Paid Weapon DLC?

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Amber Glass

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 19, 2011
921
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The lack of community spirit and meanfisted whining is unbearable. In future, I hope TW charge full price for all their seasonal specials. That will give you all something to whine about. Some people just don't know when they're onto a good thing.

Content like this costs time and money. The fact you've been receiving tons of this stuff for over 3 years, totally free of charge and the recent outcry and damn right trolling over a the new, optional paid for DLC just shows you people appreciate nothing.

I love supporting TWI by all means, i purchased the chickenator suit right away, and would have bought any other character packs had they released any. As far as IJC goes, yes they are talented modders, yes they have done some great work on modeling/animations but i did not support their weapon pack being added to the vanilla game, and i do not support their current weapon pack DLC, so i personally did not purchase this pack for myself.

Many of you are stating that we should be grateful for the free events and contents released every year, and WE ARE, no one has bashed TWI for that, but this pack isn't going to support TWI, its going to the modders, not to TWI themselves, so how exactly does that support event content in the future? sure modders should be rewarded, thats great, but doing it in a way that perverts your previous statement of no paid content DLC, and your original mission with DLC releases is IMO a mistake.
 

Arblarg

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 24, 2012
1,430
6
0
Illinois, U.S.
The lack of community spirit and meanfisted whining is unbearable. In future, I hope TW charge full price for all their seasonal specials. That will give you all something to whine about. Some people just don't know when they're onto a good thing.

Content like this costs time and money. The fact you've been receiving tons of this stuff for over 3 years, totally free of charge and the recent outcry and damn right trolling over a the new, optional paid for DLC just shows you people appreciate nothing.
The whining will continue until the cows come home. Unfortunately, the cows are dead.

If I were you, at this point I would just lock all threads relating to the issue and make a sticky one dedicated to the topic. Any sprouting of the 3 words "pay to win" should be grounds to remove the post.

Either way, I'm very happy with the update content and very glad TWI is taking steps to further support of their mod community. A mod community is the best thing a game or engine can have. Without it, a game only goes so far.
 

Spicy

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 8, 2010
1,219
162
0
33
New England, the Newer England
The lack of community spirit and meanfisted whining is unbearable. In future, I hope TW charge full price for all their seasonal specials. That will give you all something to whine about. Some people just don't know when they're onto a good thing.

Content like this costs time and money. The fact you've been receiving tons of this stuff for over 3 years, totally free of charge and the recent outcry and damn right trolling over a the new, optional paid for DLC just shows you people appreciate nothing.

I get by with the following two phrases:
"It is what it is." and "You can't please everyone."

That and the fact that we're on forums. Proportionally, people that ***** about/ hate something will always outnumber those that like/ support the same thing. :[
 

Vlad Tepes.pt

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 18, 2012
107
0
0
Portugal
Weapons DLC

Weapons DLC

Sorry for my english,but I think that many people against the weapons paid DLC are retarded :rolleyes:.

I'm portuguese and my country is in bankrupt like Greece and Ireland.
We have FMI and EU support to live and I bought the new DLC's (Chickenator and Weapons) and i'm not claiming.

Tripwire and the guys that developed the 4 weapons deserve the money.

KF is a real good and FUN game and they deserve our support.

2.99 euros for a great pack of 4 weapons it's a bargain :).

Only small kids want everthing for free.
I'm 43 years old,live in a poor country and I'm not claiming all the time.
So...for the kids that are claiming against paid weapons DLC...grow up.

Life is Hard,but I buy all KF DLC's with pleasure.
Now I'm waiting for the Christmas Event ;).
 

FDRs Legs

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jul 11, 2011
94
4
0
I think what the paid DLC apologists fail to understand is that this matter could have been handled much better than it was.

TWI added the Weapon and Character DLC mouse-over to the main menu and never once broached the subject that they would be changing their policy with regard to DLC that affected gameplay.

Alan Wilson's argument that their policy hasn't changed because they don't consider it their weapons is, frankly, bull****. Unless every single cent from the DLC is in fact going to modders, TWI claims part ownership over that content.

Paid Weapon DLC apologists need to understand that other individuals took TWI at their word and now feel betrayed. I only ever run with the banana suit in game, but I own practically every character DLC because I felt indebted to TWI for holding up their side of the DLC bargain they struck with the community. I had full intention to pick up an alt account and the missing character DLC on my main to reward TWI for their work on balancing the IJC weapon pack this Halloween sale, right up until I saw the Community Weapon DLC.

