• Please make sure you are familiar with the forum rules. You can find them here: https://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/index.php?threads/forum-rules.2334636/

Red orchestra in the future...

Oneshot: Your point is? While those facts are fine, that still doesn't cover the fact that a huge portion of people buy the shiny new toy the minute it is released and jump from game to game. My point is as it has always been about RO vs. CoD/MoH...instant gratification and "Me-ism". RO does not have a large community due to the stronger team centric play, slower pace, and non-me scoring. You demographics don't talk about how many games people play, how often they purchase, and how long do they play a particular game. Are they dedicated to community play, clans, etc?

In general, Americans as one demographic, are short-attention spanned, numb nuts who buy anything with a good sales pitch. Put sprinkles on dog crap and tell us it's better than chocolate and will enhance your manhood and it'll sell. Look at the people who bought the latest MoH game and still bought CoD4 and supported the lowest form of game developers. I stand by my "feeble minded" connotation.

Unfortunatly include many europeans as that one demographic, lets not single out americans even though i cant understand how red orchestra isnt bigger amoung americans maybe alot of it is because the americans arent in the game? hopefully dh will fix that problem.
I do agree though about alot of gamers having the attention span of monkeys who love repetitive and so called quick fix gaming, eg dust 24/7, danzig 24/7, halo etc.
Other thing is alot of people simply havent heard of ro something which is hard for a company like tw to influence.
 
Upvote 0
Oneshot: Your point is?

"Problem 2: Players are feeble-minded puds. For the most part, players have minimal attention spans and want the newest toy asap. The CoD/MoH type games cater to the larger audience because those games are mostly twitch shooters with immediate gratification. The general playing public is nothing more than ADHD kiddies who are more worried about their kill streak and personal penial enhancement than anything else."


Sorry but I disagree with your above statement. Just because some one may not play RO (which I thoroughly enjoy) and may choose to play other games, such as some of the MoH or CoD series (which I do as well) “imo” does not justify your above description of their players. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and this is mine.

My view is that gaming is about entertainment, and to each his own. Get tired of playing a particular platform, or you don’t view it as fun or challenging enough, find something else. Makes no difference to me what it's mass appeal is or how large an audience it attracts, although I would image it makes a great deal of importance to the developers. If I enjoy it, I play it, if not I don't. You do not have to support the platform, but what is to be gained by being critical of those whom do.

The “general” gaming community (both pc and console) is perceived in a rather bad light in society today. Why fuel this negative perception? I though the data from the ESA contradicted that perception, which I agree with, and put us all (gamers) in a more fair and accurate description, the point I was in fact trying to make.
 
Upvote 0
I think the problem is that people aren't discriminating enough consumers. Game companies have no incentive to make better games because they know people will buy crap, especially if that crap is part # of a series of games. Personally, I thought Quake 3 was crap, and didn't buy another Quake or Doom game after that (even though the engine was well done -- the game itself sucked and I didn't find any mods I liked). So I stopped buying Quake games. Same thing with BF1942 and BF2. I liked the first game. BF2 was godawful, though, and was really poorly managed and designed (despite some nice teamplay features).

Other people, however, are willing to throw good money after bad to chase that "high" they got with the first game in the series, or simply have far different standards from me. Game companies increasingly make shorter, smaller games with fewer content and replace said content with flashy eye candy and treadmill-style in-game rewards (IE: ranks, unlocks, stats, medals, whatever). To me, eye candy and treadmill crap is just to cover the fact that the game itself, at its core, is pretty lackluster or at least nothing all that special.

But the game companies know that, for now at least, they can put out Call of Medal of Battlefield 26 and people will buy it on brand-name alone (as long as the pre-release hype is good enough). So, to me, it's more the issue that people just buy games indiscriminately, or are satisfied with only getting maybe 1-3 months worth of enjoyment out of the game before they jump ship to the next shiny bauble that's been hyped up by some bought-and-paid-for gaming mag.

But the reason why? Not because they're ADHD, although it's tempting to level such a criticism. I think it's because they're desperate and have no other options. Or at least they don't perceive that they have other options. Basically, they're addicts. They're addicted to gaming, so they'll take whatever crap their pusher gives them because, hey, it's better than going without. This is why people continue to be suckered by super-happy-joy-joy previews and pre-release $5 discounts plus a snazzy pewter miniature if you just buy before the game goes gold.

What they really want is to be entertained the way they used to be entertained, and while they may gripe that they aren't getting it, they still buy. It's only in recent years that I've seen some of this turning around where friends of mine refuse to buy another BF series game, and the Quake series has gone from the bleeding-edge trend-setter to an also-(barely)-ran mediocre series (IE: ETQW).

