Long range fighting

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Infernalis

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 3, 2011
12
0
0
I understand now why I'm being killed by people I don't see, it's because I literally don't see them. I have some rendering problems and some objects and enemies don't appear at long distance unless I am close or zoom close enough. I saw it several times in the map where the Germans begins on one side of the damaged railway, one guy kill me then the killcam zoom on him and then he suddenly pop up!

I do have some advantages though, I can see through some objects, in Grain Elevator I could shoot the Germans through some unknow things and score kills...
 

SQBsam

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 7, 2010
895
86
0
Australia
Sit still, in a spot where you aren't in the sunlight, and not silhouetted against anything bright and just sit. Still. Dead still. Let your eyes stay centered and just flick around looking for movement, a tiny black of someone shifting position (and speaking of shift, if you do this for a while you will soon get a feel for when to use zoom and when a wider perspective helps) and when they do, take a second to make sure you have the shot, then take it.


Another thing that is key is to not be where you are expected, this doesn't take long to realise: univermag and technical school are out of bounds if you are sniping on FF, there are similar spots in all longer range maps. The problem is they are the focus of attention, think about it, if you were sniping on their team, where would you look first, where would you look last? That is where you want to be.
 

Victor Rinaldi

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 23, 2011
91
4
0
Basically that's what I thought, it's more a matter of knowledge of the maps (including attackers/defenders most taken paths etc) than people spotting you from miles away. Because all the tactics like not being close from windows etc apply in others FPS too (at least semi-realistic to realistic FPS).

Is leaning more useful than the cover system? I didn't really noticed if you expose your whole body with the cover system or just a part of it (I mean when firing from the sides of a cover).

Map knowledge helps I suppose, but really it doesnt hurt to slow down your own movement to look all around you. 9/10 you will be shot crossing in dangerous open ground from a fairly obvious overwatch.

ROHOS and its cover system have its uses, like the ability to peek while not exposing yourself fully, but if you know for a fact that the area you're about to peek around is being sprayed/watched by a guy who has you pinned, it might be better to just step back and lean; you might catch the guy waiting for your head to peek out off guard when it doesn't appear where its supposed to.

The jury's still out on the cover system in my unit. I love it, but can easily play an entire round without using it...some of my guys insist on not using it and just leaning manually around corners; I guess its all preference.
 

Mak

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 15, 2006
23
1
0
Hi there, first post but there's no presentation section but whatever :p

I have something to ask : how to be effective in long range fighting (and I mean long range, not like in the Apartements map)? I often die in long range fight and I can't for the life of me figure where it comes from whereas my enemy seem to always know where I am. Especially in Darkest Hour in big maps I was often killed from miles away from unseen targets and I couldn't understand how they could see me from that far, sometime when I was hidden.

I felt powerless in some RO maps and Fallen Fighter began to remind me of that even though I know this time it's mostly players on the side of the maps at windows with a view on cappers (I know since both team do the same instead of helping to cap). I never felt that in semi-realist game like Forgotten Hope 2 or sim like Operation Flashpoint 1/Armed Assault.

In ROOST DH I even began to wonder if there's wasn't a setting to better see your target, if they had a bigger screen (I have a 19 widescreen) and they shoot a little pixels? Do they just knew the maps by heart. Maybe players with mics? Do they just camp at some good locations and I play too aggressive? Simple lack of training? Players with tons of hours behind them? Maybe I just suck at RO compared to others FPS. Combination of all of that?

My comment is in no way intended to be "smart" or "clever," but do you ever team up with one or more team mates? If so, you should have no problem (either you or your team mate) finding where the shot came from if you both came out of cover at the same time and one was killed.

I hate to say it, but I think so many players have a hard time with RO:Ost and now RO2 beta, because they refuse to use team work as a strategy to attack/defend and ultimately win rounds. If you constantly run around aimlessly without the help of others... expect to get picked off every time. The enemy practically hears you scream in your aimless actions: "I'm revealing myself to you. Begin your target practice."
 

Infernalis

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 3, 2011
12
0
0
Probably you have not upadted your DirectX or your graphics card is old.
Yes my comp is old (9800GT/E8200/3go) but it's a matter of settings more than anything else. I played the game on the lowest settings but I found I actually have near the same framerate with medium settings and there's no poping things anymore.

As for the cover system it helps for some low covers and things like that but the lean is better most of the time, especially on the side of cover, you expose way too much of your body with the cover system on the sides.

Mak if by teammates you mean friends with a mike then no I play alone. If you mean sticking with my team then yes I obviously don't want enemies to surround me or expose myself to several angles. The only time I might go alone is when I know I can flank or take a very good position, sometimes it's risky but the reward is great.

