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PBBans supports Red Orchestra 2

MaydaX

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 20, 2011
51
27
0
www.pbbans.com
Will AIMP2 interfere with PB?
If it doesn't hook into the game it should be fine. In-game overlays are a common cause of PB kicks.

I'm curious how false positives are handled. If you're put on the ban list incorrectly, do you contact TWI? PBBans? EvenBalance?
In most cases you submit a support ticket to Even Balance about it. If it's also banned at PBBans we have an appeal system as well.

I've been doing some reading and there are wayyyyy too many people out there claiming false bans and then saying that EvenBalance makes no real effort to unban you. It's like talking to a brick wall from what I've read. Remember, I've never had any experience with PB, I'm just concerned I'm going to one day be a false-positive statistic.
I've been playing games with PunkBuster for a long time (Back to Soldier of Fortune II) and I've never been banned. I had a few restriction and outdated PB kicks but it's far from being completely problematic as some portrey it to be.

In most cases PB will simply kick you for using unsupported application.

http://www.pbbans.com/forums/mbi-news-f424.html

That's a list of mass false positives that PBBans has removed over the years. Keep in mind that list is for all games that uses PunkBuster. In each case they were resolved within a few days.

VAC has false positives and they got reversed too.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valve_Anti-Cheat#False-positive_detections

So don't assume that if you get hit with a ban and you're not cheating that it's the end of the road.
 
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origination

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 30, 2010
115
47
0
I just hope that "personal grudge" bans by a random immature server admin will not result in a Global PBBans enabled server ban like it does in some games. Hopefully it will only limited to people who are proved to be cheating. If somebody wants to ban me from their server I suppose its their right(though it shouldn't be unless there is a real reason/issue), but I hate when a ban on one server ends up applying to 75% of servers in a game because of some streaming list that binds them together.

I remember back when I used to play America's Army 2 way back in version 2.5, they had that AC group ACI. I was playing on an ACI server when I was still fairly noobish(had been playing around 2months but I was still CoD style ramboing it up). Anyways I kept on killing one of the admins round after round(I was quite happy, I thought I was actually doing good for once) and suddenly got kicked by the Admin. When I attempted to re-connect I would get a ban kick from PB from ACI stream. It ended up applying to many servers all across the board and I never figured out why.

Just along as the system remains un-biased and strictly to do what it was designed to do: Stop cheating! I am all for it.

Also, server admins, stop letting people under the age of 18 admin servers for the love of god.
 
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Reactions: Fedorov

Floyd

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 19, 2006
4,313
725
0
Waterproof
www.ro50pc.net
As an admin that has streamed CoD and AA to PBBans in the past, I think some you guys are getting a little too worried. If Punkbuster is part of RO2's anti-cheat, then you definitely want an organization like PBBans onboard. They can be a big help in convincing Evenbalance that something is triggering a false-positive.


PPBans is a solid group whose motto is "Always Quality over Quantity". Among a lot of other features, they also provide a great service to admins with suggested settings for PB to help provide a more secure server and a server that doesn't boot for non-issues. If you are a server admin and unfamiliar with them, I strongly suggest you go ahead and head on over there and get a feel for the website and what services they provide.


Remember, PBBans is NOT Evenbalance's Punkbuster. If you get banned by Punkbuster, you won't play on any Punkbuster enabled server. Evenbalance mantains their own list just like VAC. PBBans on the otherhand has their own list that is updated continuously and virtually in 'real time.' If a player is triggered by one of their controls or if a screenshot submitted by an admin shows a hack, and if that player is added to their (PBBans) banlist and shared among all servers that choose to stream or use the banlist. If you were included on PBBans list it would not mean you couldn't play on a PB enabled server that does not use a PPBans list.


I could go on about the functionality and workings of PBBans, streaming, etc., but I'll leave that up to the PBBans staff. I found it to be a first class organization. I'm thrilled that TW is working with PB and that PBBans has taken a keen interest in RO2.

Now if I could just find my PBBans icon.....
 
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echutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 23, 2011
366
110
0
36
Wausua, Wisconsin
I dont know how you can say PB does **** all against cheaters in BF2, here is some factual information for you :)
PBBans has 20,023 BF2 pbguid's on its banlist (and counting) that equates to 20,023 cheaters that can not get a game on a PBBans protected server.
Every one of those 20,023 bans is accompanied by "live" streamed evidence.

