RO2 MG42, PzIII, T70 on the way

[Cpt-Praxius]

Problem is : WHY DO YOU THINK MIDDLE WAR PERIOD IS REALLY BORING ??

I'm sorry, I seem to be having difficulty locating where I said this in my post.

I never said I did.

I thought I explained it very clearly:

Just leave the next RO3.... As Red Orchestra 3 without a specific focus on a limited set of years or a limited area of the Eastern Front.

"..... then you allow for more flexibility with which battles can be focused on (real or imaginary - Danzig / Apartments) and you can bring in just about any weapon that was used in WWII without people bickering and moaning over something being brought into the game from 1943 or 44."

^ This right here is the main point. I never said I found the Stalingrad conflict "Boring" nor did I say middle-war period is "Boring"

Right now we have people complaining about the MKB42 & AVT40 being in the game, as well as the PPS42 and now we have people complaining about the MG42.... heaven forbid someone bring up the STG44, G43 or any other later weapons.... or the PPD or any other earlier weapons.

Yes, we all know the STG44 and G43 weren't in Stalingrad, blah blah.... the point is that having the above problem of limiting the time frame and the battle area in which RO takes place limits weapons, battles, vehicles, everything in which made ROCA and RO1 have so much variety.

Which then leads to limiting modder's abilities to make maps outside of the grander area of the game due to limited weapons & vehicles that are in the game and thus, they first have to make them before they can then make the map.... and we all know how that worked out.

Red orchestra was an Antinazi resistance groups within Berlin ... from 41 to 43. All the spies have been killed in early 43.
Another come later. Black orchestra (spies who tried to kill Hitler) is inspirated from Red Orchestra.

If you want a late war game, call it "BLACK orchestra", And not "Red orchestra".

That makes even less sense as the game "Red Orchestra" doesn't have anything to do with spies, espionage or trying to kill Hitler. When the devs were making the mod originally it was thought to be an espionage type game, but they changed it to what we know today.... however the title remained Red Orchestra.

My point on that was exactly as I explained it already:
People are being sticklers over this weapon or that weapon or this vehicle or that not being in Stalingrad and therefore "Not Realistic" or that the game is meant to be "Realistic" as much as possible when this was never the case and if they want to go all Realistic, Authentic and Factual, then the game title itself shouldn't be what it is.

Call a late war game "Black Orchestra?"

RO1 was from 41-45..... 1945 being the end of the War (Mid to Late War Game) and yet the title remains.

Why would it change from Red to Black simply because someone wants a late war period game?

Secondly, since this isn't an Espionage game but a FPS set on the Front Lines of WWII, why would you call it "Anything Orchestra?"

Thirdly, I never said I wanted a Late War Period Game.... I would personally prefer one that doesn't have any specific date in its name so that you can throw in early, mid, late, whatever era of the War into the game and thus, more variety.

Red Orchestra is link to Operation Barbarossa, in june 41. Because German spies of Red Orchestra send the day of attack of Axis to Stalin in Moscow. Intent to call the game Red Orchestra is heavily link to the job of these spy in the Barbarossa operation period.

I don't think middle war period (and also early war period ) are so boring.

Never said it was boring.

And that's quite a stretch regarding your linkage of the espionage in Berlin to the entire Eastern War Conflict..... hell I suppose you could connect everything in WWII to each other. Let's call the next Red Orchestra "The Devil's Brigade: Soviet Front - Sept 1942 - October 1942"

 

[Higgs]

Many thanks to tripwire for delivering new content! Looking forward to seeing it all in-game.

I don't see why anyone would have a big problem with the MG42 in Stalingrad. Lets face it, many of the unlocks and weapons have been marring the game's authenticity since release, an issue that is a very dead horse at this point. There is some evidence suggesting it might have been there too, so good enough IMO.

I am however not looking forward to being on the receiving end of a bunch of MG42s and wonder whether map balance will be affected. I hope not, but the DT-29 would have been a nice boost for the Soviets. They weren't rare as every knocked-out T-34 would have had one available for use in an infantry role. A LMG with a higher ROF and larger magazine capacity perhaps with greater recoil would make for a good alternative to the DP-28. The world model already exists as part of the T-34 interior.

I also think 20 round magazines would be a nice unlock for the AVT-40. Yes, they were very rare and not terribly reliable, but the whole unlock system is a mess of anachronisms and faulty prototypes so why not add to the fire . I personally find the full auto AVT-40 useless with only ten rounds. 20 may make it a worthwhile option rather than a novelty that you sometimes use when you have forgotten to hit 6 at respawn.

