Lets talk about KF2's monthly player base.

[DMN666]

For me, i jist dont find KF2 to as fun as the first one.
I do hop into the game when a new major update is pushed out, but then a day or 2 later, im back to playing my other usual games.
It was never like this for me with the first game, was on that game almost all day, to the point where it was my 2nd highested played game (1st being TF2 because free).
Its funny that i still dont have all my perks on lvl 6 or all map achievements despite my 1000+ hours. Bigger reasons to keep playing KF1 despite it being killed off.

 

[Jr175]

I feel like your argument looks at die hard fans and is considering them as if they are the standard. They are not.

Balance wise? we will see who brings the ideas that extend the life of the game. If the new forced meta is to stay, then I can happily say that I can put the game down because I got my pretentious, "moneys worth".

Slightly off topic bit:

Spoiler!

My freinds and I play a ton of payday 2 and the main reason we stay so interested in it is because their is always more xp to gain. As far as people still playing kf1 for its gameplay insinuating that people will play this one for just as long for its gameplay... this just feels false. Killing floor doesn't really offer me anything that any other wave defense game doesn't, hell I could go play sanctum 2 and get a very similar experience.

The thread's context was obviously about leveling in general and why it shouldn't be the reason why people play. If you think playing PD2 for getting to infamy 25 or leveling is more fun than planning out how to do stealth heists, going loud on Death Wish, or just satisfying gun play, more power to you. But for the people that are here for pure, satisfying zed killing gun play, something as empty as leveling up will mean nothing and doesn't contribute to helping the game in the long run.

When it comes down to it there really isn't anything all that unique or amazing that really stands out about kf2. if anything Id even call it very basic, you got some classes, you got some dudes to shoot, you got a few playstyle options now go nuts. That's really all their is to it. If anything kf2's saving grace will be mods (as it is for many... many other games) as (good) mods provide a fresh and new feel for an old game that people liked the first time around.

Which, amazingly, comes out as a negative. If you compare both games that is. The best part will be if the father (re:KF1) out lives the son (re:KF2).

 

[BJ Vynz]

It's a game designed around rinse-repeat gameplay. I wouldn't expect it to be a person's "primary" video game, and people coming in then going out is what I'd expect.

However, the camping in small "safe" zones. It turned me off the game for a couple months and I'll probably keep taking breaks.
Aside from this, which I find absolutely game-breaking, I still find KF2 much more fun than KF1.

As long as people huddle in a claustrophobic "safe" spot of a map and stay there for 10 waves it's going to feel like I wasted a couple hours of my life.
I don't have an exciting one, but I'd be happier playing something else in these cases.

I don't know, I assume I can't be the only one feeling this way. If more people do then addressing this issue might mean more people playing more often.

 

[MrRogersBestNeighbor]

It's a game designed around rinse-repeat gameplay. I wouldn't expect it to be a person's "primary" video game, and people coming in then going out is what I'd expect.

However, the camping in small "safe" zones. It turned me off the game for a couple months and I'll probably keep taking breaks.
Aside from this, which I find absolutely game-breaking, I still find KF2 much more fun than KF1.

As long as people huddle in a claustrophobic "safe" spot of a map and stay there for 10 waves it's going to feel like I wasted a couple hours of my life.
I don't have an exciting one, but I'd be happier playing something else in these cases.

I don't know, I assume I can't be the only one feeling this way. If more people do then addressing this issue might mean more people playing more often.

Yeah, I agree with this.
There have been a couple threads in "Ideas and Suggestions" for new game modes that would force players to hold up different locations or move to other parts of the map. I think that would be a hell of a lot funner than how things currently are with just playing waves over and over again and holding up in the same one spot on every map every game.
I really hope they do have some plan on introducing game modes like that. I mean that was their plan from the start, was to have changing environments that would force players to move to different locations (broken doors, broken lights), but now everyone just holds up outside in the most open area where there aren't too many different directions zeds can come from. No lights to worry about and no broken doors to worry about.

 

[Hatesandwich]

Oh god here we go again with steamcharts.

Stop extrapolating meaning from numbers. The number of active monthly players does not determine how healthy a game is; especially one who's gameplay consists of repetition. KF2's average numbers float around where KF1's numbers have generally been for the past four or so years.
That aside, KF2 isn't really a "I'm gonna play this every day for four days a week for the next forever" type of game; the gameplay simply doesn't work to the favor of that.