You can see the overall satistics for the PB enabled games we support here;
[url]http://www.pbbans.com/mbi-overall-ban-statistics.html[/URL]

Theres not really much difference in detection levels between VAC and PB.
What gives PB the edge is what the third party anti cheat streaming services like PBBans provide (MD5 scans / cheat related cvar scans / cheat file matches etc etc) using tools provided by EvenBalance.
RO2:HOS server admins will see how effective streaming is for themselves if they choose to stream their server(s) via PBBans :)
My clan/community has purchased hacks to test on our PR server, aimbot + see enemies where ever they are + everything else that came with it + 2 other different ones purchased from different sellers, PB didn't catch anything.
 

origination

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 30, 2010
115
47
0
But PBBans does not take individual Administrator bans into account though right? The admin has to submit a real case on behalf of an actual cheater for someone to make the list right? Or the player has to have a PB Kick(hack violation) or Dirty PBSS submitted via the stream to end up perma banned?

I just hate biased admins who ban for stupid reasons and end up screwing you for playing on 80% of servers in your reagion.

Another example, there was a server in Modern warfare 2 that had a special rule set that the admins were enforcing. They made people stay crouched the entire round and fire from the hip with snipers. I went along for it, and didn't scope my sniper the entire round. The Admin got mad that I got a few kills and said I was using the scope. Banned me for that stupid reason, and apparently the server was sharing ban lists with a good deal of other servers, preventing me from having any good ping servers to connect to.

If its just hacks that get banned then I got nothing to worry about, but petty reasons can caught up in the mix sometimes and seems more like abuse of a system designed to stop cheating.
 
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MaydaX

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 20, 2011
51
27
0
www.pbbans.com
But PBBans does not take individual Administrator bans into account though right? The admin has to submit a real case on behalf of an actual cheater for someone to make the list right? Or the player has to have a PB Kick(hack violation) or Dirty PBSS submitted via the stream to end up perma banned?
PBBans will only ban for PB raised violations, submitted pbss and demos that clearly show cheats. Any local bans made on a server do not get added to our banlists.

All our bans show exactly why a player is banned and backed up with proof from server logs to pbss and demos. There are no vague reasons such as "cheating" or "hacking" with no proof used at PBBans.

An example of a ban:
http://www.pbbans.com/mbi-viewban-79995946-vb222494.html

This is a list of PBSS that have been banned to give you an idea what they look like:
http://www.pbbans.com/mbi-banned-pbss-list.html

My clan/community has purchased hacks to test on our PR server, aimbot + see enemies where ever they are + everything else that came with it + 2 other different ones purchased from different sellers, PB didn't catch anything.
No anti-cheat solution will catch everything. When you play on servers with no anti-cheat you see that VAC and PB do make a difference. I've seen that first hand many times in COD4.

If you used free public cheats you will see that they are often detected.
 
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Yoshiro

In Soviet Russia, Yoshiro is a cake
Staff member
Oct 10, 2005
12,558
3,630
113
If you do get your hands on private cheat files, the best thing you can do is submit them to us here at Tripwire.
 

IndianScout

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 20, 2011
21
46
0
www.pbbans.com
My clan/community has purchased hacks to test on our PR server, aimbot + see enemies where ever they are + everything else that came with it + 2 other different ones purchased from different sellers, PB didn't catch anything.
just a heads up,

even purchasing cheats to "test them" if you happen to get caught the ban will remain in place, never test cheats, even being loaded into memory can get you into trouble..
 

origination

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 30, 2010
115
47
0
Also all of them private cheats have PBSS cleaning functions. They detect when PB is about to take a screenshot and turn off all visual hacks a split second before the shot is taken and then re-enable. Because of this people really need to watch out for visual ques when playing. When a player is constantly hoping around a corner and insta headshotting people before even having time to scan the area around the corner, a lot of times he is wallhacking. Most people can't jump around a corner and instantly know where the enemies head is going to be, even you saw him go around the corner and have a good idea where he might hide.

I would hate to see a game like this get the CoD treatment, in CoD its bad, in a tactical game like this its aweful. Players are naturally given disadvantages in a game like this such as limited HUD info, realistic recoil and weapon sway(breathing) and limited visual que to desipher friend from foe, so a normal player is going to be delayed a lot in their decisions, witch makes it worse when cheaters don't have that problem.

But PB is definately better than just VAC alone. VAC detects hacks and places people that get detected on a banlist, but they do not actively kick players using a detected cheat out of servers. They can take upwards of months(if Im not mistaken) to ban them. PB will always boot people using detected cheats out of servers, so you don't get stuck playing with a cheater using a cheat that is already known about. At we'll get that much.

Private cheats, who knows how they can stopped. PB certainly can't do it.
 
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blkmgc

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 24, 2006
619
67
0
Well your experiences and mine are obviously different. Like I said, I've never seen that whatsoever in any VAC server. YMMV I guess.
HomeFront was all but killed off inside 3 weeks by a huge influx of unchecked players cheating..And VAC was enabled in that game..

