Last One Alive: Through the Fire and the Flames?

[timur]

Yes it does. Here comes the science!

He showed a non-noob using the strat. This logically means it cannot be a noob-only strat. This is only true of course if you accept the given: That Yoshi is not a noob.

I'm good with the given myself

If someone dares call Yoshi a noob, I will personally kill you... using mind bullets!:IS2:

 

[CandleJack]

I admit i have stockpiled ammo before, but i did it on House-R, with AKs.

Each one had 3+1 mags, and i didn't use any of the AKs i had stockpiled.

I don't stockpile with Firebug either.

I'll say that stockpiling does extend your ammo beyond what you would normally have access to, but in all the time KF has been out, the devs haven't fixed it i'm going to assume they're ok with it.

BTW, don't drag me into this train that's falling headfirst off the rails, i don't want to be on it when it crashes

 

[Compass]

Train already reached the non-exploit station. We are fine.

 

[timur]

Train already reached the non-exploit station. We are fine.

If so, let me admit that I have stockpiled before in wtfmod, with sniper rifles. Of course, in most cases, these are pillaged my others, but as long as they arent sold, Im fine having more snipers. And if they don't, then I am able to be able to stun maulers without having to worry about ammo.

In all other instances, stockpiling seems like a bad idea, so I refrain from it

 

[Compass]

Everyone tells me to aim better, but I can't really do that well when I'm fighting 400 Specimens with FakePlayers mut now, can I? Even the illustrious M14 can't kill 400 Specimens with a full pack of ammo solo.

 

[nutterbutter]

I can prove it's not an exploit.

PS: I win the thread for doing something we should have done at least 1 week ago.

Nope. Sorry. Just because one more person agrees with you doesn't mean than it isn't an exploit.

That would all be fine and dandy if the original "logic behind why this is an exploit" wasn't that it "effectively gives you unlimited ammunition".
This has been absolutely undefendable to begin with aside from the fact that it's completely off-topic.

That is what it does. It allows the exploiter to constantly shoot during the entire wave. After all, if they didn't want to be able to shoot constantly during the entire wave then they wouldn't have put extra weapons down.

I've stated it before and I'll state it again. The ability to drop weapons isn't the exploit. If only a single max load were in each dropped weapon then it wouldn't be an exploit. But being able to drop weapons while a dropped weapon holds multiple reloads is an exploit.

Personally, I've never out-lived a team as a firebug.

Follow this http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=43503

Yes it does. Here comes the science!

He showed a non-noob using the strat. This logically means it cannot be a noob-only strat. This is only true of course if you accept the given: That Yoshi is not a noob.

I'm good with the given myself

You need to brush up on your logic theory. A non-noob using the strategy just means that a non-noob is using the strategy.

Everyone tells me to aim better, but I can't really do that well when I'm fighting 400 Specimens with FakePlayers mut now, can I? Even the illustrious M14 can't kill 400 Specimens with a full pack of ammo solo.

That argument makes sense. Suuuure. I'm going to run a mutator that fundamentally changes the game then use that as proof that something isn't an exploit in a regular game. Psst, BTW... When I play on a 40 person defense map with 2 players and 800+ specimens, I'll stack weapons with the 100,000 starting cash. I'll also drop 30+ pipe bombs a wave as well. But regular rules don't apply when 40+ fleshpounds and 100+ scrakes are in a wave.

BTW, you have weapons other than the m14. Learn to use the 9mm, cannons (which penetrate and can kill 2 specimens with one shot), and learn to line up multiple targets with the xbow. I've played with mutators to kick up the specimen count and I haven't had a reason to stack weapons. Sure, there have been plenty of times where I've had to run to find ammo or I've died. But that is the point, yes? Nothing is learned or achieved by using 1,000 rounds of insta-kill, is it?

 

[timur]

Nutterbutters, sorry to say, but I think we were all having a little time to talk about the only moments where we stockpile weapons.

We have reached the depot of nuetrality and compromise. So nobody 'won'.

So either accept this, make your own thread, or I will have to figure out a way to get this thread closed.

Anyways, why does there need to be a 'winner'? TWI is the real judge here, so unless TWI descends upon us with judgement, this arguement will go on forever.

So, lets either continue on our tangent about the rare occaisons where we have crossed into stockpiling, or we can return to out original topic.

 

[Compass]

Simple, if you think it's an exploit, go to this thread: http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=33437

Tell Xienen, wait for him to respond, and then tell us what he says. Problem solved. If you're going to sit there calling about how it's an exploit.