The strange part is that there don't seem to be any signs that the gaming companies are feeling the pinch....yet. They aren't really trying to innovate with design, or to the extent they are, they're doing so with graphics and stats/unlockables. Those features keep people playing, but I think they also cause people to burn out eventually and become disgruntled. The MMO industry has, by and large, figured out how to stave this off -- with free periodic content releases followed by larger-scale expansions to give you more brass rings to shoot for. This keeps people hooked and keeps them blind to the fact that the actual game itself kinda stinks -- hey who cares if I've FINALLY gotten the last piece of armor in my Uber Paladin +25 Dragonscale armor suit!


So where am I going with this? Well, basically, I think the issue is that gamers aren't ADHD as much as they are easily fooled by simulated excitement. Game companies (including FPS makers now) have figured out that flashy visuals impress people and will get folks to pay for a game, so they tout them. Look how realistic that guy's eyelids are!! ZOMG!!!11! Likewise, they know that a game with otherwise lame mechanics can remain "fun" as long as you give someone a goal to work towards. It's not about the journey, after all, it's about the destination. So while I maybe absolutely sick to death of playing Karkand 24/7, I'll keep doing it if I can FINALLY get my gold knife badge. And when they release the platinum series of badges, guess what I'll start doing again. Never mind the fact that I view the whole thing as grinding. End result: games get boring, and gamers jump from game to game. The companies figure out how to string you along long enough to get you to buy the next shiny turd, and the cycle continues.
 
Upvote 0
I have not even looked at CoD4. I assume it is the same Quake fest, run and gun experience that the last game was. (This coming from an old COD2 player). the new games are designed for the console player with smaller maps and more kiddie like features. They are really not designed for PC players and have no appeal for me. I suspect that most serious RO players will tire of the kids pretty fast and ease back.

BF was a nice looking game, but the few times I watched it, the community was so full of children and the game just filled with cheaters and hacks that I had no interest in it.

Think I will stick with RO
 
Upvote 0
Solo went deeper on expanding my rant. Thanks because that is certainly the core issue. A large number of gamers want the quick fix and there really is no one to blame other than the royal "we" for buying B.S. after B.S. exactly as Solo points out.

I quit buying EA products on principle. And MoH:A proved me correct and I saved $50. I will never buy another product associated with Infinitely Waiting, based on principle as well. Until gamers start standing up for themselves, publishers/developers will continue to push crap and get rich doing it. We are the enemy. I just think, overall, American consumers are dumber than dog sh!t, don't care about quality, nor do they have a memory long enough to remember who last hosed them on a bad deal. It's just more of the same old every go round. You get what you pay for and you get what you justly deserve.

RO has a core problem of not be like every other Quake/UT spin-off. They have dared to be different and they will suffer for it with a crappy publisher who shorted them on marketing dollars; a modestly demanding community that is looking for more substance over flash; and a slew of wanna-be games that cater to the masses of ignorant, short-attention spanned, gratify me now-ers. It's the American way. How the hell are we paying $3.00+ for gasoline? Being dragged down by political b.s. day after day, and and doing anything about it? I could go on but I'm cranky enough already.

RO is dying. It is well over 18 months old. Other competition is out there and it has run it's course as a prime game. All games have/do/will in this genre. Now is the time the community needs to create the content that keeps the hard core players coming back. Once TWI releases the next game, hopefully it will be better marketed and the base community will be much larger and survive at a higher level longer.

Time will tell.
 
Upvote 0
I always played WW2 games so RO was a logical choice.

As Slyk said RO is 18 months old now and some people including myself
wanted to play another thing. One of the reasons i quit playing RO is already mentioned in this topic.

RO is known as a very team orientated game but all of this fades away when you play on a public server.
Most of the people run around like headless chickens trying to increase their kills.
While they totally forget that capping an area will give you even more points.
It annoyed me to much.

I was glad i did skip MoH Airboring. But bought COD 4 (my first non WW2 shooter)
The SP was the best i ever seen but i can't say i'm thrilled with the multiplayer part.
It's the same IW menu again and only nice when you play it 5 vs 5
And prefer bad spawns on shoebox maps.

Maybe someone will bring a better game mode to COD 4 otherwise i think i will leave that game soon.
COD 4 with RO gamemode would be nice.

Lucky for me my twin sons love the game, but hey they are almost 13 and
even they know how to play it. Which in fact is the main reason why
Infinity Ward's is succesfull. Everyone know how to play their games.

I tried to play some RO this week but i noticed playing two different games
cris cross made me nutts.

I sincerly hope Tripwire
 
Upvote 0
Maybe someone will bring a better game mode to COD 4 otherwise i think i will leave that game soon.
COD 4 with RO gamemode would be nice.

I hear the SDK for CoD4 will be hopefully released shortly. Why not you and Slyk and the other guys from the AHGN mode crew take up the challenge? With the talent you guys have if anyone could do it, and do it well, it would be the AHGN crew! Look at all the great content you added to RO:OST over the past 18 months. RO's impending death may have already passed if it weren't for the efforts of guys like yourselves, and all the other mappers/moders/coders/animators who have labored tirelessly so guys like myself can continue to enjoy this great platform! Thanks to you all for all you have done!
 
