Infantry weapons that should be added for Red orchestra 2

[Victhor-ASH]

I know that but it would be much more useful if new weapons would be added. Instead of adding so many pointless classes like the Elite assault.

 

[ross]

As long as this game remains Heroes of Stalingrad, there are a handful of weapons which definitely do need adding, and none of them are rare enough for this to be necessary.

 

[Victhor-ASH]

I didn't meant adding rare weapons just weapons common that were used after Stalingrad like the: Mp41, G43, PPd 40, PPs 41/43. Or also if new grenades will be added this feature will help a lot.

 

[ross]

I didn't meant adding rare weapons just weapons common that were used after Stalingrad like the: Mp41, G43, PPd 40, PPs 41/43. Or also if new grenades will be added this feature will help a lot.

The MP 41 was not common, ever. It was in very limited use and even then mostly by field police, not combat troops. The PPD was also very rare. The G43 and PPS-43 were both too late to see any use at all in Stalingrad and should not be added unless TWI expand the game to cover the entire war, or someone makes a late-war mod.

Once again, you demonstrate you have no idea what you are talking about. Why do you keep making crap up about how rare or common weapons were?

 

[Clowndoe]

Oh I get it, so we need this feature just in-case we add more weapons. I am now a believer.

 

[fitzgibd]

I am new to the game but agree wholeheartedly with this post.

Do any severs currently implement some of the ideas here, especially the removal of the AVT and MKb?

 

[Victhor-ASH]

Ross have you played Red orchestra Ostfront? Didn't you see that the weapons present in Red orchestra 1 weren't realistically issued to specific soldiers. If the PPd was so rare why it was issued for so many soldiers in Ostfront it shouldve been issued in a much lesser quantity? It wasn't realistically issued for the soldiers. Now the quantity feature isn't needed but just think if new weapons would be issued like the: PPD 40, PPS 42/43, MP 41, G43 and other weapons because I don't find it realistcally for a rare weapon to be issued in the game in the same quantity like the PPD 40 or the Mp 41.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

I am new to the game but agree wholeheartedly with this post.

Do any severs currently implement some of the ideas here, especially the removal of the AVT and MKb?

In Classic they're removed.

 

[ross]

No they aren't, actually, unless there was a patch some time between me going to bed and waking up just now.

In fact, most of the maps have no regular assault classes in Classic, all Elite (since there are less assaults in general to compensate for engineers' SMGs)

Ross have you played Red orchestra Ostfront? Didn't you see that the weapons present in Red orchestra 1 weren't realistically issued to specific soldiers. If the PPd was so rare why it was issued for so many soldiers in Ostfront it shouldve been issued in a much lesser quantity? It wasn't realistically issued for the soldiers.

Yes, of course I played RO. I played it constantly from late 2006 when I got it right through to the day that RO2 released. While the PPD and especially MP 41 being so common did bug me, along with other historical mistakes like the 91/30 PU being built on a hex receiver and the Kar98k having Soviet capture marks, and the Luger having screws that aren't there on the real gun, I could mostly ignore them because the rest of the game was so well-designed and immersive, and all of the mistakes were honest ones. In RO2, on the other hand, the devs were told by people who know what they're talking about that the stuff they were trying to include was wrong, or irrelevant, or just didn't exist in the first place. They chose to ignore that, and implemented it anyway.

I distinctly recall a friend who was in one of the earlier betas telling me that TWI expressly asked to only report bugs or seriously flawed gameplay. They didn't care about historical accuracy or design issues.

Now the quantity feature isn't needed but just think if new weapons would be issued like the: PPD 40, PPS 42/43, MP 41, G43 and other weapons because I don't find it realistcally for a rare weapon to be issued in the game in the same quantity like the PPD 40 or the Mp 41.

None of those weapons are in RO2 and none of them except the PPD-40 were even used in Stalingrad (and the G43 didn't even exist at the time), so they aren't relevant at all.

The only case where this would be useful is limiting the G41 and giving most German elite riflemen a captured SVT, since the G41 was an extremely uncommon rifle compared to the many captured SVTs in German service.