Still didn't got shot from a kilometer like in DH though.
 

bezzi

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 1, 2011
60
5
0
With sniper use long distances, avoid movement, remember muzzle flash in dark places, dont go near windows (gun barrel) and find good spots.

Pavlov's House and Fallenfighters are great sniping maps but waiting for bigger maps, also need better scope to be effective +300 metres.

Red Orchestra 2 Sniper gameplay - YouTube
 

BUNnGUN

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 14, 2011
7
0
0
Canada
www.youtube.com

The Harvester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 9, 2011
66
2
0
Melbourne, Australia
Try running behind someone who's advancing, try n see where they get shot from, and If you can, then return fire in the name of the Fartherland! I did it when the Beta came out and no one knew the vantage spots, run behind people, use they're support and don't journey out on your own, if they die infront of you drop behind cover somewhere and slowly peep out more and more to see where the shot might have been fired from......a bit of patience really helps when camping for a purpose.
 

DesiQ

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 5, 2011
431
168
0
Australia
www.desiquintans.com
Here are a few of mine, dealing mostly with how to use buildings properly:

  1. Move cautiously, or not at all. Movement attracts the eye. When you do move, peek out of cover (using the movement keys and not ironsights — it feels like it presents a smaller target) to check the immediate area, then move decisively and rapidly.
  2. You might think crouch-running makes you a smaller target, but it only makes you a slower target. Its best use is for running alongside an obstacle that completely covers you, like inside a shallow trench or beside a low wall. Crouch-running in the open will get you shot if someone has the area dialed in.
  3. When firing from a building, stand inside the room. Don't let your muzzle or blast show outside. Stand against the back wall if you can.
  4. Never pop out of the same spot twice in a row. Never ever ever. Resist the urge! If you try to take a shot from a doorway and a bullet narrowly misses you, don't use that door anymore. Your enemy will be waiting patiently for you, which means you can get the drop on him from a new direction.
  5. Following on from #4, if you are fighting from inside a building as a sniper or supporting rifleman, work the windows properly. Shoot or recon from a window, then go to another one. Shoot from different sides of windows, at different distances inside the room, and so on.
  6. Properly applying Tip #5 means that each shooter needs free windows. I'd say a good number is three or four windows per shooter. If you walk into a room and those three or four windows are taken, you should bugger off somewhere else. In one game of Apartments everyone (aside from me) who tried to shoot from the top floor of the building in the Russian spawn was killed literally within a second of walking into the room. Later in the game the Russians ended up with six or seven riflemen shooting from that same room, and it was completely pointless (not least because it was a Territory game).
  7. When moving around inside a room, crawl. Crouching may still be visible to observers outside, and MG fire can rake the walls.
  8. When you must fire from a window you have already been spotted using, don't crouch-walk into view. Have your rifle pointed where you expect your shooter to be, strafe confidently into the window, fire, and continue strafing until you're in cover again.
  9. If you are caught in a fire-fight anywhere from 20m-50m and feel you are badly positioned (for example, you are a rifleman proned on railway tracks, and an Assault soldier fired a burst at you when you tried to find a target), use a frag to screen your retreat. The frag doesn't need to go near your enemy (although that's a bonus!); as long as it explodes somewhere directly between you and your attacker, the plume of dust and smoke will give you at least a little concealment during those precious seconds of going from prone to sprinting. It's saved me a few times, and a little concealment is better than nothing, right?
 

gimpy117

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 6, 2011
527
111
0
30
Michigan
i never stop to look for campers, unless i know i am in a safe place. Stopping to peer into that building or what not exposes you and you better believe they are always trying to draw a bead on you
 

KarmakazeNZ

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 23, 2010
352
249
0
I have something to ask : how to be effective in long range fighting (and I mean long range, not like in the Apartements map)?

No one is really effective at long range fighting. For every kill someone gets from their camping spot 300m away, I might get 4 or 5 and cap a zone. You are simply thinking about that single moment when the camper just happened to have you perfectly in his sights at just the right moment, and you had no idea where he was.

It seems like these guys are evil death from afar, but 90% of their shots miss, OR they take very few shots. They aren't really doing much more than stat padding, even though the RO vets are probably going to go nuts about me saying that.

Don't worry about them. They are not really doing as much damage to your team as it seems.

I often die in long range fight and I can't for the life of me figure where it comes from whereas my enemy seem to always know where I am.

It is my experiences that a lot of noobs spend too much time running and not enough time prone and listening and looking. You have no idea what is behind the next corner in the hallway, let alone across the road in another house.

If you want to survive, slow down. When you see everyone sprint off towards the enemy, half of them will die without hitting anything or even shooting. The other half probably only survived because the enemy was reloading.

