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Gunslinger Perk - Yes or No?

Gunslinger Perk - Yes or No?


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    240
Personally, I think this is an awful idea. You're just splitting Sharpshooter in half, and giving the new perk a big revolver to replace the xbow. It's a cool idea and all, but no. I think Tripwire would have to be completely desperate to add this, and to be honest, they have no reason to be.

Way to ignore every single argument about how pistols are better off being used for another purpose than pretending to be sharpshooter rifles.

I still think that different perks should get different non-damage-dealing benefits for the pistols according to their perk's role. Sharpie would get recoil reduction in this case, mando with reload speed, and so on. That's a load of depth to the game added right there. New strategies! New playstyles! Yay!

The only arguments I heard for letting sharpie keep his pistols is "I suck really bad at the game and I need more guns with massive bonuses applied so I can win." Yeah, no.
 
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If Tripwire Interactive is going to make a new "perk" for Killing Floor, I would hope it would include brand new weapons and abilities.

Cold Engineer Perk

OR

Shock Therapy Perk


Gunslinger Perk? No Thanks. At least you got over 50 pages of opinion. I hope it doesn't give your hopes up since it has gotten noticed so much.
 
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Way to ignore every single argument about how pistols are better off being used for another purpose than pretending to be sharpshooter rifles.

I still think that different perks should get different non-damage-dealing benefits for the pistols according to their perk's role. Sharpie would get recoil reduction in this case, mando with reload speed, and so on. That's a load of depth to the game added right there. New strategies! New playstyles! Yay!

The only arguments I heard for letting sharpie keep his pistols is "I suck really bad at the game and I need more guns with massive bonuses applied so I can win." Yeah, no.

I really like the idea of perk-related pistol bonuses for each perk. But, the Gunslinger perk, like I said, really just seems like a remake of Sharpshooter, with a big revolver instead of an xbow. It just seems pointless from what I've read. If I had to choose between Sharpshooter and Gunslinger, I'd probably take Gunslinger, because I like the idea and versatility, but Gunslinger can't happen without crippling or removing Sharpshooter, and I doubt they'll remove Sharp lol
 
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I really like the idea of perk-related pistol bonuses for each perk. But, the Gunslinger perk, like I said, really just seems like a remake of Sharpshooter, with a big revolver instead of an xbow. It just seems pointless from what I've read. If I had to choose between Sharpshooter and Gunslinger, I'd probably take Gunslinger, because I like the idea and versatility, but Gunslinger can't happen without crippling or removing Sharpshooter, and I doubt they'll remove Sharp lol

But it's hardly crippling

it balances sharpshooter a bit more, if anything. Giving him a focus on rifles gives him a focus on single large zeds at range, which was the point of the perk in the first place. Don't forget, this is a team game. IMO if any perk is able to cope completely alone on a multiplayer HOE game, it's probably overpowered. In this case, the sharpshooter can handle trash really well (any pistol) and then rape the **** out of the large zeds (xbow).

That's OP as all hell. That should not happen.

Pistols are a versatile weapon for all ranges (WTF), even more so in close range. That's more of a Commando thing anyway, no? I think pistols should have their range capabilities removed, and no longer be treated as sharpshooter weapons.

That way, sharpshooter actually becomes the sharpshooting sniper class. Not Commando 2.0.

I still think sharpie should get the benefit of reduced recoil from pistols. But not ultra discount/damage/reload speed. That's ridiculous. This is my idea:

- Sharpie gets recoil reduction
- Suppie gets a few spare magazines
- Demo gets a discount
- Commando has a reload speed buff
- Firebug has incendiary ammo
- Medic has extended magazines

Zerker doesn't get anything because lolmeleeclass. Though a discount isn't a bad idea.
 
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But it's hardly crippling

it balances sharpshooter a bit more, if anything. Giving him a focus on rifles gives him a focus on single large zeds at range, which was the point of the perk in the first place. Don't forget, this is a team game. IMO if any perk is able to cope completely alone on a multiplayer HOE game, it's probably overpowered. In this case, the sharpshooter can handle trash really well (any pistol) and then rape the **** out of the large zeds (xbow).