I currently own the Community Weapon DLC because I felt it necessary to properly judge TWI's actions. Now that I have had a chance to examine the DLC, and have read TWI's justifications, I feel dirty for owning it.



Edit:Vlad Tepes you're just spamming your position on every DLC thread. I hope you gain great success and notoriety.
 
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H

Herr Doctor

Guest
Listen I haven't been on these forums for perhaps 2 years. I am not regular, I lurk, because unlike most of these kiddies I spend my time playing the game rather than complaining about the M99 or pushing my own terrible specimens. However, after reading your take on the paid DLC sir, I went online to register (because I forgot I even had an account). Thats right. What you said was so bad, I was prepared to create an account just to respond.

In reply to the original post...

1. We always said we wouldn't charge for our own weapons. We're not. We're using this as a way to reward community members for work done.
So your rewarding them by giving them all the profits of there work thats paid by the DLC? How generous and nobel of you, a regular Valve employee...if you weren't taking your fair share of it off the top. I've allways loved the concept of the TF2 workshop: "Your work, your time, only half your money"

2. It is no longer a "mod". It is DLC taken in as part of the game itself. That is one of the many little headaches we've got to work on to find ways to make this all work sweetly. Random individuals trying to charge for odd bits of code/art are still in breech of the EULA.

We'll how convenient. It's only wrong when other people do it.

3. The weapons don't change gameplay - they are "side-grades". They all have stats similar to existing (FREE) weapons.

>They don't change gameplay
>He thinks that Having a Zerker Xbow that can 2 Shot FP's with re-usable ammo and the ability to bounce off walls doesn't affect gameplay
>my****ingsides.jpg


You cannot be serious. Oh god. My sides are moving on their own.

4. There have been a couple of comments about "pay to win". Um - this is a CO-OP game, not competitive. You're not playing AGAINST someone who can get a drop on you because they've spent money. No-one can "beat" you at all - with or without any extra weapons. The weapons aren't any "better" than FREE weapons anyway. That is just knee-jerk reaction.

So you think a weapon with superior abilities that is unique to paying players isn't exploiting players? Are you from another planet with insufficient data to comment on the state of affairs of the balance of power in online gaming? Wha-..What on earth is wrong with you?

Do you really think I give a rats-*** that I'm not playing against another human; when there is a Eight Foot Power House with Blenders for Hands and more doom and death and pestilence than any war in history? You are paying to win. You are downgrading and penalizing players who use the stock weapons like the Katana or Claymore when they could be reaping crowds with ease and 2 shotting all power ZEDs a bouncing Saw Blade. Blades if angled right will never stop bouncing throughout the map.

10/10 kiddo.

So - the weapons are effectively cosmetic anyway. If we've missed anything and one of them is OP, we'll reel it back in - just as we would with FREE weapons. Have done, in fact. We're doing it as an experiment, related to the Steam workshop experiment, seeing if we can give people decent ways to reward community members who do a boat-load of work - that meets the quality bar as well. We picked this one as the experiment as it is reasonably simple to handle. And Paypal buttons on random websites are largely useless.
>reel it right back
Oh boy, just like how quickly you worked on the Revolver weight.
>nerf it
Yes I saw what you did to the M99. I think its clever strategy too. Nerf good free weapons to uselessness and promote the selling of better OP weapons, before nerfing those ones, and creating the cycle all over again for Map Pack 2. Bait and switch, bait and switch.

So this is an experiment: some weapons that do NOT make anyone "over-powered", but are a fun alternative to the (50+) (FREE) stock weapons. No-one NEEDS to buy them. No-one will get any more "powerful" with them. The IJC guys will get some reward for the time they've put in and we will learn things from the experiment, adjust plans and move on. What direction that takes depends in part on this experiment, on part what we can afford to do, in part on what the player community is interested in.