Furthermore, go ahead report yourself and everyone in this thread for talking about an exploit, because that's clearly against the rules. Let's get this entire thread closed down for discussion of the "exploit" known as dropping weapons on the ground.

I'll wait.

 

[nutterbutter]

Nutterbutters, sorry to say, but I think we were all having a little time to talk about the only moments where we stockpile weapons.

We have reached the depot of nuetrality and compromise. So nobody 'won'.

Ok. And? I didn't say anyone won or lost.

So either accept this, make your own thread, or I will have to figure out a way to get this thread closed.

Why don't you reread what you typed and think about exactly what you meant. And before you go off on a knee-jerk reaction "I know what I meant", reread it again.

Anyways, why does there need to be a 'winner'?

I didn't say there had to be. Again, WhiteTigerShiro and myself correctly view this as opinion.

So, lets either continue on our tangent about the rare occaisons where we have crossed into stockpiling, or we can return to out original topic.

Sorry. Just because I wanted to read a few replies and make one big reply doesn't make you the forum police.

 

[timur]

Ok. And? I didn't say anyone won or lost.



Why don't you reread what you typed and think about exactly what you meant. And before you go off on a knee-jerk reaction "I know what I meant", reread it again.



I didn't say there had to be. Again, WhiteTigerShiro and myself correctly view this as opinion.



Sorry. Just because I wanted to read a few replies and make one big reply doesn't make you the forum police.

Im sorry, nutterbutters, its just that I did not make this thread for a stockpiling debate, and have gotten quite sick of it. This is my way at putting my foot down; you just happened to be the unlucky person who ended up getting that irritation directed at you. My annoyance is not at you, nutterbutters, but at anyone and everyone who continues this debate here.

I don't mean to be the'forum police', but I am officially reaching the end of my temper. (And don't say that it marks a short temper; I waited a good 5 pages for you guys to sort it out).

So, sorry again, but Im trying to kill this once and for all.

 

[nutterbutter]

So, sorry again, but Im trying to kill this once and for all.

Everyone here is discussing something. Yes, the discussed topic is different from the subject line, but that's ok. Everyone has been relatively polite. No name-calling. No insulting other than a few snide remarks that everyone makes in passing and everyone understands is simply everyday talk. You don't need to "kill this once and for all." This thread will peter out just like every other thread in existence. If you stop replying to this thread, then this thread has ended "once and for all" for you.

Why are you trying to dictate what polite people are discussing? If you don't want to be a part of this thread then don't.

 

[9_6]

Why are you trying to dictate what polite people are discussing? If you don't want to be a part of this thread then don't.

Why are you?
Also he made this thread and it wasn't exactly about stockpiling.
Go ahead an make a thread about stockpiling if you want to continue to discuss it.
I thought this discussion was over a page ago.

Follow this http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=43503

I know how to play.
If the team sucks, firebugs just tend to suffer the consequences first.
If no one helps you with your fleshpound problem, there's very little you can do on your own unless you just so happen to have pipes.
Then again I don't play firebug all too terribly often.

 

[nutterbutter]

Why are you?
Also he made this thread and it wasn't exactly about stockpiling.
Go ahead an make a thread about stockpiling if you want to continue to discuss it.
I thought this discussion was over a page ago.

I'm not trying to dictate what people are discussing. Why would you think I am? Why make a new thread when we have a perfectly good one here?

I know how to play.
If the team sucks, firebugs just tend to suffer the consequences first.

Not if the firebug is playing according to my guide. If the firebug is out front and aggroing everything then sure, he'll go first. But firebug isn't supposed to be doing that. Like I say in my guide, the firebug is played like a medic, not like another class.

If no one helps you with your fleshpound problem, there's very little you can do on your own unless you just so happen to have pipes.

There is a very easy way for firebug to deal with the fleshpound problem. Don't aggro them and if they get into the group, don't shoot them unless someone is about to die. One of my cardinal rules is "Don't be the first to shoot something unless you can kill it." If I am on a team and someone else has FP duty, you best believe the FP will hit me first before I fire on him.

 

[9_6]

Sure saying "don't aggro them" is easy but a burning pound is a raging pound and lighting stuff on fire happens quickly.

Also your guide requires a halfway competent team. Doesn't it.

 

[nutterbutter]

Sure saying "don't aggro them" is easy but a burning pound is a raging pound and lighting stuff on fire happens quickly.

