[Map] Fallen Fighters needs some tweaking!

[aop]

I hate this map with passion in RO1, always disconnected when this **** popped up. Seems like it hasn't changed at all.

To make it playable it should have moving spawns and more flanking routes for the attacking side. (Germans). I would also think that removing one of the Russian tanks would make it a bit more tolerable for the attackers.

 

[Forssen]

Played on a 32 player server just now and the map played great. Probably gets tempting to have too many camping in 64 player since it's so many targets to aim at in the open and so easy to get hit.

A solution could be to have more light behind some of the second floor windows so even if the enemy is covered by a shadow you can still make out his silhouette against the background.

I also think some of the cap zones should stay open longer in order to make it easier to flank. Don't get why the center objective gets closed down when the enemy got all three in the square.

 

[Aethelwulf]

I would like to see how the map plays out at night in all regards. That is all.

 

[Korn-Y]

I think more Sewers under the square (No man's land ^^) can be fine! The Sewers can help people to progress and protect them from Artillery! (But one nade in the tunnel and... boom )

 

[teemu92]

I dont think they will be changing the map, since its a 1 to 1 re creation of the real area, forgot where but still, if they add some new buildings it would not be the real location they made it to be.

 

[nate_]

Might be alone in thinking this, but I love the map. Have had no serious issues with campers ruining gameplay, and have found sniping from the buildings on the sides to be challenging enough to keep me from cleaning up. I can get a lot more kills with one of the other rifles if I'm out in the middle. I have also noticed that campers often get the "Most Dishonorable" award at the end of the game, lots of kills and very few objective points seems to be why.

 

[aop]

I hate this map with passion in RO1, always disconnected when this **** popped up. Seems like it hasn't changed at all.

To make it playable it should have moving spawns and more flanking routes for the attacking side. (Germans). I would also think that removing one of the Russian tanks would make it a bit more tolerable for the attackers.

Quoting myself here.

Now that I played the map couple a more hours I realized that both teams are actually attacking but it just looks like Germans are attacking because Soviets capture over half the map so fast and rest of the time it's a stalemate.

If Germans have very good Panzer players they can easily win by just killing off all the Russians who try to get to the middle and spamming the buildings with 75mm HE. Panzer IVG is a tad better than T-34/76 and it has better optics so it has kinda nice advantage in this map.

Anyways this map defies all the logic. Why would anyone attack through open square when it's surrounded by ruins and buildings that make for good cover... That is if they weren't off-limits in this map. IMHO this map needs to be extended to have more capture areas with cover, leave the center square for tanks.

 

[DiedTrying]

As has been pointed out before.

If both teams flank right instead of charging over the middle, the map is much more fun.

 

[JohnnyRaygun]

In a pub match it most surely is a thorn people's sides. This is a map where you really need to get an organized group involved. Tanks play an important part in this map as well.

I gave panzer support to the panzer grenadiers in my unit. I shelled the camping spots in the Russian spawn with HE. Anyone that tried to run out, I'd coax MG. Using my tank as a mobile piece of cover also helped. They kept the sappers off of my tank and alerted me of any T34's coming out into the streets. We were consistantly winning because of the lack of initiative the enemy took to capture points. On top of that, all those that camped to try and get kills were on the bottom of the score board and we were on top due to the excellent team point system.

 

[Scarf Ace]

Both Fallen Fighters and Apartments are way more fun with 32-38 players. 64 is excessive for those maps.

 

[Frostedflames]

I agree I know they say it is real as in everyone is afraid to move and its a snipers playground but it's not that good for gameplay everyone just chills and waits for someone to move

 

[Fingerlotion]

If they do not want to change some of the map layout, at least consider moving the objectives around. I hate this map with passion, and I do end up disconnecting from it when it pops up, in public - getting people organized pains me.

 

[barakas]

Why would it be changed if that's the way it really was?

I doubt the placement of sandbags and such is 100% realistic. The basic square can be kept the same while still changing cover of tactical value.

The sewers are also extremely limited. They could easily make the sewer system more expansive and keep it realistic.

Maybe expand the map and include a bit more of the surrounding buildings and make the large square area only one of the capzones and not the "center"?

They can't just throw in some random buildings, it's a historical location and that would be tantamount to blasphemy .

There's plenty of room for placing sandbags and trenches while still having historical accuracy.

There IS plenty of cover though. Just gonna play it slow, check for bad guys, sprint, crawl, repeat.

The problem is, a lot of the cover is only high enough to conceal you if you are prone, since people in 2nd floor windows at the side can look down at you and get headshots. You can't "peak" while prone, so essentially you just have to run to the cap zone and lie down behind a wall or sandbag and hope enough of your teammates do the same thing. This is not good gameplay.

