MG needs it's presence to be greater
- Thread starter beh0lder
- Start date
+1 to this. It'd also make blind fire more useful, as you can keep your head down and spray, hoping to convince the guys shooting at you to take cover and peeking out to correct your aim from time to time. You have the ammo capacity and RoF to make this a viable way to establish a position so that you can go to sniping properly once they're all taking cover.
Great suggestion, i love it ! Would really help.
To TW, pelase remove the Y-axis, view centering when deploying on an object/in a window.
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I am trying to play this role, as in RO1 and other FPS as Insurgency was one of my favourites, but deploying the MG is really a pain in the *ss...
Moving prone is also really difficult...
I also do airsoft with a LMG, and when you creep in the floor you do it with the gun traversed, as riflemen do, and it was in RO1. The movement in the floor now is terrible... getting over something is difficult and deploying over windows is slow and with very limited traverse, and that makes that 90% of your deaths as MG are because deployment problems... and that is frustrating...
Moving prone is also really difficult...
I also do airsoft with a LMG, and when you creep in the floor you do it with the gun traversed, as riflemen do, and it was in RO1. The movement in the floor now is terrible... getting over something is difficult and deploying over windows is slow and with very limited traverse, and that makes that 90% of your deaths as MG are because deployment problems... and that is frustrating...
- If you undeploy (right-click) the LMG, you will cradle it in your arms like a rifle, and crawl faster too.
- The traverse of a deployed LMG in RO2 is different from other games because RO2 makes you pivot around the MG, instead of the MG pivoting around you.
- You should really avoid deploying in a window. Not only does it silhouette you, but the field of fire is too large to control. For best results, deploy while you're prone, with cover or concealment to your flanks. In almost all cases, deploying when upright is like a big SHOOT ME signal.
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Red Orchestra 2 Heroes of Stalingrad MG-34 gameplay - YouTube
Watch this video,the MG's shouldn't be buffed in a way that promotes using it like this. You couldn't do that in Red Orchestra Ostfront and shouldn't be allowed to do it in Red Orchestra 2. The lack of sway on other guns and fast ads make sniping out mg guys too easy. Hipfiring MGs allow players to run and gun like this.
Tripwire,just try building upon Ostfront instead of trying to make the game into a generic shooter.
Holy shiiiiiiit! He was killing people from FIVE METERS AWAY! Clearly this is impossible, and should never be allowed! It has nothing to do with the fact that the Soviet players were oblivious idiots who didn't hear the MG-34 firing in the next room, or who couldn't out-shoot a guy that took 10-15 rounds to land a killshot. This is clearly an egregious break from acceptable reality and proof that RO2 is nothing more than a CoD clone and that TWI sold out so they could be evil.
Seriously, longest kill distance I saw was 16m. This is in addition to the fact that MGers have the least amount of sprint (equal to engineers, I think).
On single shot mode.
Hitting one out of every 15-20 shots in rapid-fire semi-auto.
I fail to see the problem here.
I mean honestly, a single rifleman who was paying even the tiniest bit of attention to the bullets pinging around him could have dropped the MG'er without breaking a sweat.
Ya, I've seen this video, and I've seen quite a few people get 50-60 kills using the crouching hip fire method. That's how alot of people resort to leveling their mg, using deployment as a last resort or only deploying when playing the defending side. I'd like to see hip firing gone away with totally for a better deployment system. There wouldn't be a reason an MG would have to resort to this if the deployment and cover system weren't unrealistically inconvenient.
edit: The same thing can be said for other guns hip firing, they are just as accurate if not more. It's a universal problem with the game in general. Right now i'm generally disappointed in the lone-wolf style unorganized combat I've been seeing on every single server and this is just one of the many ways players will adapt to it. The MG is supposed to be a team oriented weapon, and with noone watching your flanks and countless amounts of people run and gunning with ppsh's and mkb's your a sitting duck. People resort to these things for a reason, because they think it's more effective then playing properly ( whether it is or not is up to you to decide )
at least this is fixed, i think?
Red Orchestra 2 Beta Cheater/bug exploiter - Kauz - YouTube
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yeah the german infantry was built around its machine guns, which makes it all the more interesting how MG's are rather trivial in this game.
And they are ironically the most niche/situational damn near close to useless gun in the game.
Other then some hugely annoying setup issues (trying to setup should never put you into cover! Why does it do this when there is already a seperate key to do so?) the MGs I think are well implemented. The problem is all other guns are far too easy to use when out of position (or out of stanima or when shot and bleeding).
Best hope for a mod though because TW doesn't really make those kinds of changes to their released games.
Best hope for a mod though because TW doesn't really make those kinds of changes to their released games.
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Hipfiring was a major mechanic in RO1...
Plus, it's a simple matter of fire saturation. If someone is moving across an open space, and I roughly estimate where the barrel of my gun is going to put the rounds, and then dump 15-30 rounds at that target, you think it's more likely that I miss every shot than I hit one? It's not like the bullets are going to alter their course because I wasn't aiming properly, if I have a good eye for estimation there's nothing stopping me from saturating a target.
And again, why didn't those riflemen notice they were being shot at, and rather than continue to lemming forward, take cover and seek the shooter? It's not like a hip-firing LMGer is going to win a pop-up duel with a rifleman.
