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Level Design [Preview] RO-Kriegstadt: Der Untergang Berlins

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#102
EvilHobo said:
I'm still killing myself trying to make optimizations (I spent several hours converting a series of ruins in to static meshes -- properly.
Click to expand...

If you want some help with optimization hop in the #RO-LevelDesign IRC channel and I could do a walkthrough on your map with you. I just spent all day combining statics myself. :)

EvilHobo said:
In regard to the new MG42:
  • The weapon will begin to overheat after approximately 230 rounds (as opposed to what feels like 60-80 rounds in stock RO) have been fired on full automatic, meaning that the Axis player may keep sustained fire up for longer without the worry of his barrel melting. To compensate for this, the cooldown rate has been reduced.
Click to expand...

Are you sure this is accurate? I've heard the barrel would have to be changed after every 250 rounds of bursting. I'm fairly certain the barrel would start to overheat long before 230 rounds were fired in full auto.

Here's one video I found where you can start to see smoke after just a few bursts. I've also seen another video of firing and doing a barrel change but I can't seem to find it anymore. :(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQvX2XQgVL0
 
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#103
EvilHobo said:
In regard to the new MG42:
  • The spread of the bullets is reduced to make the bullets hit mostly where the weapon is pointing.
  • The recoil has been adjusted such that the MG is not flying uncontrollably all over the place. I'm still trying to tweak it such that it thrusts backward as the MG42 did.
  • The weapon will operate on 250 round ammo belts instead of 100 round ammo belts as per stock RO. However, the player will only start with one in their weapon (so x0 in the lower left corner) and may only be resupplied with one additional belt to make for a total of 500 rounds at any given time.
  • The weapon will begin to overheat after approximately 230 rounds (as opposed to what feels like 60-80 rounds in stock RO) have been fired on full automatic, meaning that the Axis player may keep sustained fire up for longer without the worry of his barrel melting. To compensate for this, the cooldown rate has been reduced.
  • Tracer ammunition fires less frequently and makes the weapon a Maschinengewehr instead of a Maschinengeflare. Essentially, the tracers are now subdued in the color (a pale yellow) and are thinner and shorter than stock RO tracers, with the glowing emitter removed as well. This should make it easier for the weapon to be concealed, as it should be harder to locate, especially if fired in bursts.
Click to expand...
Excellent. :D
 
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#104
EvilHobo said:
I'm still killing myself trying to make optimizations (I spent several hours converting a series of ruins in to static meshes -- properly. that's why it took a few hours). Ultimately I'm going to try to gauge performance from the people playing the map during testing, as I range anywhere from 40-80fps in the streets on all maximum settings, plus some stuff in the Nvidia console. At the same time though I also have an 8800GTS, so, who knows.

In regard to the new MG42:
  • The spread of the bullets is reduced to make the bullets hit mostly where the weapon is pointing.
  • The recoil has been adjusted such that the MG is not flying uncontrollably all over the place. I'm still trying to tweak it such that it thrusts backward as the MG42 did.
  • The weapon will operate on 250 round ammo belts instead of 100 round ammo belts as per stock RO. However, the player will only start with one in their weapon (so x0 in the lower left corner) and may only be resupplied with one additional belt to make for a total of 500 rounds at any given time.
  • The weapon will begin to overheat after approximately 230 rounds (as opposed to what feels like 60-80 rounds in stock RO) have been fired on full automatic, meaning that the Axis player may keep sustained fire up for longer without the worry of his barrel melting. To compensate for this, the cooldown rate has been reduced.
  • Tracer ammunition fires less frequently and makes the weapon a Maschinengewehr instead of a Maschinengeflare. Essentially, the tracers are now subdued in the color (a pale yellow) and are thinner and shorter than stock RO tracers, with the glowing emitter removed as well. This should make it easier for the weapon to be concealed, as it should be harder to locate, especially if fired in bursts.
I may have missed a few points, but that's the basic synopsis.

Also, just to dispel the speculation, the map will not feature Molotovs.
Click to expand...

