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M14: The elephant in the room

Nanostrike

Grizzled Veteran
May 19, 2009
2,025
250
Okay, everyone seems to agree, but no one seems to be wanting to talk about it much: The M-14 EBR, despite being one of the potentially coolest guns in the game, is incredibly lame right now and an absolute joke in comparison to it's alternative, the Crossbow.

It's time to discuss exactly what's wrong with it and toss around some ideas to fix it.


First off, what's wrong. And IMO, there's a lot. A ton of it is hard to really explain, because a lot of it is just FEELING wrong, but I'll try to make a short list:

-Terrible ironsights. Whoever thought having a fork-looking gizmo instead of a simpler sight like the Lever Action was a good idea is crazy. Even if you get used to it, it's still not pleasant to use. It also makes it really difficult to use at long range.
-Ironsights don't seem to "Zoom" enough for a long range rifle.
-When aiming through Ironsights, the gun takes up a HUGE amount of screen area compared to other weapons, letting enemies get you from blind spots. Crawlers are particularly bad about this.
-Gun is black, thus the ironsights become nearly useless in the dark. It's not really alone in this problem (Lever Action and AK-47 suffer this too!), but it's a major annoyance.

-Laser isn't noticable enough to matter at long range, promoting a "Point blank headshot spam" mentality that makes the gun feel like an inferior version of the SCAR.
-Body shot damage is PATHETIC. I know this was done to counter bodyshot-spammage and I was one of the people in favor of nerfing the bodyshot damage, but it's gone a bit too far. This is a Tier 3 Weapon that can't even 1 shot crawlers...



Those are my biggest complaints. Most of 'em are about the terribad Iron Sights. IMO, to make the gun desirable again, give it some better sights to make something besides close range laser-aim spam viable. A headshot-based weapon NEEDS good iron sights. And increase the bodyshot damage to the point that it can 1-shot a Crawler (But not much beyond that!).

What do you guys think?
 
Honestly, I think B is the only good option of that.


There's NOTHING wrong with the gun stat-wise. It's the USABILITY that the problem. The gun is simply way too much of a hassle to use effectively, with it's headache-inducing ironsights that barely zoom, combined with considerable recoil (though I think that's a good idea balance-wise). The EBR ranks up there with Pipe Bombs as a weapon that's currently awesome on paper but extremely bothersome to use in reality.


Give it a scope, or adjust the ironsights to make it more like the LAR.
 
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Not really an elephant in the room no one wants to talk about.
I've been saying that it's a poor weapon basically for the same reasons you mention but I don't think it's fixable.
It's just not a sharpshooter weapon whatsoever and all the fixes so far didn't really change anything about that.

"Add a scope" or "make better ironsights" is probably easier said than done too.
There are no "non-crap M14" mutators for a reason I guess.
 
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The M14 should not be able to one-shot anything in the body. We went over this for 2 months of beta testing. M14 was too easy to use because it didn't promote headshots enough and it made the Sharpshooter better at dealing with smallfry than the Commando. If you make it possible to one-shot crawlers in the body with the M14, then you're causing the same problem all over again. Commando takes 2 bodyshots with AK and SCAR to kill crawlers and he has about twice as much ammo than a M14/Cannon or M14/LAR Sharp has. If you could one-shot crawlers in the body with M14, you essentially cause the Sharpshooter to have an equal amount of ammo to the Commando.

The M14 is better than the Crossbow in HoE for most situations provided you have the skill. I never use the Crossbow anymore because it fails me more often than not, while well-placed headshots with M14 see me through most situations. The only reason to use Xbow is for the Patriarch.

If you really want to know, I wish we'd gotten the M39 EMR instead of the M14. That is a purpose-built designated marksman rifle, while the M14 EBR is a general-purpose long rifle.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ring_thier_weapon_aboard_USS_Pearl_Harbor.jpg
 
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The only fix I can think of for the m14 is changing the whole ironsight to a scope, making it a good weapon on long ranges but crappy on short ranges (if needed they could also puff the weapon on scoped mode and nerf it when you arent using a scope to get rid of the spammage completely if the latest update didnt work out as expected).

