PPSH drum mag amount

[barakas]

I've heard that PPSH drum mags weren't typically filled to full, since it increased the chance the gun with jam (since the mag spring was under more pressure), so they would only fill a magazine to like 80% full.

Does anyone know how many rounds the current PPSH mag holds? Are they completely full to capacity or do they have some empty space?

Making this change could help balance when RO classic comes out and we get drum magged PPSHs vs MP40s (along with making the reload for the drum mag slower than the reload for the stick mag, as I believe is historically accurate as it was harder to load a drum mag than a stick mag).

Also history buffs feel free to correct me if this isn't right.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

I've heard that PPSH drum mags weren't typically filled to full, since it increased the chance the gun with jam (since the mag spring was under more pressure), so they would only fill a magazine to like 80% full.

Does anyone know how many rounds the current PPSH mag holds? Are they completely full to capacity or do they have some empty space?

Making this change could help balance when RO classic comes out and we get drum magged PPSHs vs MP40s (along with making the reload for the drum mag slower than the reload for the stick mag, as I believe is historically accurate as it was harder to load a drum mag than a stick mag).

Also history buffs feel free to correct me if this isn't right.

Spare us - please!

 

[feldmarschall]

any sources for this?

 

[Marxman]

Even if this is realistic it would make me rage with the force of a thousand furious suns.


PPsH doesn't need a nerf

 

[Nikita]

Even if this is realistic it would make me rage with the force of a thousand furious suns.


PPsH doesn't need a near

Especially with what the MP40 and Mkb have going for them at the moment in terms of realism...

 

[Proud_God]

I'm against balance by similarity.

 

[Hicks]

People here say they're against balance, but when it comes to the MP-40, yeah lets nerf the hell out of that thing, right?

 

[Barber[FG]]

I’m also against balance by similarity!

In fact, I’m against balance when balance interferes directly with the historical accuracy of the game, especially this game as it is a game that aims to be historically accurate! Furthermore, how do you balance the skill level of different players? How do you balance a game when Player A is downright better than player B? Weaken the gun that player-A uses well? Ban the player from the match because he is better than you? I don’t think so…

I think, in a game that players can instantly die to one shot from any weapon, the need to balance weapons in-so-far-as to make an MP-40 function similarly to a Ppsh is absurd and a waste of time! Any calls to tweak in game weapons for the sake of balance always amuse me! My advice is to play your soldier class in the way that it needs to be played, and you should do well by that!

Is the Ppsh a master at close range combat, you bet it is! But my rifle will beat a guy with a Ppsh at long ranges almost all the time. Is the Ppsh arguably better than the MP-40 at the same job? It sure is! Does that mean the game is broken, no! It just means that the Russians have a darn good close combat assault troop class! But hey, at medium ranges that Mkb really does a number on the Russians, and do the Russians get anything comparable... not really. Again, is the game broken, no way! Let the Germans play to their advantages and the Russians play to their advantages.

Nuff said.:IS2:

 

[mrPuma]

I

 

[LordKhaine]

Also history buffs feel free to correct me if this isn't right.

A great many smg's and mg's were filled short, this wasn't just the PPsh. So really you'd have to either keep it as it is now... or change it for well, all the smg's (the MP40 mag was also sometimes loaded sort). Also, when they partially filled mags they'd fill them perhaps a few rounds short, not down to 80% capacity.

 

[gimpy117]

People here say they're against balance, but when it comes to the MP-40, yeah lets nerf the hell out of that thing, right?

except that the mp-40 can one shot a head at 100 yards....never seen a 9mm that can do that. it's laser accurate

 

[r5cya]

well in this game russians dosent have any real advantages. Even if you count drum mag as advantage, they make it unlockable

what? the drum mag isn't going to be unlockable. it's going to be the default mag. just like in stalingrad.
and drum mags are not slower to load than sticks. to load the stick, you have to insert buttlets one at a time, i'm not aware that they used stripper clips to load them. to load the drum, you just drop 71 rounds into the open and wound drum.
http://www.ppsh41.com/Drumload.html
can't seem to find any vids of anyone loading a drum mag fast. but here's one of a suomi being loaded by o guy who needs some coffee.
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...2B5AF0910CFE942FB47F2B5AF0&first=0&FORM=LKVR8

 

[Nikita]

except that the mp-40 can one shot a head at 100 yards....never seen a 9mm that can do that. it's laser accurate

The barrel IS longer than on most modern SMGs and the muzzle velocity is certainly higher than that of most pistols. I think the weapons accuracy is fine. Add some more sway, subtract a little zoom, and I think that concern will diminish.

.

People here say they're against balance, but when it comes to the MP-40, yeah lets nerf the hell out of that thing, right?