My Clans Admins were banning 1 or 2 a night..these guys stood in houses simply firing off aimbots which wiped out the opposition players..They would empty a server within just 10 or 15 mins..Then leave and move onto the next full server they could access...In the first few weeks the Kaos team seemed to have taken a siesta and the cheats just ran riot.
Many players simply stopped playing and never came back to the game.

Now if PB and PBBans had been in place from day one most of the google hacks would have disappeared within the first couple of days..

VAC is ok as long as developers keep updating the VAC team, if not then you'll pretty soon have a disaster on your hands and one from which your game may not recover.
 

MaydaX

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 20, 2011
51
27
0
www.pbbans.com
AFAIK its maximum weeks.
Looking at free public cheat forums is a good indication. Anytime a cheat is detected they will post "detected" like crazy.

One popular CoD Black Ops hack was released on Nov 22, 2010 and still remains undetected (it's been updated with each patch). One popular MW2 one was released on May 18, 2010 and detection posts started around Nov 4, 2010. That's undetected for over 5 months. Both are completely free and accessible to anyone.
Few examples of how quickly PunkBuster can detect cheaters:

Bad Company 2 - Day 1 (MD5 Tool)
http://www.pbbans.com/mbi-viewban-606fb0e9-vb161738.html

Bad Company 2 - Day 3 (VIOLATION (GAMEHACK) 80474)
http://www.pbbans.com/mbi-viewban-4a17e4f2-vb161966.html

Medal of Honor - Day 2 (VIOLATION (AIMBOT) 50120)
http://www.pbbans.com/mbi-viewban-e4e635fc-vb192444.html

PB is slow for detecting hacks at times too but that's why anti-cheat communities such as PBBans exist. Using MD5Tool, PBSS and Demos you have the ability to catch cheaters without having to wait for VAC or PB to detect them.
 

origination

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 30, 2010
115
47
0
Well your experiences and mine are obviously different. Like I said, I've never seen that whatsoever in any VAC server. YMMV I guess.

Well there is a TON of people who seem to have the money to waste buying a PRIVATE hack witch is undetected/cleans any screencapture functions and has built in "Stealth" mode features. Many of these people that buy them, only buy them for competitive play, so they do everything they can to hide. Simply because they don't go in all out rage AIMBOT mode doesn't mean you haven't seen them cheating. People can simply use the Wallhacks/3D Radar to analyze the enemies teams movements and prepare for a firefight before hand, they don't need the aimbot on to ruin peoples good time and still not get banned(because nobody will take the time to spectate them and determine what is happening).
 

SuperTaz

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 19, 2011
300
30
0
40
Easton, PA
www.pbbans.com
I believe that without 3rd party anti-cheat sites like PBBans, the games that use Punkbuster would be unplayable because of all the cheating.

There are times that we put MD5 tool or CVAR checks into place before EB has them in their system and we catch a whole bunch of players at once. Then, when EB puts the checks into their system, MD5/CVAR catches slow down until the cheat is updated and it starts all over. :)
 

=GG= Mr Moe

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 16, 2006
9,797
890
0
54
Newton, NJ
I guess alot of people will be worried that they may accidentally get banned from their favorite game. Hopefully that is a non-occurance or at least extremely rare and its nice the PBBans guys are in here talking about everything.
 

SuperTaz

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 19, 2011
300
30
0
40
Easton, PA
www.pbbans.com
I guess alot of people will be worried that they may accidentally get banned from their favorite game. Hopefully that is a non-occurance or at least extremely rare and its nice the PBBans guys are in here talking about everything.
Like we said in previous posts, if someone gets banned, and it is a false violation, then we will lift the ban immediately.

But, if someone gets a ban, and it is from a known cheat, then they will have to buy a new game.

If a player is worrying about getting banned, then 9 chances out of 10, they are most likely using something that they know could trigger a ban.

As long as you play fairly, there is nothing to worry about.
 
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blkmgc

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 24, 2006
619
67
0
Spent many of evenings for years spectating suspicious actions. Other than the obvious game exploits , most of the time it all became clear after watching a good player. I try not to game with a tinfoil hat on all the time. What fun is that?
Well there is a TON of people who seem to have the money to waste buying a PRIVATE hack witch is undetected/cleans any screencapture functions and has built in "Stealth" mode features. Many of these people that buy them, only buy them for competitive play, so they do everything they can to hide. Simply because they don't go in all out rage AIMBOT mode doesn't mean you haven't seen them cheating. People can simply use the Wallhacks/3D Radar to analyze the enemies teams movements and prepare for a firefight before hand, they don't need the aimbot on to ruin peoples good time and still not get banned(because nobody will take the time to spectate them and determine what is happening).