Lever Action Rifle

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Janshi

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 23, 2009
46
0
0
You don't often see many WWII era bolt-actions outside of a WWII era game :p That said, Kar98k please! Lee-Enfield would be ok as a 2nd place substitute for me, but the Kar98k is beautiful in every way.

Well, the Winchester is hardly a common rifle for anyone but hunters or gun enthusiasts. The reason it's in is for the genre.

Besides, any British museum about WWI, WWII, or the Military worth it's salt has a SMLE hanging around. Especially in London, where you just see stacks of them on walls and such.
 

Edelweiss

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 23, 2009
5
0
0
In practice it is easier for a citizen to get a legal lever-action rifle in Great Britain than a Lee-Enfield. I'm pretty sure that's why it was included. If you want unrealistic then go play Left 4 Dead.
 

Zeptorem

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 30, 2009
373
106
0
Well, the Winchester is hardly a common rifle for anyone but hunters or gun enthusiasts. The reason it's in is for the genre.

Besides, any British museum about WWI, WWII, or the Military worth it's salt has a SMLE hanging around. Especially in London, where you just see stacks of them on walls and such.

...All of which have their bolts welded or are similarly deactivated.
 

Janshi

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 23, 2009
46
0
0
In practice it is easier for a citizen to get a legal lever-action rifle in Great Britain than a Lee-Enfield. I'm pretty sure that's why it was included. If you want unrealistic then go play Left 4 Dead.

The Winchester is included because it's a staple of the genre. And, let's be honest, if a civilian is picking up weapons in a zombie apocalypse, it'd start with knives and go up to pistols if they could find an armory. Again, this is Britain - guns are hard to find.

If we're talking about realistic, then the Winchester and SMLE would be completely thrown out the window for things like G36c, L85A2, MP5, even Steyr AUG (from police armories). Looking at typical weapons carried about gangs in Britain, its shotguns and Mac-10s. So stop tossing this ridiculous idea of 'realistic'. What we are looking for is something that fits the mood, setting, and atmosphere.

If we're looking at sniper weapons, then by 'realistic' standards the Winchester should be out completely. Everyone will point out the hunting enthusiast but, funny enough, the hunting enthusiast tends to to be rich, entitled, and with a country home. If you are a gun owner in Britain, you are one of a minority. The closest source of sniper weaponry is, yes, the Military and Police.
 

Benjamin

Grizzled Veteran
May 17, 2009
3,649
635
113
France
I don't think this game is based very much around realism. I mean come on, a chainsaw? Zombies? Who cares if it's not realistic, as long as it's fun. I've been using the LAR recently and found that I really like it.
 

Arcane

FNG / Fresh Meat
Apr 30, 2009
112
1
0
30
england
Well, the Winchester is hardly a common rifle for anyone but hunters or gun enthusiasts. The reason it's in is for the genre.

Besides, any British museum about WWI, WWII, or the Military worth it's salt has a SMLE hanging around. Especially in London, where you just see stacks of them on walls and such.
Very true, but like Zeptorem said, most are deactivated in some way. I'm not too fussy when it comes to bolt-actions, however i'm not keen on the SMLE's reload system, however I would be extremely happy if either the Kar98k or the SMLE were added to the game.

I don't think this game is based very much around realism. I mean come on, a chainsaw? Zombies? Who cares if it's not realistic, as long as it's fun. I've been using the LAR recently and found that I really like it.
Also very true. I'm not the kind to nitpick about inaccurate reload animations or power, but as long as the weapons are fun to use, and are varied. All the more reason to include 3 more weapons:

- Bolt Ation Rifle:
Lee-Enfield Mk. III or Kar98k

- SMG:
any variant of the MP5 would suffice

-Machine Pistol:
Glock 18, MAC-10 or MAC-11 if you're looking for something more modern, but i prefer the MAC-10.
 

Cypher

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 27, 2009
11
0
0
Adding a bolt action would be nice but NOT at the expense of the Lever action.
I hate the crossbow and prefer the lever action. I don't need damage..when I fire into their eye sockets.

So before anything else...learn to use the lever action and stop complaining about replacing it.
Never played the mod so I cant say anything about how the lever action was in the mod versus now so yeh.

