only if, the tracer gives bonus to this perk, ammo count could be higher or no? You know, just encase they missed. Oh, that comes up with another question. Reload weapon or something like a crossbow or M79? I guess in simpler term, Magazine or one shot reload?
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Please DO post your ideas! I'm rather eclectic (in the positive mannerI rather liked my rework of the Gunslinger (who doesn't like their own brand to be fair?
), so i'd like to hear your ideas too ofc!I don't think there is much to exploit, especially not now when the FP has a better targetting system (bodyblocking is not as awesome as before, as the FP can retarget better now).
Once again, i understand the concern, but i would at least like to see how useful it would actually be with offperk weapons. After all, it's only in practice we can see wether it's OP or not. But ofc, if it proves to be too powerful, limit it to perkweapons only.
No selfstacking, no. Let's just hypothetically say the tracer gives 3% (as an agent level 6) damage increase on the target, it perhaps could stack up to 5% max, regardless of how many players shot darts at it?
I agreed on the second one too.
Exactly what i was thinking!
Because if you 100% needed the tracer all the time to level the perk, i think the perk would get quite boring actually. You can always level the 2nd requirement a little by shooting stuff in the back as an Agent, but it won't increase all too fast. Then, when the big enemies are coming out (Scrake/FP), you (or someone else) use the Tracer and then the levelling will be much easier with all your teammates and/or you shooting at the traced targets. The good thing about the Tracer is that it doesnt matter TOO much who shoots the dart, because everyone who shoots at the "tracered" target will receive bonus damage (and thus they level the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk!), just that the benefit will be quite a lot better if the dart is provided by an Agent
The biggest benefit of being the tracer-shooter is that you won't only get YOUR bonus when you shoot at it, but you increase the requirement with EVERYONE'S bonus damage on the target!
Example:
Player A shoots a tracer at a Fleshpound. Player A, B and C all shoot on the Fleshpound. Player A does a total of 50 bonus damage, player B does a total of 100 and player C only does a total bonus of 25.
Player B then gets +100 to the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk
Player C gets +25 to the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk
But Player A, who shot the tracer at the fleshpound gets 50+100+25 = +175 to the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk!
Imo, this is how i look at the Tracer Dart:
Offperk:
* Makes the target glow/beep for the duration (easy to spot)
* Lasts 7-ish secs
* Boosts damage by a very small amount (1-2%?)
* Does a small electrical dot
* Slows the target down by 10%
Perked:
* Makes the target glow/beep for the duration (easy to spot)
* Lasts 15-ish secs
* Boosts damage by a medium amount (3-6%?)
* Does a small electrical dot, boosted in damage by the perk's pistol damage bonus (= up to 60% more)
* Slows the target down by 20%
That makes it useable, but still sorta "meh", offperk. As an Agent though, it is very liked to have on the bigger targets.
Ammo count increase is probably not really necessary, imo, but it could work. And i think the reload fits using a one shot reload.
EDIT: Just had the craziest idea for the Electric Tracer Dart:
What if there was an altfire function which you could activate when a target has a dart on it. This secondary fire basicly causes the dart to overload its electrical power on the target, dealing a quite powerful but short electrical DoT at the cost of destroying the dart afterwards as well. This overload shock could last 3 seconds, and could slow down the bigger targets by 50% while stunning medium/small targets (if it doesn't kill them that is
)It could even be a "contagious" electric effect, where closeby specimen to the overload also get affected (although less ofc) by this shock. To further brainstorm: You can do this to darts that you have shot in the wall/ground too (making electrical traps etc) That would make the Tracer Pistol more flexible in use and not just a "tag big specimen"-weapon.
Remember, you can only have one dart out (If you shoot one more, the previous one is destroyed), so it's not like you can "pipebomb"-spam with it.
I guess it doesn't fit the game and all that, but just wanted to throw the idea out there anyway
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I'm all for this idea, I've been brainstorming and came up with some things
for one I don't think increased ammo for pistols would be a good idea because they are, as of now only 4 weight blocks. you would likely be able to carry around 3 sets of pistols along with your 9mm and tracer if it's 2 blocks. so you would have plenty of ammo.
if i could change the weight i would have it work out like this
duel 9mm = 2 blocks (4 blocks is ridiculous)
HC or dHC = 4 blocks
mk23 or dmk23 = 4 blocks
burst pistols = 6 blocks
revolver = 6 blocks
tracer = 2 blocks
weight hasn't really been mentioned so i thought i would just give you some place to start
my idea for the tracer is that it would have limited ammo but that it would be a single shot weapon with a reload time of 2 or 3 seconds. this way if 3 FPs come at your team you can tag them fast enough but still not spam tracers and unlike a medgun you would be able to fire more then 2 shots before having to wait 30 sec to recharge. (kinda what you already said)
along with the boosted damage, another bonus that the tracer can do is display the rage of the FP. the FP rages when it receives more then 320 damage between 3 to 5 sec intervals. if you had a meter above their head thats tells you how close you are to raging it. it would make dealing with them a lot easer. every one would be able to see the meter and would be able to kite it around the map better. and will still stay with the agent theme and "intel".
