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Fallback + Close Combat Training: Increase 9mm ammo instead of damage

flashn00b

Grizzled Veteran
  • Feb 1, 2011
    912
    104
    After extensive testing of the 9mm with Commando's fallback skill, it seems to me that the damage boost is more about compensating for terrible aim than it is about actually making the 9mm a viable sidearm a la the HMTECH-101 Medic Pistol, especially when the 9mm already deals similar damage to the Medic Pistol, albeit with much less ammo. Maybe this would be a better way to approach 9mm skills?

    Fallback: Increase 9mm ammo capacity by 140% and knife damage by 110%. Also increase weapon switching speed 50%
    Close Combat Training: Increase 9mm ammo capacity by 200% and knife damage 110%. Also begin the game with dual 9mm pistols

    The reason why SWAT gets a larger 9mm ammo increase than Commando is due to the SWAT having a much faster rate of fire with the dualies since well, he spawns with two 9mm pistols instead of one..

    TODO: Suggest a Bone Breaker rework. I consider this to be Gunslinger's 9mm skill since before the Summer 2018 update, Bone Breaker was required to allow a Gunslinger to decapitate clots with a 9mm.
     
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    These damage skills only "compensate for terrible aim" if you still relegate the 9mms to only the smallest zeds, as you might without these skills. But adjusting for the +85% damage, 9mms are more worthwhile for some medium zeds' weak points, so they fit with good aim just as well as anything else these perks have.
    1 shot a gorefast head instead of 2 shot, 3 shot gorefiend head instead of 6 shot, 3 shot bloat head instead of 5 shot, 2 shot a husk tank instead of 3 shot, 7 shot a rioter leg instead of 12 shot, etc.

    Anyways, on one hand, I agree a way to extend the usefulness of 9mms with more ammo would be good, but on the other hand, I'm happy with 9mm and medpistol not being too samey with each other. When I want the shooting performance the medpistol has, I can usually buy a medpistol for that, and be happy to also be shooting meddarts with it.
    Speaking of samey, Commando and SWAT having such similar skills while being such similar perks is a little boring, so if big changes came to just one of these skill's mechanics instead of both, that could help a little in differentiating the perks.
    Weapons' ammo reserve might get affected by future iterations of the weapon upgrade system, so maybe that will sort the 9mm shortage concerns.
     
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    s5yn3t;n2332831 said:
    "Compensate for the terrible aim"
    Do you honestly think that giving larger ammo pool and taking away the damage boost somehow makes that statement different?
    More ammo to spare = better compensation for the terrible aim.
    And taking away the dmg boost would make 9mm less reliable on dispatching zeds that are too close to you while your main rifles are out of juice.
    Ok now you have more ammo to spare, but you also now have to shoot more round to dispatch a zed before reloading it, and in those cases the speed is more viable than just having more ammo in your pool.



    They are not quite same tho.
    Sure description says one thing but in practice there's is something that makes this skill different in those perk.
    Mainly that with the current half buffed backup damage, the Commando can kill a rioter with 1 heavy swing to the head while its wearing its helmet.... something that is not possible with swat even when it had the old over 100% dmg increase.
    And ofc that mando skill also offers increased switch speed while swat's only extra dosh after 1st wave before switching to its more useful counterpart lol.

    From my extensive testing, I have been trying to use the 9mm against mediums and all those times would often end with me dying. Increasing the 9mm's ammo pool would give the 9mm an effectiveness against clots similar to the Medic Pistol, because the damage bonuses for the 9mm honestly seems redundant because damage bonuses below 110% don't really mean much for the 9mm. (Yes, i know that 110% was the damage levels was what enabled the 9mm to kill The Patriarch)
     
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