 

[ro2player]

Panzer III and T 70 and MG 42 are welcome
It's good new...

It would be nice to see :

Stug III auf F8 or auf G
Su 122
Half-track M3
Sdkfz 250

 

[Großadmial Thrawn]

how about the StuH42, the Su-122 can double as Anti-Infantry (122mm HE rounds VS StuGs 7,5cm and due the longer barrel i think the long barreled StuGs would have less HE Filler in the Round then the short barreled) and anti tank (the HE round again... and i think the AP Rounds should be good enough against StuGs, Panzer IV etc)... and if the Precision of the SU-122 is as bad as IRL (against armoured targets) i think it could be interesting. E.G Soviets get 2 SU-122 and the Germans one StuG Ausf F or G and one StuH42... and a few bigger maps would be interesting... just sayin

 

[Jean_Luc_Picard]

nobody denies that tanks have their disadvantages. T34-76 disadvantage was small turret without commander, t70 disadvantage is only 2 crews.. pz3 and pz4 had square armor, thinner than t34's and less effective because its not sloped.

Slopped armor is overrated. Sure, it helps to bounce of SOME shells, but that's not everything. The only thing that matters is not being penetrated. The early war PzIV had much better quality armor than the T-34. The Aberdeen Proving Grounds tested one and found that the steel was soft on the inside among other things. That slopped armor takes up a hell of a lot of space, that's why the T-34 is bigger. This is why the PzIV is smaller.
In game it shouldn't matter whether the armor is slopped or not, because at most distances that we kill other tanks at the German 76mm shells had enough velocity to punch through even slopped armor. And don't think the Germans didn't know about slopped armor either, it was nothing new.

You also left out the biggest flaws of the T34. No radio and terrible optics and no commander's cupola. With no radio you can't coordinate your attacks with your allies. With the terrible optics and having no commander's cupola it's hard for the gunner/commander to find targets. Everyone talks about how great the armor was because one tank got hit like 30 or 40 times and none of them penetrated...that really just tells you how the tank couldn't figure out who was firing at them to fire back.

The T-34 also had horrible very loss rates. Partly that comes down to having no radios and partly it can be assumed that some crews weren't well trained. The Soviet Union had several thousand lend-leased diesel powered Sherman tanks. They had no where near the loss rates as the T-34 did, even in units that had both T-34s and Shermans.

And related to loss rates, a German tank knocked out might kill one or two crewmen, a T-34 hit often killed the whole crew.

Panther is a great tank but its too expensive

The Panther is another overrated tank. It had the same problems with other late-war tanks: Spalling.

russians have lowpowered PTRS without better BS-41 ammo while germans have better PTRS with insane penetration 55mm, and so on..

I actually find the PTRS on the Russian side overpowered. I can easily get penetrations on a Pz-IV, but it's hard except for on the tracks for the T-34.

 

[aaz777]

Slopped armor is overrated. Sure, it helps to bounce of SOME shells, but that's not everything.

HOW did i overrate sloped armor? i just said that its better than square armor like on german tanks untill panther. Not only because it has chance of ricochete and its more effective, but simply because its economy of weight. Do you know Pythagorean theorem ?

C is soviet armor, A+B is german. Sloped armor simply makes tank lighter and allows to add more armor by thickness.

The early war PzIV had much better quality armor than the T-34. The Aberdeen Proving Grounds tested one and found that the steel was soft on the inside among other things....
...terrible optics

you will be surprised but americans that tested T34 on Aberdeen polygon also said that... soviet optics on t34 ARE THE BEST IN THE WORLD.
but yes i agree that early T34s had bad quality of some things. Armor, awful air filter, etc, and this testing on Aberdeen polygon proved it. This was simple child problems that every tank have when its " fresh ". Lets not forget that T34 of early production, t34 of middle war production and late war t34-85 are just different tanks, just like early/late pz4 or pz3, just like ro1 and ro2 are different games with almost nothing similar.

The T-34 also had horrible very loss rates.

ah again these stories about K/D ratio.
When will you finally understand that this is IMPOSSIBLE to get real K/D ratio of tank vs tank fighting? simply because tank vs tank happened rarely. There was also INFANTRY with AT guns and ARTILLERY. Large part of soviet tank losses of 1941 were not combat, they happened because tank was broken/ had no fuel and crews couldnt fix this, so they simply threw tank on the road.
Those soviet tanks that were in combat at the beginning of war, were mostly destroyed by arty and air support. 70% of german tanks was destroyed by soviet artillery, ~2500 german tanks were destroyed with soviet bottles. YOU CANT COMPARE TANKS BY THEIR LOSSES.