That's OP as all hell. That should not happen.

Pistols are a versatile weapon for all ranges (WTF), even more so in close range. That's more of a Commando thing anyway, no? I think pistols should have their range capabilities removed, and no longer be treated as sharpshooter weapons.

That way, sharpshooter actually becomes the sharpshooting sniper class. Not Commando 2.0.

I still think sharpie should get the benefit of reduced recoil from pistols. But not ultra discount/damage/reload speed. That's ridiculous. This is my idea:

- Sharpie gets recoil reduction
- Suppie gets a few spare magazines
- Demo gets a discount
- Commando has a reload speed buff
- Firebug has incendiary ammo
- Medic has extended magazines

Zerker doesn't get anything because lolmeleeclass. Though a discount isn't a bad idea.

I do agree with much of that. I just don't feel like we should have this as an official new perk. Just seems like they're trying to split a class out of desperation for a new perk. Regardless, I have life-type things to attend to. Thank you for all the informing opinions and details.
 
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- Sharpie gets recoil reduction
- Suppie gets a few spare magazines
- Demo gets a discount
- Commando has a reload speed buff
- Firebug has incendiary ammo
- Medic has extended magazines
I'd actually think it would make more sense, in meta, if the Sharp retained headshot bonus and lost everything else. When I think of recoil reduction, it makes me think of rapid fire. (My reason being if you control your recoil better, you can reacquire the sight picture more quickly for a follow up shot.) Going back to meta, the Sharpshooter takes his time to line up that perfect shot, then takes and makes said shot. Then it takes him a while again to line up another shot.

Commando could use the recoil reduction, since he's all about rapid fire. Plus he already has the universal weapon reload speed, anyway.

Medic could use the faster reload time. My reasoning is that he's a Medic and he patches up people. Sure, usually with a magic medicine injector, but he probably does (minor) surgery on the side. And, if you're doing surgery, you probably have dextrous hands. And dextrous hands would make it easier to reload a pistol. Sigh. Okay, it sounded less lame when I was thinking this out.

Demo could use extra magazines. He's not usually swimming in ammo at any given time (even if a good Demo with a good team around him shouldn't be running out of ammo, but whatever), so he could use a few extra bullets in his pistols when his launchers are empty.

Berserker could get discount, as that would fit in with him being a low-maintenance perk.

Like the idea for Support with more ammo. Ditto Firebug incendiary bullets.
 
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I'd actually think it would make more sense, in meta, if the Sharp retained headshot bonus and lost everything else. When I think of recoil reduction, it makes me think of rapid fire. (My reason being if you control your recoil better, you can reacquire the sight picture more quickly for a follow up shot.) Going back to meta, the Sharpshooter takes his time to line up that perfect shot, then takes and makes said shot. Then it takes him a while again to line up another shot.

Commando could use the recoil reduction, since he's all about rapid fire. Plus he already has the universal weapon reload speed, anyway.

Medic could use the faster reload time. My reasoning is that he's a Medic and he patches up people. Sure, usually with a magic medicine injector, but he probably does (minor) surgery on the side. And, if you're doing surgery, you probably have dextrous hands. And dextrous hands would make it easier to reload a pistol. Sigh. Okay, it sounded less lame when I was thinking this out.

Demo could use extra magazines. He's not usually swimming in ammo at any given time (even if a good Demo with a good team around him shouldn't be running out of ammo, but whatever), so he could use a few extra bullets in his pistols when his launchers are empty.

Berserker could get discount, as that would fit in with him being a low-maintenance perk.

Like the idea for Support with more ammo. Ditto Firebug incendiary bullets.

I thought that the damage would be taken away from sharpie to make them less like "sharpie weapons", if ya get me. Though I'd probably approve of it if it didn't match the boost that his rifles already have.

Mando already has the reload buff, yeah, but I think for pistols it's too small. Idk logically you'd think he'd be the expert at reloading pistols with extra speed. Sustained fire and all, as you said. I get what you're saying about the recoil though. o:

For demo I thought that he'd get the discount, mostly cos his perk guns are pretty much the most expensive thing to buy and maintain in-game anyway. Magazines aren't a bad idea, I actually think it'd be cool, but I wondered if it'd cause him to be discouraged from nade duty.