Or just get rid of the whole gun and replace it with a new sniper rifle (which I doubt will happen because its always a bad idea removing weapons in the game... might be better just moving it to commando or something)
 
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Hmmm... ibelieve that this is really difficult to fix, I almost believe that it is unfixable.

All I can think of is add a medium range sight and make sure that it maintains its faster fire rate than the crossbow. It would be easier to use the Crossbow as a template, we could say that:

* M14 should have alot less damage than the Crossbow.
* M14 should maintain its fast rate of fire.
* M14 should have a medium range scope as that is the distance that it
is normally used. Crossbow should still be much more effective for long
shots.
* M14 should retain its bad body damage to continue with the trend of
enticing Sharp Shooters to aim for the head.

Another thing is that if the laser is to remain, at least make the Iron Sights much better for medium ranges as suggested by everyone else. The laser would be good if it were descently visible, but at the moment it's a joke. On light levels you can't see it properly and at medium distances half the time it is not visible.

Glad someone decided to make this thread. :)
 
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I don't know why people giving negative feedback regarding M14 stats. Sharpshooter is to shoot head. Why encourage him to shoot body?

Go download and play the Killing Floor, the way it supposed to be played.

Dolphin Buff Man, did you ever played KF, or did you ever cleared game on normal alive as SS?

I think there huge whole between some players and developers. Where developers trying to tell how to play game, to shoot head and special abilities of each weapon, and some players just too narrow minded and egoistic to understand that and pushing their own opinions. If players would pay little bit more attention to game, there would be much less pain on forums.
 
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Dude, out of the 10 or something people who have posted here, you're the only one who doesn't see a problem with it.
And yes, I've survived as Sharp Shooter and easily, aim for the head as I keep saying and you're fine. But I use the Crossbow because it's a descent weapon and doesn't have a ridiculous laser on it. If you actually listened to your own arguement, you'd find that yeah, aim for the head, so USE A SCOPE! Don't promote hip fire with a laser, it doesn't make sense. Fair enough Tripwire are trying to give the gun something special, but it is not the gun for the laser.
I said nothing about increasing the rate of fire, learn to read. It says to keep it as is, i was comparing. Not my issue that you can not undertstand.
Also, I said shoot for the head every single time I've posted about this weapon, how can you possibly have a go at me for that?! And I said leave body shot as is! :confused::confused::confused: All I said was give a medium range scope or make better iron sights! For god sake dude, learn to read!
 
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...First off, what's wrong. And IMO, there's a lot. A ton of it is hard to really explain, because a lot of it is just FEELING wrong, but I'll try to make a short list:

-Terrible ironsights. Whoever thought having a fork-looking gizmo instead of a simpler sight like the Lever Action was a good idea is crazy. Even if you get used to it, it's still not pleasant to use. It also makes it really difficult to use at long range...

The sights on this rifle are a reasonably decent representation of what the actual firearm has. And, using these very same sights, this rifle is capable of incredible accuracy given that it's a military self-loader.

Now, I'm not trying to belittle the point you're making; KF isn't Real-Life
 

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My main gripe with the M14 is the slightly lower damage than LAR make it a worse choice in HoE. This makes the LAR much better as it can:
- 1-hit Crawlers without aiming for their tiny and glitchy heads
- 1-headshot Husks and Sirens reliably (on 6-man HoE, it will leave them with a tiny sliver of health)
- stun Scrakes (if a Scrake charges at you while attempting to kill it with M14, its head hitbox has the tendency of moving to its neck and if you miss once it will eat you)
- LAR's increased fire and reload rate in the hands of an SS make it just as good if not better against Fleshpounds as M14 (with its recently nerfed firerate).

I play Sharpshooter a little in HoE because it's something I don't usually play and because it's sometimes useful. I use LAR as my main weapon and M14 for when I want to kill Clots and Gorefasts without wasting my LAR ammo.

I'd advocate better ironsights/scope and perhaps a small damage or headshot multiplier increase, but I think the best solution at this point is a new gun...
 
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