not sure if anybody thought about it but in the fight against the patty the tracer would be an excellent tool.
laser sights are a vary good idea but i would say they should only be for duel weapons otherwise you wouldn't really need them.
i like the burst pistol idea BTW (beretta M93)
and I like the name operative over agent, I can't hear agent and not think of travel agents or something.
I so want to play this perk
for one I don't think increased ammo for pistols would be a good idea because they are, as of now only 4 weight blocks. you would likely be able to carry around 3 sets of pistols along with your 9mm and tracer if it's 2 blocks. so you would have plenty of ammo.
if i could change the weight i would have it work out like this
duel 9mm = 2 blocks (4 blocks is ridiculous)
HC or dHC = 4 blocks
mk23 or dmk23 = 4 blocks
burst pistols = 6 blocks
revolver = 6 blocks
tracer = 2 blocks
weight hasn't really been mentioned so i thought i would just give you some place to start
my idea for the tracer is that it would have limited ammo but that it would be a single shot weapon with a reload time of 2 or 3 seconds. this way if 3 FPs come at your team you can tag them fast enough but still not spam tracers and unlike a medgun you would be able to fire more then 2 shots before having to wait 30 sec to recharge. (kinda what you already said)
along with the boosted damage, another bonus that the tracer can do is display the rage of the FP. the FP rages when it receives more then 320 damage between 3 to 5 sec intervals. if you had a meter above their head thats tells you how close you are to raging it. it would make dealing with them a lot easer. every one would be able to see the meter and would be able to kite it around the map better. and will still stay with the agent theme and "intel".
not sure if anybody thought about it but in the fight against the patty the tracer would be an excellent tool.
laser sights are a vary good idea but i would say they should only be for duel weapons otherwise you wouldn't really need them.
i like the burst pistol idea BTW (beretta M93)
and I like the name operative over agent, I can't hear agent and not think of travel agents or something.
I so want to play this perk
I guess its just one of those thing that needs to be tried out before coming to a conclusion.
Basically, pretty much only two person can stack it. I'm guessing the perk leveling will go pretty much the same way firebug would? Whoever ignite them first gets the level progress points?
Exactly what i was thinking!
The good thing about the Tracer is that it doesnt matter TOO much who shoots the dart, because everyone who shoots at the "tracered" target will receive bonus damage (and thus they level the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk!), just that the benefit will be quite a lot better if the dart is provided by an Agent
The biggest benefit of being the tracer-shooter is that you won't only get YOUR bonus when you shoot at it, but you increase the requirement with EVERYONE'S bonus damage on the target!
Example:
Player A shoots a tracer at a Fleshpound. Player A, B and C all shoot on the Fleshpound. Player A does a total of 50 bonus damage, player B does a total of 100 and player C only does a total bonus of 25.
Player B then gets +100 to the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk
Player C gets +25 to the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk
But Player A, who shot the tracer at the fleshpound gets 50+100+25 = +175 to the 2nd requirement of the Agent perk!
Honestly, I'm not really a big fan of other people leveling up. Only because it feels like people would be level 6 without knowing what this perk can do. At least even if you did not play medic and turn level 6, that means you did its job with another perk. That goes with other class. When I was playing medic I usually got the bullpup and killed stalkers while I healed others. It worked but, it took me a while what was the commando's job was since I did not really play the perk. I have the feeling that same thing would happen if everyone gains level just by shooting the enemy.
This is just my experience and do not know about others.
I'm pretty sure your giving numbers at this point but, slowing enemy could be little to strong. I personally do not know how much is 10% and 20% is. But I have the feeling we will go back to the days of the FP kiting. Sure, the ammo is limited but, if you just shot a raged FP, I'm pretty sure if your a berserker or a medic. You will get away far enough to do great damage.
Also, I am assuming that the perked tracer stats are level 6.
I guess ammo count should not be a big problem. It is suppose to be used on a bigger enemy. FP the scrake mainly I guess. Or there could be ammo that give bonus and recharge on alt fire that only makes the target glow or beep. Just like the MP7.
The Reload thing, I was thinking in the line of Metal Gear Solid's tranquilizer gun.
Its funny that the forum title is about the gunslinger but, more we talk about it, its becoming more of something else. I wish more people would join us and give their idea. This honestly could become a legit perk if it could work out some details.