It means that certain elements have to be different in order for gameplay not to suffer.
Unfortunately, these elements = increased hardware requirements.
Unfortunately, these elements = increased hardware requirements.
Iron Sights Zoom (Merged)
- Thread starter Kurtz
- Start date
Exactly. If the new game the are working on offers richer maps and better hding and camo options be it by character customization, generally richer maps, bigger map sizes or other means and iron-sight-zoom has to be discussed again.
btw. it isn't just about having better, more detailed graphics! E.g. in the original "Ghost Recon" which is't exactly a highly detailed looking game, camo works exceptionally well so the zoom is justified there.
In RO in its current form its not because we need the lack of zoom to make up for shortcomings in that regard.
Maybe RO2 or a differently named equivalent is different.
btw. it isn't just about having better, more detailed graphics! E.g. in the original "Ghost Recon" which is't exactly a highly detailed looking game, camo works exceptionally well so the zoom is justified there.
In RO in its current form its not because we need the lack of zoom to make up for shortcomings in that regard.
Maybe RO2 or a differently named equivalent is different.
For me that is still no real argument as you could say that allready. The gameplay we have now has often - on public servers - nothing to do with realism. Maybe you'd see the effects more, but they are allready there.
There is allready close to no possiblity to camouflage. It could be more usefull with the "zoom", but it would be usefull now too.
Nevertheless I don't like talking about the effects something could have as I don't see sense in that, maybe someone will do such a mutator then we can see what it feels like online. And as none is forced to run a mutator the only loss there could be is time for the coder.
There is allready close to no possiblity to camouflage. It could be more usefull with the "zoom", but it would be usefull now too.
Nevertheless I don't like talking about the effects something could have as I don't see sense in that, maybe someone will do such a mutator then we can see what it feels like online. And as none is forced to run a mutator the only loss there could be is time for the coder.
Of course you could say that already. But that's not a reason to make it worse.
If your kid trips are injures its knees do you shoot it in the kneecaps because it was injured already? /sarcasm
Nah, if you can code such a mutator or if you find someone to code it for you that's fine. Everyone is allowed to mod whatever he wants and if it turns out to be unexpectedly great then I'm sure some servers might run it.
However something as gameplay altering as a zoom-function should not be officially included by tripwire themselves. Just as a crosshair-mutator (just a slightly more extrem example) might be fun for some people and could help for training purposes, but if it was in the game officially tripwire would lose credibility as the developer of a realistic game.
I posted a thread once that Mutators aren't taken serious by anyone so tripwire would have a bit of fool's freedom there. They could add a bunch of controversial things like this zoom we are talking about here or more powerfull grenades etc.
In that spirit your zoom-mutator would be perfectly acceptable as long as it isn't forced. However tripwire seems to think differently of Mutators and treats them for what they are: Server options. And in that regard, a zoom would be too much of a departure from the current gameplay, and one that wouldn't benefit us as long as the rest of RO stays the same (as pointed out before).
If your kid trips are injures its knees do you shoot it in the kneecaps because it was injured already? /sarcasm
Nah, if you can code such a mutator or if you find someone to code it for you that's fine. Everyone is allowed to mod whatever he wants and if it turns out to be unexpectedly great then I'm sure some servers might run it.
However something as gameplay altering as a zoom-function should not be officially included by tripwire themselves. Just as a crosshair-mutator (just a slightly more extrem example) might be fun for some people and could help for training purposes, but if it was in the game officially tripwire would lose credibility as the developer of a realistic game.
I posted a thread once that Mutators aren't taken serious by anyone so tripwire would have a bit of fool's freedom there. They could add a bunch of controversial things like this zoom we are talking about here or more powerfull grenades etc.
In that spirit your zoom-mutator would be perfectly acceptable as long as it isn't forced. However tripwire seems to think differently of Mutators and treats them for what they are: Server options. And in that regard, a zoom would be too much of a departure from the current gameplay, and one that wouldn't benefit us as long as the rest of RO stays the same (as pointed out before).
You act like the outcome is completly sure.