The Panther is another overrated tank. It had the same problems with other late-war tanks: Spalling.

how did i overrate it? i just said that this tank was good. It was first mas produced german tank with sloped armor like on t34. Its big advantage was the frontal armor, its big disadvantage was thin side armor. By other words, panther's armor was too different, tank was immortal from front and easy to penetrate from side.
The low quality of armor was a big problem of all german late war tanks ( 44-45 ). Panther was produced since 1943, so many of these were with good armor. But of course, panthers produced after the moment when nazi germany lost sources of alloying elements had disgusting armor.

I actually find the PTRS on the Russian side overpowered.

are you serious? HOW is it overpowered? Do you want russians to have PTRS with even lower penetration than it was in real life with WORSE ammo? if soviet PTRS will get several MM lower penetration, it wont penetrate pz4 even from side, while german PTRS will penetrate pz4 from ANY side and almost every distance that is available in game and penetrate t34 even from front ( with correct angle ).Soviet PTRS is not overpowered from historical accuracy point of view and from balance point of view.

 

[Großadmial Thrawn]

Its big advantage was the frontal armor, its big disadvantage was thin side armor

actually it's side armor was around as strong as those of most of the allied tanks afaik and the German tanks that weren't Tigers or Tiger IIs... so it wasn't a bigger weakspot then on any other WW2 Tank

and afaik this has been showed that it could be nothing more than a myth

But of course, panthers produced after the moment when nazi germany lost sources of alloying elements had disgusting armor.

here on the War Thunder Forum was a Thread about it:
http://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/146975-the-truth-about-german-steel-quality/
(you need an account to read it... stupid... i know..)

just sayin'

 

[seienchin88]

You also left out the biggest flaws of the T34. No radio and terrible optics and no commander's cupola. With no radio you can't coordinate your attacks with your allies. With the terrible optics and having no commander's cupola it's hard for the gunner/commander to find targets. Everyone talks about how great the armor was because one tank got hit like 30 or 40 times and none of them penetrated...that really just tells you how the tank couldn't figure out who was firing at them to fire back.

The T-34 also had horrible very loss rates. Partly that comes down to having no radios and partly it can be assumed that some crews weren't well trained. The Soviet Union had several thousand lend-leased diesel powered Sherman tanks. They had no where near the loss rates as the T-34 did, even in units that had both T-34s and Shermans.

And related to loss rates, a German tank knocked out might kill one or two crewmen, a T-34 hit often killed the whole crew.

I agree on this part. Especially on the Sherman beeing a better tank than the t34-76.
I dont think Sloped armour is Overrated though.
You said it yourself, the t34 Steel was often very low quality(again Focus on Quantity over quality in soviet Union which was smart given their assets) and still it often got Hit often without a knockout when it was hit with weapons of the Year 1941.
After the pz4 was upgraded, tungsten(?not sure about english word) ammunition
Was introduced and shaped charge ammo for some anti tank guns were introduced the T34 with low rate of fire, bad sights and other weaknesses became obsolete very quick.
That is why T-34 and thereby tank losses in general were 1943 the highest.
The panther and tiger were still very few in most of 1943. panzer 4s and sturmgesch

 

[Jean_Luc_Picard]

HOW did i overrate sloped armor?

My point is that when people bring up the T34 they always bring up it's slopped armor first and foremost, like it was so revolutionary. Also, the PzIV HAS slopped armor too. It's not just a box. It's just like all Main Battle tanks of today and just have slopped frontal armor.

Sloped armor simply makes tank lighter and allows to add more armor by thickness.

The T-34 still weighed more than the Pz-IV, and was a lot bigger because of that slopped armor. Having a larger silhouette makes it easier to be hit.

you will be surprised but americans that tested T34 on Aberdeen polygon also said that... soviet optics on t34 ARE THE BEST IN THE WORLD.

Yes, I read that too. I found it funny. I would really love to see Aberdeen's report and a good translation of what the Soviets said of Aberdeen's report. We are just seeing a translation of what the Soviets said of Aberdeen's report, and it's not that good of a translation imho. And you don't know how good their translation was and if any propaganda was pushed in either.

