Yeah I think that's the main issue. I don't know if they can just change it to make it work that way.
RO2 MG42 needs a nerf
- Thread starter Torio
- Start date
Perhaps the IOM folks can, but I'm guessing TWI wouldn't because it would be messing with the progression and leveling. Then you would have people cry they could no longer use the weapon they spent time progressing towards. Should have left all that out, but that is an old argument...
Played Pavlovs house today. Game was totally ruined by level 99 mg farmers (Seriously you get to level 99 and still only play mgs? WTF?). They had over 200 kills combined. Allies snipers could/would not take them out. Mass slaughter. I would say Ally team was actually better and managed to cap C every time under great losses but C is just another deathtrap for the allies since the MGs shoot even through 2 walls and supress you even in the cellar (I am not kidding). Meanwhile the D spawn had an MG42 player in it killing every spawning player (Server seem to had spawn protection off? Or is it a bug? You literally died the second you spawn. No moving or anything)
I really really hate this weapon. It makes everyone a good player and spoils the fun for many others. I cant deny that playing it is very fun since you easily hip shoot 50 meters and have the best CQC weapon and the best ranged weapon in the game but it really bothers me.
Well back to RS. MGs in that game are still great but map layout and better counter weapons like mortars or flamers make it much more fun to me.
I really really hate this weapon. It makes everyone a good player and spoils the fun for many others. I cant deny that playing it is very fun since you easily hip shoot 50 meters and have the best CQC weapon and the best ranged weapon in the game but it really bothers me.
Well back to RS. MGs in that game are still great but map layout and better counter weapons like mortars or flamers make it much more fun to me.
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I've already proposed this but I could make multiple role variants for the mapper to use, ie no MG42, etc which would change the available weapons a player can choose from (not saying lets remove the Garand because it's too OP. It's not, in fact I prefer the bolt. But what I'm saying is to allow historical accuracy and balancing a map.)
The problem is white-listing it or even attempting to get TWI to make it official (has there ever been player made content that's been official for RO2? Not Maps, content: weapons, coding, etc...). I'd like to talk to a Developer about this to see if this can be included in the roles, and what they'd be okay with, and what they wouldn't.
The problem is white-listing it or even attempting to get TWI to make it official (has there ever been player made content that's been official for RO2? Not Maps, content: weapons, coding, etc...). I'd like to talk to a Developer about this to see if this can be included in the roles, and what they'd be okay with, and what they wouldn't.
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I do think the MG42 kinda breaks the balance of the game that was somewhat carefully established
Unfortunately, TWI seems to like some sides and not the other
(Germans and Americans)
-Germans get MKB but the Russians are given no rough equivalent (even though there is very spotty evidence that ANY MKB's were sent...and if they were only 20 some odd ones made it)
-Germans now get the MG42
-Germans have better AT gun ammunition
-German tank has always had an edge
-PPSH given 30 round stick mags from start, even though drums were standard
-Germans get Fantasy uber rare MP40II
-US side gets shotguns or carbines on their BAR class, Flamer etc. (while the Knee mortar only gets a pistol even at very high level)
-Flamer was buffed in Beta, Knee mortar nerfed (because flamer players were sad about running to far and not getting enough kills, and complaints that the knee mortars historic killing blast radius was too effective. you know because history isn't fun unless your flame guy is an Olympic track star who can spawn on squad leader.)
-Very few maps where US side is stuck with Springfield
-Defensive Flamers
-Banzai charge is kinda a useless tactic unless you are trying to cover ground fast. because of above flamers
-Not a single upgrade for the Type 38 (other than bayo), no feild attached bipod bipod, not even a Springfield capture unlock
-US side gets 1911 standard, with the Japanese with under powered type 14, even though some uncommon alternates with stronger cartridges were used.
but I could go on
Unfortunately, TWI seems to like some sides and not the other
(Germans and Americans)
-Germans get MKB but the Russians are given no rough equivalent (even though there is very spotty evidence that ANY MKB's were sent...and if they were only 20 some odd ones made it)
-Germans now get the MG42
-Germans have better AT gun ammunition
-German tank has always had an edge
-PPSH given 30 round stick mags from start, even though drums were standard
-Germans get Fantasy uber rare MP40II
-US side gets shotguns or carbines on their BAR class, Flamer etc. (while the Knee mortar only gets a pistol even at very high level)
-Flamer was buffed in Beta, Knee mortar nerfed (because flamer players were sad about running to far and not getting enough kills, and complaints that the knee mortars historic killing blast radius was too effective. you know because history isn't fun unless your flame guy is an Olympic track star who can spawn on squad leader.)
-Very few maps where US side is stuck with Springfield
-Defensive Flamers
-Banzai charge is kinda a useless tactic unless you are trying to cover ground fast. because of above flamers
-Not a single upgrade for the Type 38 (other than bayo), no feild attached bipod bipod, not even a Springfield capture unlock
-US side gets 1911 standard, with the Japanese with under powered type 14, even though some uncommon alternates with stronger cartridges were used.
but I could go on
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OK, to counter,
-mkb shouldn't be in the game but isn't overpowered, (I kill them all the time)
-MG -42 is realistic and the operator can be killed with one well aimed shot.