If I could code I wouldn't bother to post that much as I'd have a lot ideas - my own or collected - to change things.
Yeah, the RO community is not really mutator friendly and some don't see the strength and the possibilities mutators have. I did not see them myself for a long time, only INF and its community made me see what mutators can really accomplish. New Gamemodes, new weapons, different attachments, night vision, deploy ability, slower movement if you move up a slope, intuitive direction System (Enemy coming from SE (automatically saying the right direction etc. )), a Numpad like thing on your HUD to choose commands ......
If I could code I wouldn't bother to post that much as I'd have a lot ideas - my own or collected - to change things.
Yeah, the RO community is not really mutator friendly and some don't see the strength and the possibilities mutators have. I did not see them myself for a long time, only INF and its community made me see what mutators can really accomplish. New Gamemodes, new weapons, different attachments, night vision, deploy ability, slower movement if you move up a slope, intuitive direction System (Enemy coming from SE (automatically saying the right direction etc. )), a Numpad like thing on your HUD to choose commands ......
Ironsight zoom IS more realistic
Ironsight zoom IS more realistic
Just wanted to back up Dslyecxi:
Those who are against zoom because "eyes don't zoom" either missed the point or don't understand it.
That's why many games and simulators have an ironsight zoom (Operation Flashpoint, if you want to talk about a "realistic game") Other games have used this feature well, with a good risk/reward: While zoomed you have less fov, aiming speed, and range of motion.
Dslyecxi does an excellent job trying to explain this in previous posts so I'll leave it there.
Ironsight zoom IS more realistic
Just wanted to back up Dslyecxi:
Those who are against zoom because "eyes don't zoom" either missed the point or don't understand it.
- Our eyes don't "see", our brains do.
- This about perception, not just optics.
- Because computer monitors can't replicate the optics of our eyes, the perception can be "off", in-game. (e.g., things seem farther away than they would in real life)
- Having an optional, temporary zoom helps to compensate for the limitations of screens to more closely mtch our perception when our brains are "focusing" on long distances.
That's why many games and simulators have an ironsight zoom (Operation Flashpoint, if you want to talk about a "realistic game") Other games have used this feature well, with a good risk/reward: While zoomed you have less fov, aiming speed, and range of motion.
Dslyecxi does an excellent job trying to explain this in previous posts so I'll leave it there.
I would also like to point out that IRL it is a whole lot easier to tell if there is a guy standing right beind you than it is in ROO. If anything the FOV should be increased because right now we are significantly more handicapped in being able to detect players right next to us than we are in being able to headshot a guy at 500m.Just wanted to back up Dslyecxi:
Those who are against zoom because "eyes don't zoom" either missed the point or don't understand it.
- Our eyes don't "see", our brains do.
- This about perception, not just optics.
- Because computer monitors can't replicate the optics of our eyes, the perception can be "off", in-game. (e.g., things seem farther away than they would in real life)
- Having an optional, temporary zoom helps to compensate for the limitations of screens to more closely mtch our perception when our brains are "focusing" on long distances.
That's why many games and simulators have an ironsight zoom (Operation Flashpoint, if you want to talk about a "realistic game") Other games have used this feature well, with a good risk/reward: While zoomed you have less fov, aiming speed, and range of motion.
Dslyecxi does an excellent job trying to explain this in previous posts so I'll leave it there.
I would also like to point out that IRL it is a whole lot easier to tell if there is a guy standing right beind you than it is in ROO. If anything the FOV should be increased because right now we are significantly more handicapped in being able to detect players right next to us than we are in being able to headshot a guy at 500m.
in this case to be able to hit someone the way you do it in real life is more important, RO is more of a camper game than a game where you have to constantly watch your back, and by doing it while in ironsights, its clear where your interests are.