Due to the height of the cover, and the angle of the surrounding buildings, its not possible to look around and actually fight people in the buildings. This is compounded by the fact a lot of the buildings are fogged out which makes them very difficult to see, but people in buildings have a clear view of people in cap zones.

How quickly do you think you can stand up from cover, get a look around at all the riflemen watching you, mark a target, get back down, get up and shoot without getting shot? Given that multiple riflemen probably saw you run for cover and are just waiting for you to stand up.

They either need to increase the height of cover, or add a more expansive sewer system so people can move around more in caps. Also some holes in walls or sewer tops where you can get good shots off at people in buildings would help immensely.

 

[Steezy_Six]

They need to make the large buildings destructible (even if it's not complete destruction, but enough to remove alot of the cover), then we'll see how much the snipers want to camp in them.

That's the most 'realistic' option. And it's what they commonly and logically did to get rid of annoying snipers in buildings.

 

[Funkyb]

Germans may be in the sun, but they have more options, and they also have curtains. It's pretty darned hard to spot a German when he's behind those curtains.

Personally I think Fallen Fighters is a great map. It's nerve-wracking to assault the center but that's the idea, and it's certainly not impossible. I think people need to use the cover system more, it really works. Go up to a wall and press CTL, then you can strafe side to side. Only pop up for a moment or two as you scan the area... Pop up and spot targets... then strafe... then pop up to shoot a few rounds... etc.

Good smoke makes all the difference on Fallen Fighters and you come to really appreciate the squad leaders and the commander. A good commander will definitely change the tide of battle with well-placed Artillery.

If the sewers were longer and more comprehensive then that's the only place you would see people, and it would be almost too easy to get an AT class close to the tank.

 

[TheoryOfWar]

I don't think the map has any problems but some of the game mechanics. It's far too easy to sit back in the spawn and hit people out of the other team's spawn with the weapon of your choice. The weapons need some sway, some decreased accuracy and some breathing interference.

If you couldn't snipe people from one side to the other then you would be forced to move into the cap zones. The MGs and snipers would be able to sit back and give cover whilst the infantry had to move in to actually be of use. The tank would also be a lot more useful as it would be used to take out their support rather than just shoot at their troops camping in the spawn.

Also, I think the intervals on the weapon sights should be changed. How often have you actually had to change your sights to another range? Never (so far). Stick it on 100M and you're set for the entire game.

The weapons need:
- Sway (Unless breathing in)
- Long term holding sway (Unless perched on a wall.)
- Breathing moving the weapon up and down.
- Shaking after running/sprinting (Unless perched on a wall.)
- Decreased accuracy (slightly)
- Longer reload times
- Longer deployment time on walls
- Bullet impacts around you making your character 'jump' so the weapon moves slightly. (More so than it already is.)

There you have it. A far more realistic, interesting game. Obviously there should be options to play with this setting or without. Personally I would prefer playing like this. As an avid machine gunner, I am fed up of running ages, setting up on a wall and getting instantly picked off from 200m away by someone getting a perfect headshot on me with their Mosin Nagant.

That's my opinion anyway.

 

[Tzako]

Adding wall destruction as they said they would to univermag and technical school would force the campers to attack

 

[Stephen]

The weapons need:
- Sway (Unless breathing in)
- Long term holding sway (Unless perched on a wall.)
- Breathing moving the weapon up and down.
- Shaking after running/sprinting (Unless perched on a wall.)
- Decreased accuracy (slightly)
- Longer reload times
- Longer deployment time on walls
- Bullet impacts around you making your character 'jump' so the weapon moves slightly. (More so than it already is.)

Thumbs up.

:IS2:

 

[Hirmuinen]

I played some really good rounds on this map again and I don't think the problem is that there are buildings abowe the ground or anything. You have plenty of good flanking paths using the closer spawn areas on both teams. Really hard for enemy to shoot you if you rush and jump form cover to cover and move by the walls.

The problem is that the spawn points are really not thought out well at all. We were axis and captured the three points by pushing from the right side(right side as looking the map). All of the sudden while I was lying some covering fire from bottom right wall, enemy starts to spawn right next to me, right at the same place we were pushing the whole game.

It's like the map was designed to be so balanced that neither team can really push the last spot without getting totally flanked by enemy and taken back their position. I would suggest that spawn points move little closer once two objectives are captured and once the third one gets captured, both teams spawn area moves behind the last defence building, so you get that last desperate stronghold.