Keep moving. never stay in one place for long. Remember though, the goal is for the enemy to not know where you are. If someone shot you from 300m away, it's because he could see you from 300m away. Your goal is not to let that happen. Once you have been seen, and that may not be the moment you are shot, you are at a disadvantage. He can move to get the perfect shot, or wait for you to move where he can get it from where he is, the ball is in his court.

Always assume someone can see you, and be aware of any possible exits so you can seek cover in a hurry. Look around. Sometimes you think you got shot from miles away, but he was actually right behind you.

If you stop, go prone. Don't look over walls, crawl to the end and look around from the prone position. You are less noticeable and a smaller target even if you are seen.

Treat your sight lines as like large "rooms". You can only really know and control what is happening in your "room", so if you are moving from one "room" to another, say leaving a building or entering one, or even moving from an open field into a street of houses, stop look and listen. Learn what is going on in the "room" before you enter it. If you do that, the guy that just ran in and got sniped is showing you what NOT to do.

There are so many things you need to do and be aware of, that you will HAVE to learn by trial and error. You will die a lot as you learn, but if you join a squad and follow the squad leader, you should always have at least one guy who knows what he's doing nearby to show you how to do it. If he get's killed a lot, don't do what he does. :p
 

KarmakazeNZ

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 23, 2010
352
249
0
Here are a few of mine, dealing mostly with how to use buildings properly:

I would say one thing about crouch running, if you are using it to be able to go from prone to prone as fast as possible it is a VERY good thing. As the gunner, it is the fastest way to move and still be ready to shoot as soon as possible. Just make sure not to go more than 10m at a time before you drop to catch your breath and spoil their aim if they were trying to lead you. Wait for him to shoot, then go while he reloads or re-aims. Drop again if you feel like he is about to shoot (10m whichever comes sooner) and then rotate to face him less frontal area makes you a smaller target.

Also, do not weave. If you are running upright, let the sprint go every few seconds for a second or two. This helps conserve stamina, and also throws off anyone trying to calculate a lead because you keep changing speed, rather than direction. Turn to face the direction you want to go while prone and use sprint to start running. If you decide to keep running and not go prone, like running into a building, press the crouch key and it will change to the upright stance and you won't go prone when you stop.

If I am gunning, what I do is travel around fully upright whenever I feel less threatened (the "rooms" thing I talk about in my other post) but then start using the prone-dash-prone method of moving if I think there is a possibility someone may have a shot at me. This means I conserve stamina as much as possible, cover as much ground as I can as quickly as I can, and still be as safe as I can. No matter what class, if I am in a dangerous "room" where it is not only possible but likely for me to get hit, I will do prone-dash-prone.

Otherwise, all very sound tactics. Good post.

One of the weird things about gun fights is that they can be counter intuitive. If you are running in the open, because it is so hard to lead, you can be safer than crawling or being prone. But if you mix it up, you are safer still.

If he's some distance away, and you can see the muzzle flash or dust from the shot, you may have half a second to shift slightly and make the bullet miss. You see the flash long before the bullet gets to you if it is far enough away. If it's a long range MG shot, I will usually wait for him to START firing and then run. If his first round misses, I won't be there any more for the rest. If you let him fire and try to wait for him to stop, he will kill you.

His own muzzle flash and dust can obscure his vision enough so that if he fires a long burst at you and you were prone in the middle of a field, by the time he stops firing you could be behind a wall 10m away and he has no idea where you went.

These are some of the things many gunners are complaining about, they just don't know it. They think that the fact I got up and ran proves that "suppression" doesn't work, when in fact what I did is prove why long bursts don't work. I used a weakness of the gun against it. If he's firing wild he can't see, hear, move or aim properly. He is essentially suppressing himself for me. I will be suppressed, and so will the gunner, but when it clears up for both of us, I will be gone and he won't know where.

Actually, this is why realistically accurate weapons are good for everyone. When you introduce a random "deviation" you actually make it harder on the guys being shot at. If I know the weapon is accurate, and that he is aiming at me, if I move, I know he will probably miss me. If the shot has a random deviation added to it, even if the guy is the best shot in the world he may still accidentally hit me because the bullet flew wild and went where I moved to, instead of where I moved from. It becomes more random chance and less skill from either player. May as well just take turns RPG or RTS style.
 
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Infernalis

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 3, 2011
12
0
0
Adjusting your settings does help even if some think that's boderline cheating, I was killed in strange circumstances and it was obviously either hacks or modified settings and a thread showing what to disable for more visibility proves me right (strange I didn't even though to modify the .ini while I did for every others FPS I have).

Apart from that I was killed only very few time from bolt-rifle from really long distance, nothing compared to Darkest Hour.