Also, if the FOV was increased even further, the tunnel vision would be horrible, and the problem would be worsened (enemies would look to be even farther away, so even if they are 10m from you they would look like pixels, right now, the enemies already look small because what you see in the monitor is wrapped so you have a more anoramic view) the zoom would not be a newbie helper or some unrealistic thing, it would be just a correction of the wrap caused by the FOV to match the size of what you would see in real life
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Its a game, yes it is supposed to be realistic but it should be also fun and ballanced (as long as it stays somewhat realistic)
I loved k98 is Day of Defeat but here, I have really hard time hitting anything.
I always choose bolt-actions, and they can stay as they are. But, if the zoom was added, I wouldnt complain.
First, it would make game slightly more accesible for newbies who 90% of time are forced to play with riflese I know elitists jerks dont care, but I do (since Im new player too).
Quote on Yoshiro from Tripware at Steam forums:
"I've been playing for 6 years and am still carp (yes, its a fish) with a boltie."
Second...well theres no second for now.
I loved k98 is Day of Defeat but here, I have really hard time hitting anything.
I always choose bolt-actions, and they can stay as they are. But, if the zoom was added, I wouldnt complain.
First, it would make game slightly more accesible for newbies who 90% of time are forced to play with riflese I know elitists jerks dont care, but I do (since Im new player too).
Quote on Yoshiro from Tripware at Steam forums:
"I've been playing for 6 years and am still carp (yes, its a fish) with a boltie."
Second...well theres no second for now.
And other people have gotten the hang of them in 2 days (I know of some, 5dollarers from last 5dollar days) ...
I think that most people's error with the bolties, is that they play as if they had a SMG, or a Semi, ie assaulting at close quarters...
I sometimes even take the bolt on Lyeskrovi, even when SMGs are still available...
Speaking about DoD, I really can't use the Kar in that game. Between the fact people run around with the speed of cougars on cafeine, and the fact that I, as a reflex, use those crappy ironsights more than I should...And of course, the fact that most maps have ridiculously short fields of fire...
Just wanted to back up Dslyecxi:
Those who are against zoom because "eyes don't zoom" either missed the point or don't understand it.
- Our eyes don't "see", our brains do.
- This about perception, not just optics.
- Because computer monitors can't replicate the optics of our eyes, the perception can be "off", in-game. (e.g., things seem farther away than they would in real life)
- Having an optional, temporary zoom helps to compensate for the limitations of screens to more closely mtch our perception when our brains are "focusing" on long distances.
That's why many games and simulators have an ironsight zoom (Operation Flashpoint, if you want to talk about a "realistic game") Other games have used this feature well, with a good risk/reward: While zoomed you have less fov, aiming speed, and range of motion.
Dslyecxi does an excellent job trying to explain this in previous posts so I'll leave it there.
I just luuuuuuurve this argument. So the monitor limitation should be compensated for the person who's been looking at the same corner for 10 minutes with ironsight zoom up but not for his victim who's just popped hit head around it? So, in order to not be "gayed" by this crutch that helps no-skilled players aim (might as well put autoaim in while we're at it) the game has to slow down even more with everyone scanning the horizon with ironsight zoom before they move up.
Please go play Call of Dootie where people who can't aim congregate.
The argument with "i only get rifle but just started the game"...come on...rifle is the best way to learn how to move carefully and plan your moves. If you really need a smg...pick one up.
As i started Ro i only played like danzig or arad to understand what was going on. Needless to say, i got stuck with the bolt all the time. Playing Danzig was logical too since it was closest to the cod maps i had played before..not too big ect...
I hate the idea of a ironsight zoom, in fact iam against everything that makes the core of RO "more acessable". Since changes like that whould destroy what ro is.
As i started Ro i only played like danzig or arad to understand what was going on. Needless to say, i got stuck with the bolt all the time. Playing Danzig was logical too since it was closest to the cod maps i had played before..not too big ect...
I hate the idea of a ironsight zoom, in fact iam against everything that makes the core of RO "more acessable". Since changes like that whould destroy what ro is.
What you talking about ? FOV is fine...plus...most of the times i hear more than i see. Hearing is such a big factor in ro, specialy if you use a 5.1 headset or system.
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you should run for officeI don't think the zoom in is a good idea, but I'll support it if it helps me get that damned Marksman Gold