 

[Victhor-ASH]

Yes but why do you think the weapon quantity feature would remove balance. First of all by adding weapon quantity. It would be no need for a class like elite assault because you can just implement a weapon quantity option for assault and satisfy the players. Also for pistols eventough they arent as much used such a feature would make the more rare pistols be used less making it more realistic.

Also I don't see the point in adding a bolt action rifle for elite Riflemen if it wouldn't be limited or arive in a higher quantity like the semi auto rifle. Or the G41 should arrive in much lesser quantity than the Svt 40. Also for the elite assault is pointless to add an smg if you already have a much more powerful rifle for usage.

By adding this feature it will diminish the overuse of weapons which wouldve been rare in the Stalingrad battle.

 

[ross]

Yes but why do you think the weapon quantity feature would remove balance.

My eyesight must really be failing me. I don't see the word 'balance' anywhere in any of my recent posts. Please go right ahead and point out exactly where I said anything about balance, or this 'removing' it.

First of all by adding weapon quantity. It would be no need for a class like elite assault because you can just implement a weapon quantity option for assault and satisfy the players.

Or you could remove the irrelevant weapons which saw very little or no use anywhere near Stalingrad from the game and not need to in the first place?

Also for pistols eventough they arent as much used such a feature would make the more rare pistols be used less making it more realistic.

NO. IT. WOULD. NOT.

How many times do you have to be told? THIS IS NOT NEEDED FOR THE PISTOLS BECAUSE (if we assume replacing the C96 with a Luger, especially) THERE WAS NOT ANY NOTICEABLE DIFFERENCE IN 'RARITY'. Are you ignoring everything I have been saying for the last what, three days? YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT HOW 'RARE' WEAPONS WERE, YOU ARE MAKING THIS CRAP UP. THERE IS NOTHING REALISTIC OR HISTORICALLY ACCURATE ABOUT IT, YOU ARE IMAGINING THINGS. Your sig really is appropriate.

Also I don't see the point in adding a bolt action rifle for elite assault if it wouldn't be limited or arive in a higher quantity like the semi auto rifle.

What? Bolt-actions for elite assault? What are you even talking about?

Or the G41 should arrive in much lesser quantity than the Svt 40. Also for the elite assault is pointless to add an smg if you already have a much more powerful rifle for usage.

Again, what rifle are you talking about? This is assuming that the MKb and AVT are removed, but even if they aren't I and many other people will jump on the Elite Assault class and use an MP 40 or PPSh just to deny someone else their special snowflake rifle.

By adding this feature it will diminish the overuse of weapons which wouldve been rare in the Stalingrad battle.

Or we could just remove them from the game in the first place since the only 'rare' weapon which should be in the game at all is the G41?

e: I&S posters, new drinking game: every time x3ckid begins a post with the words "yes but", down a shot. See you all in the hospital!

 

[Victhor-ASH]

I posted in general for the previous posts. I wasn't posting only for you chill up want to dicuss this privately I recomend we use skype.

I think your typing with so much zeal to exploit my mistakes and use it as a counter argument that your fingers are burning. So go and chill up. Or if this doesn't work use the fridge open it and put your head inside.

 

[ross]

I think you are talking crap about things you don't actually understand to either try and impress people with your 'knowledge', or to slip by some of your suggestions under the radar.

I have no problem with mappers being able to tweak loadouts, and I can see a weapons-per-class limiter being useful to them. However, the Ostfront system of simply adding a new class worked well enough in lieu of what would be a fairly major UI overhaul (not to mention the necessary code to make it work), and I wouldn't expect any one class to have more than one limited weapon available, maybe two at an absolute maximum. Within the stock game, there is almost no need for this if the historically questionable or flat out wrong weapons and unlocks are removed or replaced (MKb and AVT out, P.08 replacing C96). The only time it is suitable is the G41, and even that could be solved by making it a Hero unlock and making the SVT the default weapon for both sides' elite riflemen.

What I do have a problem with is you simply making up which weapons this should apply to as you go, and suggesting the inclusion of weapons which have no place in the game with this. If you would just shut up about G43s and MP41s for ten seconds, people might actually start agreeing with you.

And no, this discussion does not need to be private where it's hidden away from the rest of the community. Aside from that, you and I are clearly incompatible personalities and it's taking all the self restraint I have to continue replying here without getting absolutely hammered. Having you on Skype would probably result in me going to get my stomach pumped.