Past that, what are you worrying about here, exactly? That you'll run out of randoms to complain about joining your HOE match, to keep screaming at the devs that apparently every single breath they take is factually incorrect and is ruining the game forever and evidently this lovely chart is proof of that, or what? Why are these charts at all relevant? If anything, the community loves to shut out newcomers; the amount of passworded servers quadruples every free weekend, for example; the people we do still have generally tend to know what they're doing, and isn't that what's important? Quality players over a quantity of players?

 

[|WC|Capt.525]

For me, i jist dont find KF2 to as fun as the first one.
I do hop into the game when a new major update is pushed out, but then a day or 2 later, im back to playing my other usual games.
It was never like this for me with the first game, was on that game almost all day, to the point where it was my 2nd highested played game (1st being TF2 because free).
Its funny that i still dont have all my perks on lvl 6 or all map achievements despite my 1000+ hours. Bigger reasons to keep playing KF1 despite it being killed off.

This.
In KF1 I could play game after game for hours, just having fun, relaxing and talking crap with my mates. KF2 doesn't have that hold on me, it just doesn't feel as fun, and I don't think it ever will.
It's a good game and all, but I understand why there are spikes in the player numbers. There's a big update, you join in to check it out, play one game and go "eh", then put the game back in the corner for a few weeks. Maybe I haven't given the game a fair go, but it just feels like there is something missing.

 

[MrRogersBestNeighbor]

Oh god here we go again with steamcharts.

Stop extrapolating meaning from numbers. The number of active monthly players does not determine how healthy a game is; especially one who's gameplay consists of repetition. KF2's average numbers float around where KF1's numbers have generally been for the past four or so years.
That aside, KF2 isn't really a "I'm gonna play this every day for four days a week for the next forever" type of game; the gameplay simply doesn't work to the favor of that.

Past that, what are you worrying about here, exactly? That you'll run out of randoms to complain about joining your HOE match, to keep screaming at the devs that apparently every single breath they take is factually incorrect and is ruining the game forever and evidently this lovely chart is proof of that, or what? Why are these charts at all relevant? If anything, the community loves to shut out newcomers; the amount of passworded servers quadruples every free weekend, for example; the people we do still have generally tend to know what they're doing, and isn't that what's important? Quality players over a quantity of players?

Whether or not you can extrapolate anything from the numbers, there could at least still be ways to increase replayability in the game and hold onto people longer.
I see the game having a ton of potential in that regard.

 

[Jr175]

Stop extrapolating meaning from numbers.

Isn't that how advertisements and product placements work? Saying that they mean a lot is far fetched, true. But to say that they mean nothing is also a lie.

KF2 isn't really a "I'm gonna play this every day for four days a week for the next forever" type of game; the gameplay simply doesn't work to the favor of that.

Speak for yourself and whoever you represent. Because that group of people does not include me or anyone else outside of such a group.

If anything, the community loves to shut out newcomers; the amount of passworded servers quadruples every free weekend, for example; the people we do still have generally tend to know what they're doing, and isn't that what's important? Quality players over a quantity of players?

Same as above.

 

[ScrakeMorgendorffer]

If we're going to use the steamcharts as a baseline, bear in mind that the current playerbase is of a completed game with years of extra maps, an extra game mode and substantial amounts of DLC optional.

KF2 on the other hand currently has an average playerbase of about 3.5 - 4x the amount of KF1, despite being in early access, having roughly eight official maps, three perks short of being completed and still having a few bugs/fixes that need to be sorted out. In effect, many of you are comparing something that's not entirely complete with something that's probably in the twilight of its effective life, and this makes for an apples-and-oranges kind of comparison.

 

[WarJunky91]

The game just isn't fun to me like KF1 was. I enjoyed both kiting and camping. But one thing that turns me off of KF2 is the fact that unless you are in 1 or 2 spots or have your whole team on the correct set up you can't win. On KF1 you could have everyone be the same class for the most part and say "Hey we are going to run and gun this round" or "We are going to hold this hallway" and you could do it. Doing that on KF2 is suicide in most cases, ZEDs come from everywhere and you can't just set up camp and damage is so nerfed you can't survive if you get separated from your group doing run and gun. In KF1 you could be different just to have fun, KF2 you have to conform just to scrape by each wave. You could never do something like the Merry Men achievement on KF2 and that saddens me.