Sounds very nice but I have a suggestion if you don't mind - Can't you make the german tracers orange as the yellow tracer quite often is hard to see against some backgrounds or is mistaken for the russians greenish tracer which on some maps looks very much alike? As for realism sake I don't know if the germans used orange tracers or not.
 
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#106
Yeah, I figured that it wouldn't be fair for the Allies to have their MGs easily spotted, so they'll be getting the same treatment. The Russian MGs are going to play a bit of a role in suppression, having the Russians work their way in to buildings and establish them as strongpoints to cover the advance.

The Bahnhof is within playable boundaries, but it is not a capzone. For RO-MoltkeBridge, maybe, we'll see.
 
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#107
While I agree with the changes to the tracers, I disagree vehemently with the MG42 changes. The gun, with the exception of the recoil, is as realistic as we are going to get it in a game. The reasons why MGs are less fearsome than they were in reality is simply due to the fact that MG gunners heads are too far exposed, bullets do not penetrate, popup riflemen, and a general lack of actually experienced, good, MG gunners.
 
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#108
I disagree with your disagreements. The MG42 is not effective in game because it is just not a good gun. It has a ridiculous spread, hyperactive recoil, and a barrel that may as well be made of plastic. When the MG is able to kill you from a distance with accurate burst fire without emanating flares that tell the pop-up riflemen where it is, then it can be a feared weapon.
 
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#110
We did a bit of a test with the '42 on a server of 16 people, the goal was for the Russians to run across a 100m square (that's farther than the bridgeheads on Gorlitz!) against one German machine gunner and see if anyone survived. I killed many of them at ranges of 80-110m before my barrel began to overheat, at which point we called that portion of the test off. I fired about 200-230 rounds in bursts. The tracers turned out really nice too :). Some of the people who played as the Russians at that point described it as feeling a lot like Enemy at the Gates.

Machine Guns just got a lot deadlier.
 
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#112
German army manual states you should change the barrel after 100 rounds fired.

MG42 fire at 1200rpm.
1200/60=20

20 rounds per second.

Tapping the mouse fires the gun for roughly a second. That's 20 rounds fired. Five taps = 100 rounds fired. Time to change the barrel. You can of course put off changing the barrel for as many as 8-10 taps without it beginning to smoke but your're pushing it.

That's how the gun works in game now. What you've done is changed to gun to live up to your expectations not what actually happened in reality.

The MG42 wasn't exactly the most accurate weapon ever either. If you're imagining some kind of sniper rifle firing at 1200rpm then you're not imagining a machine gun. Line up 5 cans 10cm apart at 100m and fire a burst from the MG42 at them. You won't hit just one at a time. You'll knock down at least two.

Gimme the stock MG42 and I'll do that test you performed above. The Russians won't get down the street with me either. I know how to fire the thing effectively.

I'm still really looking forward to this map though. It's beautiful looking.
 
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#113
Just one point about the MG42, it actually had a lighter weight barrel than the MG34, and so was more prone to over-heating than it's predecessor.

EDIT: The US military intelligence report on the MG42 said that the barrel should be changed after 250 rounds, or 400 rounds in an emergency.
http://www.lonesentry.com/manuals/german-infantry-weapons/mg42-machine-gun.html
Lone Sentry is a great web sight
 
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#116
Rather than bicker about how realistic it will be, I suggest that you simply wait until you actually play the map. My goal was ultimately to make the weapon effective and in its current state it is. There is no fear from having 1200 rpm being thrown at you if the chance of them actually hitting you from 100m away is slim to nil. Your chances against the new MG42 rely on the following:

He is a lousy machine gunner.
He has run out of ammo.
He has melted his barrels.

Other than that, every machine gun position should become an obstacle to overcome, one that can be neutralized by tanks, but if left alive long enough, will become a significant problem for the infantry.
 
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#117
Quick question, what will the class load-outs look for standard 0-32 players (and for 32+, can it have a sane scaling up plz!)

For example, will there be a sharpshooter (I refuse to call them snipers in their current roles) and which sides will have them?

Cause a decent sharpshooter makes MGs almost a non-factor if he can take them out quickly, but on pubs they generally are not decent, could lead to balance issues.
 
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