 

[Victhor-ASH]

The weapons I posted are specific to the threads name "Infantry weapons that should be added for Red orchestra 2". It is a title and I posted at the begining of the thread what should be posted. And I dont meant to add the PPd or Mp 41 I just pointed them in dicussion as they werent realistically issued for soliders in Ostfront. Because a PPd wouldve been in the same quantity on specific maps like the PPsh 41 which isn't realistic at all.

Just because you think it wouldn't work that doesn't mean it wouldn't work. I played many games in my lifetime and balance can come from the strangest situations which are listend in a game. As an example Global Offensive has like the same loadout system like Red orchestra 2 but is a lot more refined. Having also a quantity system to exploit. It makes the game very balanced.

 

[ross]

The weapons I posted are specific to the threads name "Infantry weapons that should be added for Red orchestra 2". It is a title and I posted at the begining of the thread what should be posted.

So how come you think the G43 should be in the game when the first prototypes of the G43 weren't even in use until after the battle of Stalingrad was over?

And I dont meant to add the PPd or Mp 41 I just pointed them in dicussion as they werent realistically issued for soliders in Ostfront. Because a PPd wouldve been in the same quantity on specific maps like the PPsh 41 which isn't realistic at all.

And neither of them are in this game, so how is that relevant at all?

Just because you think it wouldn't work that doesn't mean it wouldn't work. I played many games in my lifetime and balance can come from the strangest situations which are listend in a game. As an example Global Offensive has like the same loadout system like Red orchestra 2 but is a lot more refined. Having also a quantity system to exploit. It makes the game very balanced.

NOBODY EXCEPT YOU HAS SAID ANYTHING ABOUT BALANCE, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?

 

[Victhor-ASH]

I was talking about the quantity feature, do you read all that I type before posting? or you don't understand? And like I said in previous posts the game is not limited for Stalingrad it is just a fancy name to make the game more popular. Because we already have maps that are after the battle of Stalingrad like Arad. So tell what don't you understand so I can explain to you. Because english is not my native language so I can make you understand what I meant.

 

[ross]

I was talking about the quantity feature, do you read all that I type before posting? or you don't understand?

Are you winding me up? You suddenly start spewing out some nonsense about "why do you think it would affect balance" when I never said anything about balance in the first place. Are you putting words into my mouth just so you can then argue with them?

And like I said in previous posts the game is not limited for Stalingrad it is just a fancy name to make the game more popular.

Actually, yes it is limited to Stalingrad. Tripwire themselves have stated more times than I care to count that the game is set in and around Stalingrad. Nowhere else. Unless you're about to say you know more about the game's design than the people who made it, I suggest you rethink that comment.

Because we already have maps that are after the battle of Stalingrad like Arad.

...And is also a custom map. One custom map. Every single default map is in Stalingrad.

So tell what don't you understand so I can explain to you. Because english is not my native language so I can make you understand what I meant.

Nothing could make me understand how you are arriving at some of these conclusions.

 

[Giuliano]

I think I get the gist of what Xeckid is trying to say. He's basically saying that there should be restrictions on certain weapons. For instance, if the PPD40 were to be added to the game it would make sense to limit how many there are available to the assualt class seeing as it was almost completely phased out. So if you've got 3 guys using the assault class only one guy should have access to the PPD40. I think thats what he's trying to say? RO1 did have a similar system if I remember correctly so I can agree with some of the things Xeckid is saying.

However, at the moment this game is set in Stalingrad so a lot of the weapons he's mentioned wouldn't make any sense if they were added.

 

[Clowndoe]

Nah ross knows what X3Ckid is saying, he's just perpetually dumbfounded by the suggestion. Apparently, we need a system to limit how many of a certain weapon one class can have, just in-case in the future Tripwire decides to add weapons to that class, even though you could also just make up your own classes.

Ex: I have a map where I don't want more than 1 PPD 40 and 3 PPSH's, then I can have 3 assault classes and 1 class that I can easily create and call the 'archaic assault' (random title)

Anyway, I return to my previous suggestion: Ross can stop replying, and if it bothers him too much take a stiff drink and start repressing.

 

[Raneman]

I can tell Ross is hurt, I have seen him in another life.