This was simple child problems that every tank have when its " fresh ".

Things that should have been worked out long before it came into production. An air filter that let so much dust into the engine that it destroyed their engine on their test vehicle is a MAJOR design flaw. They fixed that though.

Lets not forget that T34 of early production, t34 of middle war production and late war t34-85 are just different tanks, just like early/late pz4 or pz3, just like ro1 and ro2 are different games with almost nothing similar.

The T34 design didn't really change that much from start to finish. They basically just added a different turret and a better gun. They never fixed the horrible deficiencies of not having a radio in every tank and no commander's cupola.

are you serious? HOW is it overpowered? Do you want russians to have PTRS with even lower penetration than it was in real life with WORSE ammo? if soviet PTRS will get several MM lower penetration, it wont penetrate pz4 even from side, while german PTRS will penetrate pz4 from ANY side and almost every distance that is available in game and penetrate t34 even from front ( with correct angle ).Soviet PTRS is not overpowered from historical accuracy point of view and from balance point of view.

I sometimes play as an AT gunner on Bridges. it's very hard to get a penetration on the T34, while the couple of times I've played defense on that map as a Russian in campaign I can easily get penetrations with the PTRS. My first or second shot I killed both the gunner and commander in the tank.

 

[aaz777]

Also, the PzIV HAS slopped armor too. It's not just a box.

what i see on the picture is exactly a box.

The T-34 still weighed more than the Pz-IV, and was a lot bigger because of that slopped armor. Having a larger silhouette makes it easier to be hit.

pz4 dimensions: 5890; 2880; 2680; pz4 weight - 21-26
t34 dimensions: 6680; 3000; 2405; t34 weight - 26,5

WHERE is it " a lot bigger " ?

Yes, I read that too. I found it funny. I would really love to see Aberdeen's report and a good translation of what the Soviets said of Aberdeen's report. We are just seeing a translation of what the Soviets said of Aberdeen's report, and it's not that good of a translation imho. And you don't know how good their translation was and if any propaganda was pushed in either.

so everything that you dont like can be explained as soviet propaganda?

Things that should have been worked out long before it came into production. An air filter that let so much dust into the engine that it destroyed their engine on their test vehicle is a MAJOR design flaw. They fixed that though.

key words - they fixed that. Thats why early T34 and T34, for example, produced in late 1942 are different vehicles.

The T34 design didn't really change that much from start to finish. They basically just added a different turret and a better gun. They never fixed the horrible deficiencies of not having a radio in every tank and no commander's cupola.

are you serious?
t34-85 didnt have radios and cupola? what a wonderful stories

i will tell you a secret, at 1943 all t34s got radios and many t34-76 got cupolas.
Even t34 produced in 1942 differs from t34 1940 a lot. Much higher quality, many fixed " child problems ", different turret, better F-34 cannon instead of L11, cupola, radios, other things..
T34s were different not only by time when it was produced but also factory where it was produced.

I sometimes play as an AT gunner on Bridges. it's very hard to get a penetration on the T34, while the couple of times I've played defense on that map as a Russian in campaign I can easily get penetrations with the PTRS. My first or second shot I killed both the gunner and commander in the tank.

this is problem of pz4, not the PTRS.
German PTRS has 55mm penetration, Russian PTRS has 36mm. Russian PTRS penetration is similar to real PTRS penetration with B-32 ammo while german PTRS penetration is MUCH higher than real PTRS with ANY ammo.
This is funny how you claim that pz4's armor isnt worse than t34's and slopped armor doesnt mean much and at the same time you claim that ATR with low 36mm penetration destroys pz4 too easy while another overpowered ATR with 55mm penetration doesnt destroy t34 as easy.

 

[Jean_Luc_Picard]

what i see on the picture is exactly a box.

Then you'd call any modern tank "just a box" too. Almost all of it's frontal armor is slopped.

so everything that you dont like can be explained as soviet propaganda?

No, but I'm not discounting it. I think there is at least some translating errors on one or both translations.

T34s were different not only by time when it was produced but also factory where it was produced.

Yes, that's why there is no such thing as interchangeable parts among T34s. To be far, only the US was smart enough and had the manufacturing capabilities to do such a thing. But at least most other counties tried to at least standardize parts.

this is problem of pz4, not the PTRS.
German PTRS has 55mm penetration, Russian PTRS has 36mm. Russian PTRS penetration is similar to real PTRS penetration with B-32 ammo while german PTRS penetration is MUCH higher than real PTRS with ANY ammo.
This is funny how you claim that pz4's armor isnt worse than t34's and slopped armor doesnt mean much and at the same time you claim that ATR with low 36mm penetration destroys pz4 too easy while another overpowered ATR with 55mm penetration doesnt destroy t34 as easy.

