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Nades are still too ****ing weak

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The_Emperor

The_Emperor

Grizzled Veteran
May 9, 2009
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Milkyway
#1
Title pretty much says the basic thing.
I was told to play a different game because I don't like several things. Well, I decided to stay and play some RO to figure out things that really are a piss in the delicious soup RO2 actually should be and I still believe the nades too weak, yes yes nadespam (grenade equivalent to camper).

Everytime I'm killed in house-to-house fighting because my nade didn't kill the enemy at a distance of maybe 2 meters from it. I want to stick it a real life one up somebody's *** responsible for this bull**** and watch him explode. :mad:

Having nades only move people around - yes, indeed nades sometimes just push people around but don't injure nor kill them - is something Call of Duty could have invented. It reminds me back of the days when I started playing WWII fps and I stood on a nade and wasn't killed due to the low difficulty I selected back then as a newcomer.
Having this immortality now included in RO2 is really out of range. Anyone and everything around a nade in the diameter of 6-8 has to be dead immediately.
I hardly can describe the feeling that you get when you throw a nade into a room where supposedly enemy infantry is hiding in and after the blow you walk in just to be gunned down by the enemy waiting inside who was hardly away 2 meters from the nade. This is ****ing ludicrous!

A hand grenade is normally the weapon of choice to get people killed inside rooms or to make them run in the open if you don't have your toxin gas canister with you. Currently I'm wasting at least two nades to kill one person at 75% of the cases. This is pathetic. I sometimes think it's better to throw no nade at all - it's useless anyway. :rolleyes:

I don't know how you others feel about it when you try to evict people out of a room and throw a nade in there just to know that the frickin bastard inside is still alive.

Ostfront had really nice nades, for all those whiners on nade spam it feels like you don't want them back that strong as someone could get you out of your hiding hole. Combined Arms nades were even better. You could really rely on them: Prime, throw and forget! That were good times. I do miss them when I'm wasting 4 nades to kill one filthy enemy. Yes ONE! :mad:


My suggestion: Make nades in both classic and realism mode at least as strong as those of Ostfront (CA nades would be even better). All those who believe nades are meant to cherish the enemy may keep on playing relaxed mode and happily cheer for the enemy kill them after they survived the nade. :rolleyes:
 
#3
Im with ya 100% man. I remember the beautiful CA grenades with the modeled shrapnel on the F1 :) Ive been wishing for stronger nades since release since they really are ridiculously weak. But ive seen this topic come up many times on the forums and the "nadespam" camp is too strong, also the devs side with them.

Now i can definitely see the nadespam argument, and i am prepared to deal with a bit of spam for the sake of realistic grenades, but i suppose there has to be a limit so that everyone can have their fun. The natural thing to do would be to reduce the number of grenades one has, but then youre technically taking away a soldiers irl capabilities considering stalingrad references site soldiers carrying BAGS of grenades.

Of course the reason they would carry bags of grenades would be because they were a powerful an effective weapon for exactly the situatikn you describe, clearing rooms. Thus we should make them more powerful. Similarly, however, we take into account that not every soldier had access to said grenade bad of death, and thus we should give these new powerful grenades mostly to say, the assault class, or a special grenadier class. And limit or remove them for others.

This of course gets everyones attention as bad for the game because now the poor rifleman is even more ****d. And I agree with this being bad for gameplay.

This would lead to leaving the number and damage of grenades as is and telling peope just to deal with it at which point the argument comes full circle and we dont get anywhere.
 
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#4
It worked in Ostfront and people played Danzig 24/7. (Yeah, com'on guys, tell me I'm lying, now everyone hates this map and never admits he loved it). The thing is, if we have one map that has issues with nades, we can't bash the other maps for it.
Besides Apartments is played like: smoke - run - cap bridges - smoke - run - cap propaganda etc. I believe it more challenging if nades become more lethal. There's enough stuff to hide behind for Allies and it's more hard to get them away from the sandbags if your nades don't kill them even if they are at 1m meter distance of it.
 
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#7
Effective range in real life: 30m
Effective range in game: 2m

I'd settle for a nice 10m effective range, but TWI couldn't even compromise at that.

The grenades are operating at 1/15 their real life potential.

Why not go all out and turn this into a game where you can take 10 bullets to the chest before going down?
 
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#11
I love using sachels defensively, I often throw one at my feet before falling back, just so the enemy will run in and hopefully get blown to pieces.

But yeah, grenades are kinda weak, I'll give you that. there's been a few times where one's come through the window and I've been all "It's on the other side of the room, I'm safe!"
 