I can't think of another way to say this so excuse the bluntness; "Pay attention." That flame goes where the player wants and it lasts as long as the player wants it to last. The flamer isn't the xbow. Doesn't expect to have pinpoint accuracy and shoot a crawler walking next to an FP 80 feet away. Watch were the flame is going and don't shoot in blindly into intersections.

Also your guide requires a halfway competent team. Doesn't it.

Maybe. But it works both ways. I liken a competent firebug as a force multiplier for the entire team. A firebug who knows what he is doing makes the entire team better and more efficient. If the team sucks then nothing will help.

 

[9_6]

Why, I must be an incompetent firebug then.

But tell us, what do you think a firebug should do if he's supposed to solo 200+ specimens?
I saw you suggested to just nade + hose fleshpounds down earlier.
Surely, you must be jesting?

 

[nutterbutter]

But tell us, what do you think a firebug should do if he's supposed to solo 200+ specimens?

http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showpost.php?p=615132&postcount=4

 

[9_6]

Thank you for linking me to what I've said I've already read.
The last time I checked, trying to hose fleshpounds down with a flamer was not really a good idea.
In fact, it's one of the worst ideas you can possibly have.
Just trying that with scrakes *barely* works and it works only because of that "on fire" behavior.
Those 3 flame grenades -which you probably won't have anyway- don't change all too much about that.
Those are for roundhouse-kicking out of a surround.

Now -unless your argument is that by hosing the damage somehow effectively racks up into infinity just like stockpiling somehow gives effectively infinitely ammunition, and I'd have nothing to add to that- how would this work?

We are talking about hard+ difficulty, yes?

 

[nutterbutter]

Thank you for linking me to what I've said I've already read.
The last time I checked, trying to hose fleshpounds down with a flamer was not really a good idea.
In fact, it's one of the worst ideas you can possibly have.
Just trying that with scrakes barely even works, if at all.
Those 3 flame grenades -which you probably won't have anyway- don't change all too much about that.

Now -unless your argument is that by hosing the damage somehow effectively racks up into infinity just like stockpiling somehow gives effectively infinitely ammunition, and I'd have nothing to add to that- how would this work?

We are talking about hard+ difficulty, yes?

What do you want from me?

Instructions on how to solo 200+ specimens with the flamer
1) Reload the flamer
2) Switch to pistol. Reload that.
3) Run to the intersection and turn right. Flame the 3 sirens that are there.
4) Spin around and shoot the 2 crawlers chasing you. Reload pistol before switching to flamer
5) Spin back around and get the ammo up and to the right
6) Go to the steps and drop a grenade. Spin back around and kill the 2 gorefasts and 3 clots trailing.
7) Run down the steps and to the end of the hall. On the left is a scrake and 2 sirens. Go to the right.
8) Run past the husk and kill the 3 gorefasts with the flamer. Then spin around and kill the Husk with the pistol. Reload pistol, then flamer, and you'll have time to heal while running to the next intersection.

Is that what you are looking for?

If solo, I fight the flamer like every other perk. http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=42173

Reload often.
Shoot the target with the lowest powerful weapon first.
Cycle weapons so ammo boxes fill multiple weapons.
Shoot targets till they drop. If that means emptying a canister in a scrake or FP, then do it. When solo, health is more important than ammo.
Make the 9mm your best friend for situations like this.
If I have to kill an FP or scrake, I'm going to attack him as far away as possible to maximize DoT. I'm also going to line up an many specimens between him and me so when I have to hose down a distance, I will maximize the fire's damage.
I'm going keep moving and use cover. I'm going to break visual lock as often as possible.
I'm going to stay on the move to pick up armor, ammo, and any other weapons that I can.
I'm going to keep the flamer as long as possible because that weapon gives me the best chance to succeed until multiple FP or scrakes show up.
If I am well under a canister of fuel left, I'm going to find a weapon and a way out. I'm going to draw the specimens close and I'm going to hose them down, ditch the flamer, and grab the other weapon and run.

Or you can go to plan B. Hose everything because the damage effectively racks up to
infinity.

 

[9_6]

Sounds a bit better than "Drop multiple grenades and hose the hell out of him till he drops. If another FP is due later in the wave, I'd kite with the pistol and look for weapons. Once the next FP shows, hose him until he drops." even though I still don't see how hosing pounds is any good at all.
If anything, you should try to ignore them until you have something that can kill them.