An Experiment just like the "Buy Ash Harding by buying the game all over again." Seems to me you guys have some pretty autistic idea's about how to run a business thats perpetuated by a strong fan base. Most people who buy your game get ****ed on wave 1, and never play again. This content was directed at people like me. Experiment failed.
But there is a limit to the amount of free content we can generate (we already do 3 events a year, new maps, weapons for free, some DLC characters to help pay for it) - so we really do want to encourage the broader community to make more content that fits, that is of high enough quality and is attractive to the players. If we can find ways for people to earn a bit of cash off providing that content, then the player base will wind up with even more content to play with. That is one theory, anyway :)
>3 events a year, new maps, weapons for free
Let me play you a song on the worlds smallest violin. It must be hard to reuse the same skins/sound-bytes for the 3 events you already have made. TF2 pushes more content in 2 months than you do in the course of a year, and they are almost as lazy as Tripwire.

Oh yeah, all those NEW guns must have taken months upon months to piece together. The Hillbilly event with such great lines as "uhhhh" and "ooooh" and "wrraaa" from the famous Voice actor: Jim from the down the hall. You must be so burdened every year to fixed such entitled people like me's problems like the matters of
>fixing the revolver
>fix the exploits
>Hey we fixed the Exploits!
>Oh **** no we didn't. JK JK
>Now there fixed!


I think its amazing you can evening get some of this stuff done considering the massive autism it must have taken to think up of something like this. You will never see another dime from me.
 

Spicy

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 8, 2010
1,219
162
0
33
New England, the Newer England
Alan Wilson's argument that their policy hasn't changed because they don't consider it their weapons is, frankly, bull****. Unless every single cent from the DLC is in fact going to modders, TWI claims part ownership over that content.

Unlike the map pack DLC's for Call of Duty, the weapon pack DLC does not split the community. I own the DLC collections 1 and 2 for MW3. Unless I disable the DLC in my little game menu, I cannot play with people that don't also own those DLC's. If someone owns DLC 3 or 4, they have no chance of every playing with/ against me because I don't own 3 or 4. If I'm in a party of 2-6 people and any one of us doesn't own a DLC pack, the game disables them.

As far as calling BS on Tripwire, I can only laugh. I don't mean it to be offensive or make fun of you. But because Tripwire owns Killing Floor doesn't mean they came up with the idea for the weapons in the DLC pack. So while they own the game, there's a distinction between someone else's weapons being added, and TWI coming up with the idea for the weapon on their own, then charging for those weapons.

So I guess your only option is to not buy the DLC? *shrug* Clearly you don't like the decision, or the phrasing or reasoning behind it. But I have good news. You don't *have* to like it. :D

Paid Weapon DLC apologists need to understand that other individuals took TWI at their word and now feel betrayed.

"Girlfriend cheated on me" betrayed or just "they said this and then did that" betrayed? Judging by the reactions, you'd think it was the former.
 

Tabrias

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 24, 2012
20
0
0
The lack of community spirit and meanfisted whining is unbearable. In future, I hope TW charge full price for all their seasonal specials. That will give you all something to whine about. Some people just don't know when they're onto a good thing.

And the day the do that is the day I stop buying all their games.
 

Amber Glass

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 19, 2011
921
33
0
Unlike the map pack DLC's for Call of Duty, the weapon pack DLC does not split the community. I own the DLC collections 1 and 2 for MW3. Unless I disable the DLC in my little game menu, I cannot play with people that don't also own those DLC's. If someone owns DLC 3 or 4, they have no chance of every playing with/ against me because I don't own 3 or 4. If I'm in a party of 2-6 people and any one of us doesn't own a DLC pack, the game disables them.

As far as calling BS on Tripwire, I can only laugh. I don't mean it to be offensive or make fun of you. But because Tripwire owns Killing Floor doesn't mean they came up with the idea for the weapons in the DLC pack. So while they own the game, there's a distinction between someone else's weapons being added, and TWI coming up with the idea for the weapon on their own, then charging for those weapons.

So I guess your only option is to not buy the DLC? *shrug* Clearly you don't like the decision, or the phrasing or reasoning behind it. But I have good news. You don't *have* to like it. :D



"Girlfriend cheated on me" betrayed or just "they said this and then did that" betrayed? Judging by the reactions, you'd think it was the former.

that is irrelevant because the decision was ultimately made by TWI to release said DLC pack officially, whitelisted as well, so its as close to vanilla paid content as you can get, despite that it is created by modders, which really is a very, very shoddy and sleazy argument to make.

also who are you to judge us for having an intimate relationship with TWI :p
 

FDRs Legs

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jul 11, 2011
94
4
0
Unlike the map pack DLC's for Call of Duty, the weapon pack DLC does not split the community.
It will once someone generates a mutator to unlock the paid content and those players choose to only play on servers running the mutator along with server perks. It's still a choice for those subverting the paywall, granted, but it does break up the community.