Can't disagree with the medic idea, but I put forward the mag capacity cos I thought it'd fit the current pattern. I'd like to try the reload speed tho.

I thought the same about zerk previously also, but I pulled the "lolmeleeonly" thing out of my arse instead. :p

All in all, I'm happy to see that other people do indeed like the idea of splitting the pistols among the perks. They're sidearms, I can't possibly look at them like they're sharpshooter mains. It just doesn't work that way. :c
 
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I thought that the damage would be taken away from sharpie to make them less like "sharpie weapons", if ya get me. Though I'd probably approve of it if it didn't match the boost that his rifles already have.
I see what you mean. Like how I said with the Commando getting recoil reduction since he has universal reload bonus already, the Sharp already has universal headshot bonus. I'm just thinking that a Sharp's niche is supposed to be very high damage to a single targets, with a moderate-to-slow rate of fire, and extra headshot damage would keep in line with that.

Hmm. Right now we have the pistol buffs as:
-Enhanced reload speed
-Enhanced headshot damage
-Recoil reduction
-Extra magazines
-Extended magazines
-Incendiary ammunition
-Discount

What if we put forward:
-Faster firing speed
-Dual wield damage bonus (like 10% increase at level 6 over non-buffed dual pistols. Or something)

So we could have
-Support has extra magazines, since it makes sense.
-Firebug has fire bullets, since again it makes sense.
-Medic has fast reload, because of his dexterity.
-Commando could have dual wield bonus (Because, in my opinion, going Commando could mean going without underwear or going badass, and dual wield spam just feels so badass.)
-Demo has discount ("Oh, you bought two thousand pounds worth of explosives. Here, have a free pistol since you're a good customer")
-Berserker could have faster firing speed (ZOMG CRAWLERCRAWLERCRAWLER BANGBANGBANGBANGBANGBANG)

As leftovers, we have recoil reduction, extended magazines, and enhanced headshots. Don't know what to slap onto Sharp.


And we could always try nonintuitive buff combinations, too. I could actually see extended magazines or dual wield bonus on Support. You know, when his shotguns are dry he could put down lolsuppressive fire. Or recoil reduction on a Zerk; he uses his mighty thews to bludgeon zombies to death for a living, so a pistol's recoild shouldn't bother him.

Or something. Help me out here.
 
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I found myself nodding in agreement all the way through actually

Though if sharpie gets a bonus to headshot damage, maybe mando could get a bonus to bodyshot damage to encourage the use of dualies? Maybe support could get extra penetration power?

Lawdie I dunno

There's all sorts of appropriate combinations for each perk, having multiple wouldn't be a bad idea either.
 
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Though if sharpie gets a bonus to headshot damage, maybe mando could get a bonus to bodyshot damage to encourage the use of dualies? Maybe support could get extra penetration power?
Can't agree with bodyshot damage. Headshots are a way of life in Killing Floor and discouraging that by giving a buff to bodyshots seems all bad.

Maybe Sharp could get a small straight pistol damage buff? Like, even if he's not making a headshot, we can assume his Sharpshooter-ness is making him aim at specimen hearts, or Horzine Supplemental Cardiac Pumps
 
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After playing with the Gunslinger perk today, I gotta admit this perk would seriously breathe life into KF as it is just boatloads of fun.

A compromise in terms of buffs could be something along these lines:

Base damage: +5%
lvl1 +10%
lvl2 +15%
lvl3 +20%
lvl4 +25%
lvl5 +30%
lvl6 +30%

Base Headshot damage +0%
lvl1 +5%
lvl2 +10%
lvl3 +10%
lvl4 +15%
lvl5 +15%
lvl6 +15%

By combining aspects of both the Commando and Sharp and re-tweaking it for balance, I think this could give a Gunzerk a truly unique role as Commando/Sharp-like hybrid. The pistols in KF differ from the assault rifles in that they deal greater base damage. However, pistols are also traditionally known as great killing tools in a Sharp's hand and practical for offperk use. The Gunslinger perk should have the advantages of both increased base damage and increased headshot damage as that is what defines pistols in KF. Playing with it today, I agreed with Amber that the Gunslinger perk in its current incarnation is just another commando since there are no headshot bonuses associated with the perk. That, I believe, should change.