It's a problem with the tank in the game. I shouldn't be able to pierce the frontal armor of the PZ-IV's turret and kill the commander and gunner that easily! These guns were designed to be able to penetrate the sides and rear armor and to damage the treads. When I fire on a T34 most shots ricochet off. And not just PTRS rounds, even tank rounds from the PZ-IV at 500 meters. At that distance the armor slopped doesn't matter all too much. When I'm in a T34 I can easily get PZ-IV kills easily on the first hits at those distances. I think the game "balances" the tanks too much. I'd rather it be more realistic.

Maybe it can penetrate 55mm of armor because the armor is of that bad quality?

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

*Walks into thread to see what's new*

*Sees some History Fanatics showing off how big their schlongs are*

*Backs away slowly*

Spoiler!

 

[JagdpantherX]

Then you'd call any modern tank "just a box" too. Almost all of it's frontal armor is slopped.

The only thing that is notably sloped that actually matters is the upper glacis, which doesn't even cover the whole front. The point is that you have a huge box above the upper glacis.

All modern tanks that I've seen have extreme slopes on the front. There is no nearly flat surface.

Maybe it can penetrate 55mm of armor because the armor is of that bad quality?

No, it has 55mm of real penetration and is tested for higher quality armour, which suggest that it might actually penetrate more than that when fired against the low quality armour that is the T34. That might not be the case though. If the germans didn't get this ammo they wouldn't have a effective AT gun.

 

[seienchin88]

*Walks into thread to see what's new*

*Sees some History Fanatics showing off how big their schlongs are*

*Backs away slowly*

Spoiler!

Funny i was about to Post the same ingenious pic when I saw you on the threat whining about: its just a Game. Leave ro2 alone guys.
In the end We might be the virtual schlong compares but at least not the Control Freak trying to Control what is Spoken about on a forum... Without beeing the Admin.
In the end noone is still using this forum Except the few Players caring about Ro2 enough to Compare schlongs about it

We should get back to the topic but what else is there to say? We have no Infos how they are implemented. Thats where all the discussion started

 

[Cpt-Praxius]

I'm sorry, I don't remember telling people to do anything or demanding this or that.


I may have suggested a few things and expressed my opinion, but I didn't tell anybody to do anything.


By all means show me where I did.


But it is just a game.


Now excuse me while I go and continue to control your life through 3rd party resources.

 

[ro2player]

Cpt-Praxius,

"..... then you allow for more flexibility with which battles can be focused on (real or imaginary - Danzig / Apartments) and you can bring in just about any weapon that was used in WWII without people bickering and moaning over something being brought into the game from 1943 or 44."

"Danzig ?"...It's tractory apparts. You watch RO 2 with the eye of RO 1. Can you watch RO 2 with the eyes of RO 2, please ?? Can you admit RO 2 has not the same way to be RO than RO 1. ? Understand middle war period as a period to discover.

Which then leads to limiting modder's abilities to make maps outside of the grander area of the game due to limited weapons & vehicles that are in the game and thus, they first have to make them before they can then make the map.... and we all know how that worked out.

You help to make guilty people who work in mliddle war period. Because middle war period is ALSO a world to discover !

Why people who could work in middle war period should be guilty ?Limited ? From which point of view ?
From late war period ??
From middle war period ?
from early war period ?

From WHICH POINT OF VIEW you talk ?
HOW can you say "limited" ? Which point of view make you said it ?

Why a modder of middle war period should become guilty on a middle war period game ?

That makes even less sense as the game "Red Orchestra" doesn't have anything to do with spies, espionage or trying to kill Hitler. When the devs were making the mod originally it was thought to be an espionage type game, but they changed it to what we know today.... however the title remained Red Orchestra.

Red Orchestra is linked to Operation Barbarossa. Red Orchestra a little thing to do with spies. It's make sense.

My point on that was exactly as I explained it already:
People are being sticklers over this weapon or that weapon or this vehicle or that not being in Stalingrad and therefore "Not Realistic" or that the game is meant to be "Realistic" as much as possible when this was never the case and if they want to go all Realistic, Authentic and Factual, then the game title itself shouldn't be what it is.

Call a late war game "Black Orchestra?"