 

[reignfyre]

I have been playing since the game went into early access. In all honesty part of it is the game is getting a little old but another part of it is how different it feels compared to KF1. I played KF1 for the awesome shoot em up mechanics with really strong classes in general.

Now in KF2, everybody is a trash killer and big zeds are a bullet sponge. Not to mention that each of the classes feel weaker in their specialization if not just plain generic. The perk nerf bat no doubt has contributed to how burnt out I feel on the game. Almost anything good any perk gets is nerfed in some misguided sense of "balance" for a game that is largely supposed to be a co-op game, not a competitive game.

Support? Ammo cost nerfed, AA-12 nerfed
Commando - Ammo and recoil
Zerker - started out bad, became good, then got the nerf bat in damage for a strategy that exploits block(aka not swinging your weapon)
Medic - Armor healing nerfed for same strategy.
Firebug - Repeated click strat to save ammo and do more damage (but slower) nerfed. Now you just hold down the button and hope you have enough ammo.
Demo - Sucked on release, Nuke (the only reason you'd ever take the perk) was nerfed.
Gunslinger - new kid on the block, currently good but I'm betting that they'll nerf it.

I don't like nerfs in a co-op game. I don't play co-op games for competitive balance. The kill count matters little to me compared to finishing waves and the boss. (Hans melee is super strong right now).

As much as you can say "well KF2 is a different game" I can also say "it is the sequel to a game with specific mechanics I really enjoyed".

I played Zerker and Demo most in KF1. I liked that stunlocking scrakes with a katana was a reliable but not the fastest way to kill them (xbow), I liked that I had to play somewhat smartly with Demo not to blow myself up and not waste ammo. I had no problem with Sharpshooter one shotting scrakes and killing all things big zed related. Firebug - I liked that crisping the zeds was a unique mechanic. Only support and commando didn't interest me.

In general, it feels like players for some reason want to be the "best" in a co op game and developers seem to agree despite the gametype not really being the best for swinging the nerf bat. People care about content and if their perk gets stronger. Not if suddenly the thing they liked playing last patch is now a lot weaker because some people decided to take the nerf bat to the perk.

Well it is Early Access and you can expect lots and lots of tweaking to happen prior to release. What I hate more than anything is when devs realize they screwed up the core gameplay after release.

Honestly the cries about nerf are not very justified. You had something, now you don't. They're not trying to take candy from babies (although babies will see it that way), its for the good of the game. Zerk and medic were completely OP, and so was Nuke, and so was the fb splash damage. It just made it unfun to play any other class when you've got a nuker, an unkillable tank, and basically unlimited health and armor for the whole team.

Now every class can contribute (speaking from suicidal experience only) and there is a very noticeable difference in the playstyle of each.

 

[Munchiesaurus Rex]

The second spike was with a lot less people because it was when the MTs were announced. Everyone was expecting MTs, no one was expecting CSGO style RNG drops and that upsetted a lot of people.

I thought at first - it's TWI the people that were so cool for so many years - I play KF1 since 2010 - it was the first game that I ever bought because I wanted so much to support the developers in hopes tha KF2 will be even better.

Now that we have KF2 and it turned from a survival co op wave based shooter - to casual circlejerk for RNG based cosmetics - that drives away the oldschool fans of the franchise. Then you have Early Access + Console release + RNG microtransactions = fail. From all 799 733 copyes of KF2 sold ( http://steamspy.com/app/232090 ) only 1000 people are playing - what does that speak to you? That the Trading floor is good for the game? That the RNG based microtransactions works as intended? Ofcourse not.

KF2 is a fail on many levels. You can see the results.

My only hope is that when the game is released - there will be modders that will turn KF2 into KF1 with better graphics ... my hopes lay in the community and not in the developers - I saw what the developeres want and it's revenue, not to make a great product ...

 

[se05239]

The Store and microtransaction bull**** was the nail in the coffin for me.
The slow updating was frustrating and it is hard to stay loyal to a developer when they don't focus on making the KF1 2.0 that they had intended.

 

[Rattler]

They never said the game is gonna be KF1 2.0. They always said that KF2 is completely different game and they don't want to just "remaster" KF2 with better engine.