I'd like to see higher recoil for the MP-40 not out of a desire to nerf it but out of love for it. Every now and then I literally open up a practice match in Ostfront and empty the MP-40 into the sky. That MP-40, with real recoil, felt like a real weapon. That barrel shaking with the force of 9mm Parabellum going downrange... And it was still fully controllable. Ostfront's MP-40 felt great. The current RO2 model feels like an airsoft gun.

What's more, it's somewhat of a double standard to include weapons like the Mkb, MG34 saddle drum mag, and the MP-40/II, and then turn around and say that for reasons pertaining to realism and historical accuracy, the PPSh needs to be nerfed, while the German MG class can run around hipfiring like Stallone in his prime.

The PPSh was literally the close-quarters god of World War II. I can't think of a period weapon I'd rather have in Berlin, Arnhem, Cherbourg, Rostov, or Stalingrad, except perhaps a M1928 Thompson, with much higher recoil albeit a much higher rate of fire and that heavy .45 ACP round. The PPSh has been balanced against the MP-40 at present, with the PPSh now lacking single-shot and drum mags at the default level, and with the MP-40 unlocking dual mags that switch automatically when you exhaust one of them.

I agree--artificial balance is a no-no.

Let the HHL-3 be magnetic.
Let the PPSh have its drum mag and single-shot (to be featured in Classic)

We'll see--Tripwire has a lot on their hands, but given that, I'd like to see Classic Mode, fixes to the armor and squad system, and some further performance tweaks before even talking about adding jamming...

 

[Vorkoz]

PPSH drum mag is a direct copy of the Suomi smg drum magazine. Which could hold up to 71 bullets but was in practise loaded a bit short. Wikipedia claims magazines loaded to over 65 bullets in them were prone to malfunction with PPSH. I could swear reading that finnish ones were usually loaded to about 68/71, but this could be due to better construction. 65/71 would be a bit over 90% of the total capacity.

 

[mrPuma]

what? the drum mag isn't going to be unlockable. it's going to be the default mag. just like in stalingrad.
and drum mags are not slower to load than sticks. to load the stick, you have to insert buttlets one at a time, i'm not aware that they used stripper clips to load them. to load the drum, you just drop 71 rounds into the open and wound drum.
[url]http://www.ppsh41.com/Drumload.html[/URL]
can't seem to find any vids of anyone loading a drum mag fast. but here's one of a suomi being loaded by o guy who needs some coffee.
[url]http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=loading+a+drum+magazine&view=detail&mid=910CFE942FB47F2B5AF0910CFE942FB47F2B5AF0&first=0&FORM=LKVR8[/URL]

well i ment the vanilla game

but yeah, the suomi smg its self is a copy of the russian one or the other way around

 

[r5cya]

well i ment the vanilla game

but yeah, the suomi smg its self is a copy of the russian one or the other way around

oops! my bad! i'm already thinking everyone's talking "classic", and given up on vanilla.

 

[Vorkoz]

but yeah, the suomi smg its self is a copy of the russian one or the other way around

Actually no, Suomi smg was designed earlier than ppsh (Suomi designed 1921, manufactured from 1931 onwards compared to ppsh developed & produced from 1941 onwards) but only the ppsh drum magazine is direct copy of the Suomi's drum magazine. PPSh's design itself probably did get some clues from Suomi but was more directly descended from PPD-40, PPSh's construction being simplified to aid in mass production. PPD-40 by itself was almost a direct copy of german Bergmann MP-28.

 

[mrPuma]

Actually no, Suomi smg was designed earlier than ppsh (Suomi designed 1921, manufactured from 1931 onwards compared to ppsh developed & produced from 1941 onwards) but only the ppsh drum magazine is direct copy of the Suomi's drum magazine. PPSh's design itself probably did get some clues from Suomi but was more directly descended from PPD-40, PPSh's construction being simplified to aid in mass production. PPD-40 by itself was almost a direct copy of german Bergmann MP-28.

thnx for clarifying that, its been over 10 years, since we studied this in history class

 

[Mike_Nomad]

except that the mp-40 can one shot a head at 100 yards....never seen a 9mm that can do that. it's laser accurate

And, the PPSH cannot?? Please, understand that the PPSH can do the very same things only better and also boasts a semi-auto switch.

Balance is in the perception of the beholder.

 

[mrPuma]

And, the PPSH cannot?? Please, understand that the PPSH can do the very same things only better and also boasts a semi-auto switch.

Balance is in the perception of the beholder.

well currently i cannot pull a 100m shot with ppsh, due to full auto mode, wich makes it impossible to shoot single bullets unlike mp40. And please dont say that classic mode fixes the unlock troubles of it, because no one knows when this mode will be available. I want to enjoy this game now and not in sometime in the future

edit: what you say might be right, I can rest my ppsh in a fence and pop 30-40 rounds of some poor guy who dont notice and maybe if im very very lucky some of the 40