-stardard at ammo couldn't hurt the T-34, the German anti tank unit needs to be able hurt the Russian tank.
-hehehehehe Panzer 3 vs T-70 lol
-it's 35 rounds, and still more effective.
-MP40/II is hardly op, the same level ppsh is better in everyway.
-it was historically acurate, plus flamethrower runs out fuel quickly and has limited range, B.A.R. is somewhat questionable but hardly op. Knee mortar gets a rifle.
-I agree flamethrower is hardly op and the knee mortar is pretty scary even with the nerf, ever fought someone who is REALLY good with it, it's terrifying
-Hardly any were it would be accurate
-I thought there was an issue with class selection were you need to have the same number of classes or something. I don't remember what it was but I remember making sence.
- no it isn't, when used right, it is incredably useful.
- it doesn't need one, plenty of other guns have no upgrades either, so what?
- type 14 is actually excellent in game, ever use it?
So really, RO2 is generally balanced (except for a few maps) when there is no axis teamstack, but I doubt there is anything Tripwire can do about it though.
From my experience in Rising Storm, when no one knows what they're doing, the Americans will win by sheer firepower, when the americans dont know what they're doing, the japanese will crush them, when the japanese dont know whar they're doing, they will be assaulted off the map (even when they are attacking.....) But when both sides know what they're doing, its well balanced (and a really tough fight, i love it)
PTRS and PTRD even with BS-41 tungsten carbide ammo could not do anything to T-34.
Why should germans get a russian weapon with wrong characteristics for.. no reason?
Give GERMANS their GERMAN weapons.
Give them pzb39 that would be able to fight against T-70 and kampfpistole/sturmpistole with heavy cumulative grenades that penetrate 80mm to fight with T-34.
This would be perfect, but different balance and very good for gameplay, and also relatively realistic. Russians get powerful AT rifles with maximum 40-45 mm penetration, while germans get grenade launchers with short range but 80mm penetration.
But no, lets give germans russian weapon with wrong characteristics because.. just because we want so. Probably because german weapons are all around better than russian.
Imagine what would happen if soviets had captured MG-34 with explosive ammo as standart MG role weapon. This is exactly the same nonsense as german PTRS. But everybody would probably yell that soviets are unfairly and unrealistically buffed and that TWI are commies.
Tripwire probably didn't feel like making more antitank weapons for the Germans, it's easier to buff the ptrs rather than make a whole new weapon. (I personally wish they had made more weapons, but I understand why they did what they did)
Okay,
Lets make only 1 weapon, for example, mosin rifle. then give it to germans. Then buff it with belt unlock and full auto to simulate machineguns. Then reduce the size and this is SMG.
We can make whole game with just 1 weapon!
Lets make only 1 weapon, for example, mosin rifle. then give it to germans. Then buff it with belt unlock and full auto to simulate machineguns. Then reduce the size and this is SMG.
We can make whole game with just 1 weapon!
I mean, I don't know exact details. But it was my understanding that TW didn't have time to do all the things they intended to do. So some of the design choices aren't choices so much as just what could be done with the alotted time/resources.
PPS-42 is
1) historically inaccurate for all maps in game
2) worse by all parameters than standart soviet PPSh, and for this reason PPS doesnt add anything to gameplay
3) Unrealistically nerfed even more than PPSh.
If they didnt have enough time to give germans their own german weapon, why they included other things that are much less important?
1) Even if we just say Stalingrad (which is no longer a constraint) it went on until Feb 1943. Production of the gun began in Dec42.
2) It adds variety to the game. An addition doesn't have to be something that's better than anything else in the game...
3) How is it nerfed? It's a piece of crap irl, that was the whole point, cheap cheap cheap...
2) It adds variety to the game. An addition doesn't have to be something that's better than anything else in the game...
3) How is it nerfed? It's a piece of crap irl, that was the whole point, cheap cheap cheap...
1) production of the gun began in dec42 in blockaded Leningrad, which is a little bit far from Stalingrad.
2) It does not add any variety to the game because its overall worse than already existing weapon. There is no reason to take PPS over the PPSh.
3) It's recognized as the best SMG of ww2, it was copied by others and produced after the war and it's overall much better than Mp40.
Oh yeah Sestroretsk is in St Petersburg lol ok yeah.
It still adds variety because its different. Adding 10 crappy weapons would dramatically increase variety, which has nothing to do with comparative quality.
I assume you mean best SMG was the PPSh, and yeah it's better than the MP40 in the game too, so I dunno what the nerf is there. Anyway how is the PPS42 nerfed MORE than the PPSh?
It still adds variety because its different. Adding 10 crappy weapons would dramatically increase variety, which has nothing to do with comparative quality.
I assume you mean best SMG was the PPSh, and yeah it's better than the MP40 in the game too, so I dunno what the nerf is there. Anyway how is the PPS42 nerfed MORE than the PPSh?
It has even higher recoil. PPSh already has ridiculous recoil that is uncomparably worse than MP40, while in reali life their recoil is almost the same with may be a little difference. If i am not wrong, PPSH has 80 recoil and PPS 95, or something like that. + nonsense stock unlock.
Keep in mind the PPS was added after the game was out. An added weapon is very simple. However, overhauling the AT weapons by adding and removing various weapons would be very disruptive I imagine