How does that relate at all to what I was saying?
Are you suggesting that the trigger should somehow disable unless it detects the comforting closeness of a nearby windowsill? Perhaps the bullets should curve around a target they would normally have hit because the guy that fired them didn't have his sights jammed up his nose?
Let's not forget the piles of videos of people shooting an LMG from the hip IRL, both modern and contemporary. Perhaps they're somehow hacking?
It relates to you saying closest kill was 12 meters, which would be acceptable accuracy for hipfiring.
Unfortunately there was a kill at 60m distance with severe downward angle on a moving target, which then again would be a lucky shot IRL. And I do mean: amazing lucky shot. This guy did it twice in a row which again is in IRL, well I think you guess what I think it is in real life. Leaving profanities out of this and keeping it simple, IMHO it would be just simply impossible.
You may, by all means disagree, but I intend to keep my opinion on the matter as well. But I will make you an offer to stop by and replicate the trick, again in real life, if yout think it is quite normal event in combat to pull out shots like that. So if travelling in Northern Europe: gun and ammo is on me. Well, at least say first 200 rounds if the first two shots won't do it.
Dude, did you somehow miss the 15-20 shots it took him to get that one lucky shot? Did you miss all of the missed shots he dumped down-range? He gets a few lucky kills at 50 meters (still insanely close range, by the way) and this is supposed to be impossible?
I maintain that it's not his fault that the other players let him sit there and plink 20-30 shots off the ground next to their feet. Those players just suck. They should have recognized the sound of getting shot at, taken cover, and tried to identify their assailant. Unless you're somehow suggesting that a hipfire LMG would stand a chance in hell against an ADS rifle, I fail to see how this is unrealistic, impossible, or even that far-fetched.
95% of the killshots in that video were under 15m. He gets a handful (like, I can count on one hand) over that, and it's an unrealistic depiction of gun mechanics that should be impossible and should never happen despite the fact that he -clearly- missed 99% of the shots he made at targets at that range.
I'm unimpressed. However, you've made it clear that nothing I say will sway you from your "THIS IS UNREALISTIC AND SHOULD NEVER HAPPEN" stance, so this isn't really a discussion and we aren't going to get anything valuable out of it.
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You can't shoot an MG like that, you just can't. For a start the thing is terrifically heavy, next the recoil should cause it to ride up like a mule on speed.
The simple fact is that at the moment the reduced recoil on a good amount of the weapons, the lack of sway and the robotic arms that allows pin-point aiming in a nansecond ruins any sense of realism.
As for the MG in relation to this thread (i.e. the title) the MG should have a greated effect. I've said on various occassions, perhaps maybe even on this thread, that suppression should be significantly greater. This is generally a marriage of the sound, the effect (dust and such), the aesthetic effect it has on screen with the player and finally an effect on how the player behaves. The latter is usually shown as shaking, with an inability to aim properly. Without this, the MG's purpose (to supress) is ultimately destroyed.
Some say the recoil is off but I feel that's about right when you're resting it on a bipod, a bipod isn't a magical gizmo that automatically makes a machinegun an automatic sniper rife.
The rest of the MG mechanics, such as the riflemen carrying ammo and the really nice set-up feature really do give it brownie points. But they're completely out weighed by the points i've stated previously.
On a side note, the upgrades for the MG34 are awfully in accurate, 200 round belt fed? Sweet Jesus you're practically asking the players to go Rambo. Perhaps in the future (and with the removal of the dual mag) the MGs could work in specific squads (three man teams) which, when stationary and with at least one other member of that team the MG can switch to the larger belt. This would be a very nice gameplay mechanic as it means an MG team can lockdown an area with the force an MG could do in the war. When against squads of riflemen they are meat grinders.
Apologies for typos and what not but I can't be bothered to spell check this one. Peace.
The simple fact is that at the moment the reduced recoil on a good amount of the weapons, the lack of sway and the robotic arms that allows pin-point aiming in a nansecond ruins any sense of realism.
As for the MG in relation to this thread (i.e. the title) the MG should have a greated effect. I've said on various occassions, perhaps maybe even on this thread, that suppression should be significantly greater. This is generally a marriage of the sound, the effect (dust and such), the aesthetic effect it has on screen with the player and finally an effect on how the player behaves. The latter is usually shown as shaking, with an inability to aim properly. Without this, the MG's purpose (to supress) is ultimately destroyed.
Some say the recoil is off but I feel that's about right when you're resting it on a bipod, a bipod isn't a magical gizmo that automatically makes a machinegun an automatic sniper rife.
The rest of the MG mechanics, such as the riflemen carrying ammo and the really nice set-up feature really do give it brownie points. But they're completely out weighed by the points i've stated previously.
On a side note, the upgrades for the MG34 are awfully in accurate, 200 round belt fed? Sweet Jesus you're practically asking the players to go Rambo. Perhaps in the future (and with the removal of the dual mag) the MGs could work in specific squads (three man teams) which, when stationary and with at least one other member of that team the MG can switch to the larger belt. This would be a very nice gameplay mechanic as it means an MG team can lockdown an area with the force an MG could do in the war. When against squads of riflemen they are meat grinders.
Apologies for typos and what not but I can't be bothered to spell check this one. Peace.