 

[infntnub]

This.
In KF1 I could play game after game for hours, just having fun, relaxing and talking crap with my mates. KF2 doesn't have that hold on me, it just doesn't feel as fun, and I don't think it ever will.
It's a good game and all, but I understand why there are spikes in the player numbers. There's a big update, you join in to check it out, play one game and go "eh", then put the game back in the corner for a few weeks. Maybe I haven't given the game a fair go, but it just feels like there is something missing.

WASSUP CAPT?!?!?!?

I felt the same way about the game, intially.

After really digging into the game I found it to be its own type of fun. It will never feel the same as KF1, but I honestly don't think that was ever the intention. It's a different twist with a lot more bling and blood.

Even in the current state of EA I have a lot of fun - especially on the custom map servers (as the base map pool does get stale quickly).

~sidenote~

The only thing more annoying than the MT introduction is finding people complaining about it ... still. If allowing cosmetic changes ruins your gaming experience it really must not take that much to do so in the first place.

It's optional, accept it or ignore it. Who cares....

 

[Shining Wolf]

New games come out and a chunk of the player base then play those. Most people get over games after a while when they feel like they've gotten their fill of content until another update hits. That's how every game population works.

As long as a person can log in and find a game in the difficulty they want and with maps they can tolerate at any time, the population is fine. Also... Why is ANYONE whining about a 14k population? That's absolutely huge, especially for an indie game.

Also, zerkwalling needs to die. As someone else mentioned, most HoE games are played by a Berserker standing in a doorway or a tight spot and everyone else standing behind him. It's an extremely boring way to play and finding a game that they're not doing that is harder than finding a game where they are. So if you want to find a legitimate game where they aren't doing that, you gotta jump from server to server until you find one.

You basically need to just play on Outpost and Burning Paris in HOE if you want to have non-door zerker games. Biotics Lab seems to work for most people but I can't do any headshots in the slight darkness there. Only join servers using those maps and be ready to bail if they start door camping.

 

[Munchiesaurus Rex]

They never said the game is gonna be KF1 2.0. They always said that KF2 is completely different game and they don't want to just "remaster" KF2 with better engine.

If it will be a completely different game then why is it called Killing Floor 2?

They could have called it anything else if they wanted to do a completely different game. You cant make a sequel of something that successfull and lure all the fans to buy it just to say - we are sorry but KF 2 will be a completely different game.

Things don't work this way. I am tottaly dissapointed from KF2 and TWI and with this there is not a single good gaming company left in the world and I had fun in Steam buygin games and collecting but I am back to pirating since I pay for producs and I am allways let down.

This is why piraci is even an issue - bad products. I paid 20 euro for Killing Floor 2 and from my friends I am the only one who has it legit and I can't play with them because I "wanted to support the developer" and now I see where my support is going - in the trash bin.

 

[DBShinigami]

Don't use "bad game" to justify "piracy" please.

If you don't want to pay for a bad game, just wait a little and look at the comment before buying.

Also, I really dislike the fact that you are thinking you're doing a favor to a company when you're just buying legally their product.

You only spent 20 pounds on a game, you did not put millions in the game.

I can understand you don't like the game, you don't like where it's going, fine. But, please do not start talking about piracy...

 

[moleculo]

Don't use "bad game" to justify "piracy" please.

If you don't want to pay for a bad game, just wait a little and look at the comment before buying.

Also, I really dislike the fact that you are thinking you're doing a favor to a company when you're just buying legally their product.

You only spent 20 pounds on a game, you did not put millions in the game.

I can understand you don't like the game, you don't like where it's going, fine. But, please do not start talking about piracy...

Strangely anti-consumer thoughts man

Piracy was definitely morally justifiable before Steam refunds and the likes came to be. You can't know what a game is like just by looking at videos and reviews. You shouldn't be forced into making blind decisions like that. It's unfortunately common on other areas too.

Paying for a game IS supporting its developers. It helps them get their pay. If it didn't, there would be no moral reason to pay for games if you can get them easily for free.

 

[BJ Vynz]

If it will be a completely different game then why is it called Killing Floor 2?
Things don't work this way.

Yes they do. It happens plenty.

This is why piraci is even an issue - bad products. I paid 20 euro for Killing Floor 2 and from my friends I am the only one who has it legit

Sure, people "try" their products once in a while. If you're saying that your friends just play this way they're kinda scummy and don't really dislike the product.