Now then..commentary.
I'm all for keeping the Lever Action Rifle to be honest, it just needs to be more of a viable choice. A slight increase in stopping power might do it a good justice. At the most, I'd love to see it have a scope when used with Sharpshooter.

What needs to happen is the Crossbow needs to have a scope only when Sharpshooter class is used.
I half agree and half disagree...
First...the scope of the crossbow only on when used by sharpshooter perk? Fully agree with this.

As for a scope for the lever action? NO! Maybe a red dot..Maybe. I like the accuracy of the lever action just fine, a red dot would hurt the accuracy as at range the dot would encompass the head of the specimen. Leave the crossbow for Really long range (The only thing its good at) and leave the lever action for everything else.

Hmm, maybe the lever action rifle can stay, but they should add a more modern rifle into the game so that the players can enjoy them both.
Modern..*Shrug*. But a bolt action should be added in for..a change while not removing the lever action. Why does everyone want Modern weapons? Modern weapons (For the most part) are all about massive rates of fire centered around small rounds that are able to be controlled in fully automatic or burst fire modes. (Sniper rifles are obvious exceptions). The US Military went from the M1 Garand in .30-06 Springfield to the M14 in .308 NATO to the M16 in 5.56mm NATO. Whats the jist here? The rounds get smaller and the rates of fire get higher. For specimens I would want an OLDER weapon with a larger bullet. Instead of a M16 I would grab at least an M14 or an M1 Garand for the POWER.

In the Scenario of KF..conserving ammo is a core part of the game. Spending 1 round to the head of a Gorefest via a M1 Garand to kill it versus 5 rounds from a M16 is much smarter. Granted I have used American firearms as I am most familiar with those. I am sure there are equivalents in the British military.

The 'Action Rifle' should DEFINITELY stay how it is. Maybe a firepower boost, but that's about it.

They need to ADD another, more powerful rifle that has little ammo, but huge damage to give Sharpshooters a weapon that can actually take down things besides garbage specimens...a powerful enough Bolt Action rifle would work for this...

But making the lever action rifle into an even slower-firing Bolt Action rifle? Even if you upped the damage a bit, the firing speed decrease would be just...ick...the Lever Action is slow enough!

Firepower boost? Meh not really needed if you aim for the head.
Agree with adding another rifle (Bolt Action, Low Ammo, High Power) and definately agree with NOT just switching out the lever action with the bolt action. As for the rate of fire of the lever action....I just carry a Handcannon as a backup when I need to rachet off many rounds very quickly.

that said, i wouldn't object to adding a bolt action rifle such as the enfield, but not at the expense of replacing one of the current weapons with it.
Agree.


Listen...
I have Sharpshooter at 3, to be at 4 shortly. I use the lever action EXCLUSIVELY. I am routinely ranked 1 or 2 on EVERY server I play on. Typically I also have anywhere from a 50 to 100 kill lead over the next following player.
I have a hard time agreeing with anything being done to the Lever action. Id just get more whinning from people in the server cause I would be even deadlier. Maybe yall should just learn how to use the lever action better?

Oh I use a laser 5 button TRACKBALL mouse. So yeh..complain some more..
 

Rurik

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 2, 2009
26
0
0
The problem with most lever-actions is not only are they are not really 'sharpshooter' weapons. Tubular magazines (attempt to disasemble a Winchester or Marlin lever-action, you'll see) typically do not function well with the barrel, whereas closed-bolt rifles normally perform exceptionally.

Also, lever-actions have been a sort of American gun - a 'wild west' icon, a simple 'ranch rifle'. Finding it in Britain, especially against zombies, feels out of place for me. Not only does the accuracy surprise me (because the range at which I peg targets is sometimes absurd) but its placement in the British zombie survival genre does as well.
 

mick86w

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 17, 2009
78
27
0
Western Pennsylvania
hrm

hrm

Has anyone figured out which exact model of the Winchester lever action rifle is represented in the game? is it the 1873 or the 1894 or something in between?

I'm not too familiar with antique firearms but I do know that the 1894 model fires the 30-30 Winchester round which is still a very popular hunting cartridge here in the states and is comparable in ballistic performance to the 7.62x39 AK47 round. My main point being is that the cartridge is still being manufactured while many calibers from the 1800s are not.

I am also not familiar with UK firearms restriction laws. But here in the states you can pick up a surplus SMLE for $150 or up to several thousand dollars depending on the collectors value.