As far as calling BS on Tripwire, I can only laugh. I don't mean it to be offensive or make fun of you. But because Tripwire owns Killing Floor doesn't mean they came up with the idea for the weapons in the DLC pack. So while they own the game, there's a distinction between someone else's weapons being added, and TWI coming up with the idea for the weapon on their own, then charging for those weapons.

They have endorsed it and taken the weapons on as their own. Tripwire owns the DLC or else the pack would violate their EULA. If they don't own it, it should remain a whitelisted mutator with a paypal link on the IJC homepage. As Amber points out, its sleazy and underhanded.

So I guess your only option is to not buy the DLC? *shrug* Clearly you don't like the decision, or the phrasing or reasoning behind it. But I have good news. You don't *have* to like it. :D

No doubt. I simply wish TWI held their integrity in higher regard. Backpedaling on their policy due to changes in the gaming/development environment is one thing, sitting there with a smile and telling you they held up their side of the bargain is another. I will certainly think twice the next time TWI pledges to support a new game.
 

Frinto

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 26, 2012
1
0
0
Hello everyone, I made an account just to comment on this issue. It's an incredibly stupid decision, from the perspective of game balance. I wouldn't have any problem (I doubt anyone would, in fact) with the new weapons if they were along the lines of the m4, for instance (a weapon you can use if you like the feel of it better than the ak47, or at least could before they added the FNFAL... >.<), but at the very least, the sawbow and the scythe are incredibly overpowered weapons. Anyone calling them a side-grade is either a liar or doesn't understand how the game mechanics work.

I used to love this game, and play it every day, and then the m99 got released, trivializing the higher difficulties and making strategies that require teamwork or skill unnecessary. Regardless of the issue about whether or not they should be charging money for game-breaking content, this is just more of the same; more powerful weapons that make older weapons and team-oriented or high-complexity strategies obsolete.

I won't be playing, or running my public server (with kill messages and stuff!) any longer, the game has just lost its appeal. I have had no desire since the last weapons were released to watch terrible sharpshooters body-shot scrakes to death with no repercussions, and I have no desire now to watch terrible berserkers body-shot scrakes to death with no repercussions.

Unlike the map pack DLC's for Call of Duty, the weapon pack DLC does not split the community. I own the DLC collections 1 and 2 for MW3. Unless I disable the DLC in my little game menu, I cannot play with people that don't also own those DLC's.

That sounds absolutely amazing, actually. If *only* I could play the game without the IJC weapon packs again. But even if there's a mod out there (or will be) that does it, that limits me to playing with a handful of friends. And the game is a little boring when you're playing solely with people you know, you breeze through the waves and there's never any real question of how things are going to turn out.

The best that can be hoped for is that TWI patches the weapons to just be full reskins of older weapons, because they apparently don't understand the concept of side-grade, or of not paying for DLC that changes how the game is played. I'd buy that just like I've bought all the skins (except ash) simply to support the company, because back when I bought them, TWI seemed like they had a lot of integrity.
 

Gartley

Grizzled Veteran
Dec 27, 2010
2,340
349
83
UK
www.wildcardproductionstudios.co.uk
It will once someone generates a mutator to unlock the paid content and those players choose to only play on servers running the mutator along with server perks. It's still a choice for those subverting the paywall, granted, but it does break up the community.

The whitelist did that from day one. You'll always have those who'll only play whitelist and those that play on modded servers. Also they are already on modded servers due to the way the guns were implemented. The control being handled in the shop, which modded servers have had to replace along with the perks, so there is not 'dlc' check.

They have endorsed it and taken the weapons on as their own. Tripwire owns the DLC or else the pack would violate their EULA. If they don't own it, it should remain a whitelisted mutator with a paypal link on the IJC homepage. As Amber points out, its sleazy and underhanded.

It's only a breach of the EULA if you use mods for commercial gain without express permission. Next time read the EULA

Your Mods must be distributed for free, period. Neither you, nor any
other person or party, may sell them to anyone, commercially exploit
them in any way, or charge anyone for receiving or using them without
prior written consent from Tripwire Interactive.