Edit: I also would not mind seeing a single-wield, powerful pistol that would serve the role of a highDPH/lowDPS weapon. I think I saw someone mention it earlier, but a S&W 500 revolver would certainly fit the bill weighing in at 6lbs to make it balanced. (Can't carry a Xbow AND a S&W 500). I noticed that Gartley made a mutator for a Colt Python revolver, and that's exactly what I had in mind in terms of an immense recoil, slow-firing, slow-reloading (hand reload all 5 bullets, 1 at a time), but very-high damage per bullet weapon. Damage per shot would be somewhere between the LAR and the Xbow. Mag capacity is 5 shots per cylinder just like its real-world counterpart.
 
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After playing with the Gunslinger perk today, I gotta admit this perk would seriously breathe life into KF as it is just boatloads of fun.

A compromise in terms of buffs could be something along these lines:

Base damage: +5%
lvl1 +10%
lvl2 +15%
lvl3 +20%
lvl4 +25%
lvl5 +30%
lvl6 +30%

Base Headshot damage +0%
lvl1 +5%
lvl2 +10%
lvl3 +10%
lvl4 +15%
lvl5 +15%
lvl6 +15%

By combining aspects of both the Commando and Sharp and re-tweaking it for balance, I think this could give a Gunzerk a truly unique role as Commando/Sharp-like hybrid. The pistols in KF differ from the assault rifles in that they deal greater base damage. However, pistols are also traditionally known as great killing tools in a Sharp's hand and practical for offperk use. The Gunslinger perk should have the advantages of both increased base damage and increased headshot damage as that is what defines pistols in KF. Playing with it today, I agreed with Amber that the Gunslinger perk in its current incarnation is just another commando since there are no headshot bonuses associated with the perk. That, I believe, should change.

Edit: I also would not mind seeing a single-wield, powerful pistol that would serve the role of a highDPH/lowDPS weapon. I think I saw someone mention it earlier, but a S&W 500 revolver would certainly fit the bill weighing in at 6lbs to make it balanced. (Can't carry a Xbow AND a S&W 500). I noticed that Gartley made a mutator for a Colt Python revolver, and that's exactly what I had in mind in terms of an immense recoil, slow-firing, slow-reloading (hand reload all 5 bullets, 1 at a time), but very-high damage per bullet weapon. Damage per shot would be somewhere between the LAR and the Xbow. Mag capacity is 5 shots per cylinder just like its real-world counterpart.

Remember that the Pistols need some major tweaking seeing as if the Gunslinger is its very own unique perk (no one else can dual wield pistols, only him/her, or receive decent penalties if not the Gunslinger), such as Price tweaking (this is an instant yes), damage, and the rest of the stats. S&W 500 Revolver would be kind of balanced if the Gunslinger had 13 pound limit instead of 12 (able to dual wield it, but only it, gives a huge trade off in versatility and speed for raw power).
 
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Remember that the Pistols need some major tweaking seeing as if the Gunslinger is its very own unique perk (no one else can dual wield pistols, only him/her, or receive decent penalties if not the Gunslinger), such as Price tweaking (this is an instant yes), damage, and the rest of the stats. S&W 500 Revolver would be kind of balanced if the Gunslinger had 13 pound limit instead of 12 (able to dual wield it, but only it, gives a huge trade off in versatility and speed for raw power).

I'm not thinking about the gunslinger perk in its entirety and its place in its perks (weight, price, how it affects the Sharp perk), but just a rebalance of the damage progression. A gunslinger perk with just an increase in base damage is no more different than a Commando. With a combination of increases in body AND head damage, it would make the gunslinger perk a very unqiue and strong class to reckon with a best of both worlds (Commando & Sharp) sort of deal. And yea, the weights/carrycapacity of the gunzerk may need to be reconsidered. I'm all for a weapon that's high DPH, low ROF. Combined with some minor speed increases, it would totally make kiting fun!
 
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