RO1 was from 41-45..... 1945 being the end of the War (Mid to Late War Game) and yet the title remains.

Why would it change from Red to Black simply because someone wants a late war period game?

-On your first point
Yes, RO 2 is a game for specialists. And it's good no ?
Have a problem with it ? No specialists can play to it. But it's game for specialists.

Secondly, since this isn't an Espionage game but a FPS set on the Front Lines of WWII, why would you call it "Anything Orchestra?"

-On your second point
Red Orchestra was link to middle war period more than late war period. in early 43, all spies of the Red Orchestra were deads.
On Late war period it's Black orchestra who was active.

Front Lines of WWII were linked to spy action - with informations about Operation Barbarossa given to Stalin before the starting of the attack.

Thirdly, I never said I wanted a Late War Period Game.... I would personally prefer one that doesn't have any specific date in its name so that you can throw in early, mid, late, whatever era of the War into the game and thus, more variety.

-On your third point
A ww2 game is EVER link to a period...
By default it's late war period.

Question :
A game with late war vehicle and late war weapons is ?...
is a late war game...

Do you want a early war game with late war weapon ?
Or late war game with early period ??

Period of a game ( a ww2 game i mean ) is ever here. You can't counter this question.
It's a legitim question for a ww2 game.

You don't care ? Ok you are free.
So don't care people care about vehicles, weapons, history, and realism.


- You said :

I don't care for internet armchair warriors spouting off their omnipotent knowledge on WWII to the point they can argue about the exact date and the weather conditions such and such equipment made it or didn't make it to the Eastern Front for whatever battle a map is portraying.

Kill them all, History will recognize the good players !

More seriously, I must admit it's a better way than your.
Don't trust you have better way to be link to History and Realism thank your "I don't care about" position. (just my opinion)

Reality and History are here. It's More interresting to see Clash between Ideas and Theory than to not see this clash.

You can play the game as History never existed or never exist for this game.
And you can play this game as History exist.
It's why I fight your position.

-You said :

People take things way too seriously if they have their precious immersion ruined while playing a video game if another player is using a weapon they feel would have less than a 15% chance of being in that one guy's hands during the battle they're trying to play out.

Your problem is to NOT consider playing in historic way is not good. Playing in historic way make honor to the game.
It's the immersion ! The actual immersion, I mean.

I think it's legitimate to complain about middle war period.

Cpt Praxius, Mister Bla bla, I prefer historic Bla Bla to no-historic Bla Bla.
If you don't care, why you create so much BLA BLA for nothing ?

You said :

I don't care what WWII era weapons or vehicles are in the game

People who search with history ( either with good or bad reasons or ideas but I don't argue about their good or bad reasons. it's another problem(s) ) has more right to talk than you.
You can attack them they have bad way to search with history : but you can't attack people because they want to serch with history.

I am disagree with your point of view.

*Walks into thread to see what's new*

*Sees some History Fanatics showing off how big their schlongs are*

*Backs away slowly*

Spoiler!

Beside History Fanatics there are No-History Fanatics.
We (you, me and others) are always fanatics of somebody else...Problem : it's to be RIGHT and to be fanatic. I am not sure Fanatics of No-History have MORE RIGHT than Fanatics of History. (Jut my opinion)


Cheers

 

[Jank]

From that picture, only 20% or less of the front-facing armor on that P3 is sloped at any significant degree, only the portion with the extra tracks attached for storage.


That thing is the definition of non-sloped armor...


Now THIS is sloped armor:

And even that is only 60% sloped, the turret is not sloped enough to matter much. Remember, it's about making the horizontal incident angle encounter a thicker amount of armor to penetrate.

X>W

 

[Rapier_21]

When they get done adding the MG42, they should add the RPD, too.

I mean, if we're going to have late-war guns, the Russians ought to get some love too.

Maybe even some prototype SKS rifles to go with it, too.

At least this would give parity of numbers with the Germans for MGs, especially since they still refuse to give Russian MGs replaceable barrels. Or upgrades of any kind, really, to the DP-28.

Could've at least given us the 60-round drum off the DPT.

 

[ro2player]

When they get done adding the MG42, they should add the RPD, too.

I mean, if we're going to have late-war guns, the Russians ought to get some love too.

MG 42 come in early 42. It's a middle war period weapon.
...Or maybe for you 1942 it's late war period ?

 

[mrsirr]

Yeah the MG42 was at Stalingrad, this has been established. The RPD was not