No doubt. I simply wish TWI held their integrity in higher regard. Backpedaling on their policy due to changes in the gaming/development environment is one thing, sitting there with a smile and telling you they held up their side of the bargain is another. I will certainly think twice the next time TWI pledges to support a new game.

I dont' think they really have. But that's your choice.
 
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nutterbutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 8, 2010
2,017
1,281
0
I think what the paid DLC apologists fail to understand is that this matter could have been handled much better than it was.

In your opinion. In my opinion, you are wrong and no one has done anything wrong. BTW, just because someone disagrees with you doesn't make them an apologist.

Paid Weapon DLC apologists need to understand that other individuals took TWI at their word and now feel betrayed.

You have no reason to feel slighted. You, and others who agree with you, are taking such hurt feelings to such a large extreme that your actions are past ridiculous.

I currently own the Community Weapon DLC because I felt it necessary to properly judge TWI's actions. Now that I have had a chance to examine the DLC, and have read TWI's justifications, I feel dirty for owning it.

Feel however you want. Belaboring your shame here is getting old.
 

Gregs2k2

Thank you please
Mar 21, 2009
1,855
164
63
UK
www.ragequitters.co.uk
I think this thread may have run it's course. I think TW has a general "feel" on how the DLC has been received. Keeping a close eye, just in case things get messy. As per.
 

HuNteR-

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 11, 2011
682
439
0
Up there, in the trees...
On the contrary, people are still discussing on it.

Are they? Or is it turning into a flame war? Gregs has already said it's run its course and to prevent it getting out of hand any further it should be locked.

Like I said, I made the thread, I have the right to decide if it should be open for discussion or not. If I could delete it myself I would. It serves no further purpose. We got an official response, that was the aim of the thread. No further discussion necessary. If you would like to discuss the topic any further then make your own thread on the matter or post in one of the other flame war threads.
 

Benjamin

Grizzled Veteran
May 17, 2009
3,650
635
113
France
Like I said, I made the thread, I have the right to decide if it should be open for discussion or not.

Well actually no, no you don't. You don't own these forums, you don't have any inherent 'rights' to any content on it. You're granted the ability to start a thread, that's not to say that you can close it (and end discussion between members) when you feel like it. IMO it's a really selfish thing to say "my question is answered, lock the thread please" when there are other people that can make use of it.

It's Gregs2k2's call, although I do agree that the thread has pretty much run its course. Still, no point in locking if there's still discussion to be had. :)
 
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Ducky

Super Moderator
May 22, 2011
6,358
237
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Netherlands
Closing threads is up to the forum moderators and administrators. A member can of course request to close a thread, however this doesn't mean that it will happen.
 

HuNteR-

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 11, 2011
682
439
0
Up there, in the trees...
Well actually no, no you don't. You don't own these forums, you don't have any inherent 'rights' to any content on it. You're granted the ability to start a thread, that's not to say that you can close it (and end discussion between members) when you feel like it.

Your right I don't own these forums. But I do own the right to request for my own thread to be locked. The thread was made to get an official response, not so that everyone could put in their two cents. It got an official response, thread finished. Everyone else's discussions don't particularly matter. In fact they don't matter at all. They'd all be classed as derailing the original intention of the thread. That's if we want to fine comb the rules of course.

It's Gregs2k2's call, although I do agree that the thread has pretty much run its course. Still, no point in locking if there's still discussion to be had. :)

Gregs has the button to press, in the hierarchy it is his call as I don't have the power. But like I said, I can request my thread to be locked and I have much more weight behind my request than you do to keep it open. After all you've already fallen over yourself by saying it's run it's course, but keep it open for derailing discussions... Coming from a member that is so noble for the rules, sounds ironic to me.

Closing threads is up to the forum moderators and administrators. A member can of course request to close a thread, however this doesn't mean that it will happen.

Like I went on to explain, obviously I don't have the power. Although I think people should have the power to delete their own threads like you can on the Steam Forums. It would save so much grief, time and effort on all parties.

I also think that If someone has made a thread, they should have the right to get it removed. If they ask a question, then the question gets answered, why should the thread possibly continue? This thread is an open and closed discussion. What more can come of it apart from a flame war? I don't want a thread I made for legit reasons turning into a flame war. Hence my request.
 
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