Upvote 0
Before calling the CoD and MoH monkeys (or whatever you throw in that pack) all sorts of names; Have you ever thought of the people that play those "quick fix" games simply because they have NEVER heard of games like RO?

I mean, hey, till RO made it to my gaming world years ago - which is a ****ing nice story with a ****load of coincidences - CoD was a ****ing great and amazing ww2 game to play...
 
Upvote 0
.......... lets not single out americans even though i cant understand how red orchestra isnt bigger amoung americans maybe alot of it is because the americans arent in the game? hopefully dh will fix that problem....

I would suggest if some Americans don't want to play Ro 'cos they don't feature in it then it's their problem rather than the game's -
but leaving that aside, rather than fixing any problems RO may have, surely it just means DH gets a load of parochial players?
 
Upvote 0
I hear the SDK for CoD4 will be hopefully released shortly. Why not you and Slyk and the other guys from the AHGN mode crew take up the challenge? With the talent you guys have if anyone could do it, and do it well, it would be the AHGN crew! Look at all the great content you added to RO:OST over the past 18 months. RO's impending death may have already passed if it weren't for the efforts of guys like yourselves, and all the other mappers/moders/coders/animators who have labored tirelessly so guys like myself can continue to enjoy this great platform! Thanks to you all for all you have done!

Thanks, Oneshot, for the compliments, but excuse the language when I say "NO FUKKING WAY WILL I EVER DO ANYTHING TO SUPPORT IW. EVER". Grant Collier can rot in hell and his whole company along with him. I personally will not buy, nor support any game that is console first and never with any link to IW.

I have a ton of ideas for RO and I'll be keeping at level design and vehicle add-ons if I have the help for the next year or so. This is the single best gaming investment I ever made and I intend to support the efforts of TWI. Those are all personal issues, but that's what motivates us all in the end.
 
Upvote 0
Thanks, Oneshot, for the compliments, but excuse the language when I say "NO FUKKING WAY WILL I EVER DO ANYTHING TO SUPPORT IW. EVER". Grant Collier can rot in hell and his whole company along with him. I personally will not buy, nor support any game that is console first and never with any link to IW.

Slyk, recently i discovered timereleased pills work better. :D:D
Did you know Mishap offerd me money to make his own neighbourhood
in COD 4. That would mean we are supporting ourself instead of IW

And Oneshot thanks for the support.
 
Upvote 0
radical suggestion...

release RO with the next patch free at steam. i mean IMO tripwire made alot of money with the game, now its time to think of the future.

if you get ALOT new players to RO now with a total free RO you will build up the massive stock for the next game ;)

which will make this, on the first view radical suggestion, more a brilliant marketing strategie for the success of the next (hopefully soon announced) tripwire game.

think about it. please. i dont want to see the whole RO-community dying...
 
Upvote 0
Slyk, recently i discovered timereleased pills work better. :D:D
Did you know Mishap offerd me money to make his own neighbourhood
in COD 4. That would mean we are supporting ourself instead of IW

And Oneshot thanks for the support.

And making anything for that game, Drecks, is supporting IW. Regardless of motivation. Making a new map, or creating new art, or anything similar IS supporting IW and confirming that they are correct and they gain approval for their past actions. Unlike some people that have said "never again" then turned right around and bought their games/run servers, I will stick to my word. We all have our own motivations but supporting that company just to play with some AHz guys is not working for me. I have plenty of better things to do in my time. I plan to sit back and have a good laugh when IW pulls more of the same old tricks with the tools and on-going support. Maybe they have learned something but they will do it without another $50 from me.
 
Upvote 0
radical suggestion...

release RO with the next patch free at steam. i mean IMO tripwire made alot of money with the game, now its time to think of the future.

if you get ALOT new players to RO now with a total free RO you will build up the massive stock for the next game ;)

which will make this, on the first view radical suggestion, more a brilliant marketing strategie for the success of the next (hopefully soon announced) tripwire game.

think about it. please. i dont want to see the whole RO-community dying...

Dont agree, we dont have the sales figures for all we know it could still be selling well which means more money for tw and ro2. You could(well should) reduce the price once the sales start to drift(even though its allready cheap as chips) but never free jeez the standard of play would go to ****e oh and imagine the legions of tards shudders. It might however be an idea if the sales ever get really bad to give away a few hundred or so copies over steam to generate some interest.
Btw i think all this talk of ro dying is utter nonsense the amount of german and russian players has actually increased lately and with the mods on the way + possibly another patch ro has at least another year left in her yet. The only way ro is going to die any time soon is if a game comes out that offers what ro does only better.
 
Upvote 0
I have a ton of ideas for RO and I'll be keeping at level design and vehicle add-ons if I have the help for the next year or so. This is the single best gaming investment I ever made and I intend to support the efforts of TWI.

I agree 100%, best $19 USD I ever spent, and hopefully, you will get the support you need to keep up the good work on the RO platform now and in the future.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0