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#12
It's a shame too when the game's got such nice grenade physics.

Haven't played in a while (waiting till classic mode comes out for the main game), but from what I remember they're more like slightly lethal flashbangs ;). You literally have to be right next to one to die from it.
 
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#14
I'm actually quite happy with the grenades in RO2. Yea they were more powerful in Ost but they didn't have the nickname "mininukes" for nothing. It might be more realistic to buff them up but like we've seen in this game making something realistic doesn't mean the gameplay will be more realistic, infact it's possible it will result in a less realistic experience like giving you realistic vision and realizing you can't put up your head for one second from cover without losing it. There are other factors in play like how soldiers irl rarely cooked their nades because the fuse was shorther or longer than normal, therefor the enemy could throw it back at you so you wouldn't throw a grenade that often in fear of it returning to you.
 
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#15
Crusher said:
I'm actually quite happy with the grenades in RO2. Yea they were more powerful in Ost but they didn't have the nickname "mininukes" for nothing. It might be more realistic to buff them up but like we've seen in this game making something realistic doesn't mean the gameplay will be more realistic, infact it's possible it will result in a less realistic experience like giving you realistic vision and realized you can't put up your head for one second from cover without losing it. There are other factors in play like how soldiers irl rarely cooked their nades because the fuse was shorther or longer than normal, therefor the enemy could throw it back at you so you wouldn't throw a grenade that often in fear of it returning to you.
Click to expand...

You currently have to "cook" them as time you hold them determines how far you want to throw them and second with current nades you need them to explode the moment they land under the enemy's ***. If they explode a second later you'll just injure him because he's already too far away from the nade again. Make those things stronger and you'll have to cook them less often.

Throwing back. Basically it's better to run but there's situations you can't run and honestly if such a **** ball lands in front of my feet I'd kick the hell out of the thing and when I'm prone I'd try to throw it. Because you'll die anyway but at least you tried to get it away from you and maybe you survive.


Mini-nukes, this could be a description of the nades by CoD guys who hate it when they get killed by a nade that is 3 meters away. I just checked on CoD WaW and it feels exactly the same like RO2. Nade lands 2 meters away from me and it won't punch my *** at all. Just bang! But no injuries, just a hit direction indicator. That's not RO for me, that's Eastern Front vacation.
 
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#17
Verluste said:
As I've said before in topics about the same subject: RO2 nades are indeed unrealistic but balanced.

There is far less nadespam in RO2, which is a huge advantage over RO1.
It's not like the grenades in RO2 are not effective, they will still clear a small room nicely.
Click to expand...

Yes, I remember all of those postings. :)
Still I believe you can follow me on an example:

Imagine you have a real life plane, now you want to make a RC plane shaped after its real life counterpart. Imagine you size down the wheels proportional to let's say 1:40. I believe those wheels are useless and you can't use them anymore. The wheels need to be sized bigger.

Same for balancing. Yes, there was nade spam and it was good the way it was. Nadespam is an effective way to keep people running certain paths. Keeping the enemy off those paths is vital to gameplay. Now, the same map that depended on this nadespam will be unplayable with the nades we have now.

Yes, they clean small rooms, like 2x2m, but this is far far from what you could use them for in Ostfront or Combined Arms. Throwing a nade in a 4x4 room should have people killed inside. Even a room at 8x8 should have people get killed. Maybe, really just maybe it would be okay if someone at the far end survives heavily injured (besides nades currently don't make you bleed). I also do agree that a nade thrown into a room sized like the ground floor of the Grain Elevator (imagine there was nothing in it) won't should not get the person standing at one end get killed by a nade thrown at the other end. But currently even people in a 2x2m sometimes survive a nade.

Are we actually playing a realism game here or are we playing a full arcade shooter? With all respect to balancing, the nades are too weak.
 
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#18
NoxNoctum said:
It's a shame too when the game's got such nice grenade physics.

Haven't played in a while (waiting till classic mode comes out for the main game), but from what I remember they're more like slightly lethal flashbangs ;). You literally have to be right next to one to die from it.
Click to expand...

Nice grenade physics? They bounce like tennis balls! Off of snow! :D

Makes it easy to bank them around corners, but every now and then you toss one in a factory on Red October, it hits a rafter 20 feet away, and bounces straight back to your feet...:eek:
 
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#19
I think anything up to 50% increase in range would be good with the current maps.

The maps are too small for a larger blast radius, so you have to compromise to keep the game fun (yes, it's still a game, not a simulator!).

And while you're at it, yes, they really do bounce too much. I never paid too much attention to it, but it's true. :p
 
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