The .303 British is a formidable cartridge which has been proven in battle for over a century. I don't think it would compare well to the 30-30 which is more of an intermediate round.

It would be tricky to ballance the more powerful cartridge into the game with a comparable fire rate rifle with the same magazne capacity without rendering the lever action useless. I suppose you could call it a tier 1.5 weapon for sharpshooters but I don't see why it would be necessary.

I'd rather see an L96 firing .338 Lapua or .300 Winchester Magnum as a tier 3 weapon. :)
 

F6Knight

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 15, 2009
149
14
0
Belgium
I'm not going to join the whole discussion about which weapons should be implemented instead of the LAR (hell, I like the LAR ingame)

But everyone complaining about it's stopping power ingame, you guys have to realize that the LAR is amongst the cheapest weapon and you can pick one up right after wave 1. It's not supposed to be extremely powerful. We have to crossbow for that.

(I know that the crossbow is currently way too cheap and can also be bought right after wave 1 but it's still an expensive gun to maintain early game if you don't use the exploit to get cheap ammo ... I'm also going to make a big suggestion soon that will include upping the price for the crossbow)
 

Rurik

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 2, 2009
26
0
0
I just think replacing the lever-action with any sort of bolt-action would make more sense in the present era. Plus, you could argue that it's a top-fed internal magazine, and thus would require rounds being chambered single-file, much like the lever action, so the reloading mechanism would not require any change.
 

LemoN

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 26, 2006
6,293
2,346
0
33
Prussotroll's Bridge
I just think replacing the lever-action with any sort of bolt-action would make more sense in the present era. Plus, you could argue that it's a top-fed internal magazine, and thus would require rounds being chambered single-file, much like the lever action, so the reloading mechanism would not require any change.

uh what?!
 

Rurik

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 2, 2009
26
0
0
uh what?!

A bolt-action rifles makes more sense to be a commonly-owned firearm rather than lever-actions. Bolt-action rifles are a typical hunting weapon due to their extreme accuracy via closed-bolt firing mechanism. Lever action tubular magazines are fairly inaccurate due to harmonic balancing issues with the barrel. My thought is to replace the lever-action with a more sensible firearm, but I also noted that...

...the reloading (feeding) mechanism would not need to be changed. One could simply top-load the bolt-action much like one side-loads the lever-action, meaning reloading time would be virtually unchanged - only the model would be changed.
 

LemoN

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 26, 2006
6,293
2,346
0
33
Prussotroll's Bridge
ah now i understand what you mendt

but please note that loading a internal boxmag is a way different animation than loading a tubula magazine from the side

so i still dont really get what you mean by unchanged animation o_O
 

Rurik

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 2, 2009
26
0
0
Not unchanged animation, unchanged reloading mechanics. The way you reload the gun would be the same - one bullet at a time. Obviously internal box magazines are loaded top-down, whereas tubular magazines are loaded from the side. However, the nature of the reloading mechanics is exactly the same - one bullet at a time.

I never said anything about unchanged animation.
 

Reise

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 1, 2006
2,687
851
0
Maine, US
I wouldn't want to hand load every round into an Enfield.

Better use 2 clips, you got stuff trying to eat your face coming closer and closer.
 

Janshi

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 23, 2009
46
0
0
Let me preface this by saying that I *like* the LAR in-game. It's a nice early weapon that is effective and while I do enjoy comboing with the crossbow, there's something very satisfying about doing one-bullet-one-kill.

Still, I prefer the SMLE. It's an iconic British weapon. It's not about which is the better weapon or whatever. If you are going to have a Winchester in this game, then you must have a SMLE. If you're going to have any older rifles in this game then it must be the SMLE.
 

Its...

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 20, 2009
12
0
0
...the reloading (feeding) mechanism would not need to be changed. One could simply top-load the bolt-action much like one side-loads the lever-action, meaning reloading time would be virtually unchanged - only the model would be changed.

Are you insane? the same mechanic? Have you tried loading a bolt action one round at a time? Its not nearly as fast as loading the tube on a lever action. Load one/shoot one is one of the best thing about the lever action, you cant do that with the same speed or efficiency with a bolt action. I would love to see a bolt action hunting rifle added to the game as a high end sharpshooter weapon. I really don't want to see a sniper rifle in this game.

-its