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Enough with the nerfing.

Euclix

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 15, 2010
96
42
0
While I like to debate topics on forums, even if they've been discussed 300 times before, I'll simply say this.

You guys on the forums that all participated in the beta did a good job at making the game pretty balanced. I think it's more than we could ever expect from any other game. Good job forums people and good job TWI. Maybe it's time to enjoy your hard work.
 

RainbowCakez

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 21, 2011
199
99
0
People are never happy with what they have. People're always gonna complain something is more OP than the others... Or weapon...
If not they turn to something else...
 

noupperlobeman

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 21, 2010
318
173
0
34
Corning, New York
I disagree.

Whether the complaints are valid or not, I think it keeps the company and player base on its toes. It keeps us all re-evaluating a game we love.

And most people are never going to resign to an "Eh, its good enough attitude". If someone likes something enough, they are going to want changes made to it so they can like it more. Its called progression: things change, and possibly get better, with time. (The Times They Are-a Changing). You bet your sweet butt I quoted Bob Dylan!

Should we close the suggestions page too?
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
Personally I love talking about balance in Kiling Floor, since its probably the only game I know where a voice can be heard and something may actually be done about it.

TF2 has some real balance issues but its hard to have your voice heard amoungst the never ending waves of troll posts.

Far as I see it theres nothing wrong with discussing and refining the game. KF 2 might never happen remember, and if balance isn't kept in check the game becomes stagnant with the same perks over and over... as we saw with the Sharpshooter.

We may have many updates to come, we may only get one to patch the glitches in the game since ROHoS is coming closer and closer, so there may not be much time left to get everything nailed down and turn KF into the classic it deserves to be :)
 
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the 1st wasted

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 17, 2010
272
312
0
Europe
All good points.

I just see the game getting killed off because of too much change. As I have said before, as soon as one class gets nerfed someone will start in on one of the other classes. i have seen alot of people complaining about one class or another, then after looking at thier older posts I see that they have always disliked to class, and it seems that they are upset because thier kill count is lower than the player that is using the class the do not like.


TWI put alot of time and effort into the last patch. How many of you out there have thanked them, either directly, ot indirectly?
 

Nanostrike

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 19, 2009
2,027
250
0
It's not "nerfing." It's "re-balancing." :]

At least Tripwire listens to their players, unlike a few companies people could mention.
Take a look at the (Very legitimate, actually!) balance complaints on the Left 4 Dead 2 Forums...and the fact that the game hasn't changed in nearly a year...
 

noupperlobeman

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 21, 2010
318
173
0
34
Corning, New York
All good points.

I just see the game getting killed off because of too much change. As I have said before, as soon as one class gets nerfed someone will start in on one of the other classes. i have seen alot of people complaining about one class or another, then after looking at thier older posts I see that they have always disliked to class, and it seems that they are upset because thier kill count is lower than the player that is using the class the do not in like.
Which kinda sucks because those are the people we don't want playing killing floor. The loudest voices are the ones that think in killing floor killz = skillz. This being a co-op game I really don't care if something is a little op, and all I care about is that all perks are team oriented.

The only nerf I've ever cried hard and long for was back in the wee days of Modern Warfare 2 when the model 1887 shotguns were raping face. I will vouch for this though: the slippery slope happens often enough in games (even though I don't like to admit it). Once those guns were nerfed the crybaby fan base moved on to the next "nerf this" of the month.

I say take care of the things that are obviously overpowered/bugged and leave the rest alone, despite what the fanbase deems as "OP". Because most of the time the fan base is an unreliable source of information.


TWI put alot of time and effort into the last patch. How many of you out there have thanked them, either directly, ot indirectly?
This may be kind of ridiculous to say, but how many times has TWI directly or indirectly thanked the player base for supporting their effort by buying their products? I'd say the two sides are equal.
 

the 1st wasted

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 17, 2010
272
312
0
Europe
Which kinda sucks because those are the people we don't want playing killing floor. The loudest voices are the ones that think in killing floor killz = skillz. This being a co-op game I really don't care if something is a little op, and all I care about is that all perks are team oriented.

The only nerf I've ever cried hard and long for was back in the wee days of Modern Warfare 2 when the model 1887 shotguns were raping face. I will vouch for this though: the slippery slope happens often enough in games (even though I don't like to admit it). Once those guns were nerfed the crybaby fan base moved on to the next "nerf this" of the month.

I say take care of the things that are obviously overpowered/bugged and leave the rest alone, despite what the fanbase deems as "OP". Because most of the time the fan base is an unreliable source of information.




This may be kind of ridiculous to say, but how many times has TWI directly or indirectly thanked the player base for supporting their effort by buying their products? I'd say the two sides are equal.
Ervery time the send out an update, quick fix, and DLC.;)
 

Salad Snake

FNG / Fresh Meat
Aug 2, 2010
875
148
0
31
Honolulu, Hawaii
All good points.

I just see the game getting killed off because of too much change. As I have said before, as soon as one class gets nerfed someone will start in on one of the other classes. i have seen alot of people complaining about one class or another, then after looking at thier older posts I see that they have always disliked to class, and it seems that they are upset because thier kill count is lower than the player that is using the class the do not like.
The thing about balance is that it keeps the game fresh. It changes up the rules a tad, and that keeps the game from becoming a static entity. Nobody wants to log in and have the exact same experience for years on end (excluding CS players, who I've always thought have mental problems anyway :rolleyes:).

This being a co-op game I really don't care if something is a little op, and all I care about is that all perks are team oriented.
If you think about it, any perk being more overpowered then the other detracts from teamwork, so if you really want the game to be as team-oriented as possible, then you want rebalancing.





The game is VERY VERY close to balance, only a few small details need to be worked out. Pipes, the M14, Firebug (maybe), and Zerker are all UP or OP to some extent. However, Zerker doesn't really matter so much since only the top 5% of players can take advantage of the overpowered tactics, and Firebug simply needs a small fix to make burn effect more useful for the team. For that matter, Pipes can be fixed quite easily through making them less destructible, or cheaper. The M14 might be fixed by simply centering the ironsight, which is off-center at the moment.


After that, it's simply a matter of making sure balance stays intact if new content (like a new zed or Medic gun) is introduced. The only real balance conundrum is dualies, since anything that would balance them is unrealistic, and anything that we can realistically change doesn't solve the problem.
 

sverek

Active member
May 20, 2009
435
234
43
Last patch was very successful to bring life into KF. It's much more interesting right now, more intense and more fun and more teamwork required.

I don't know if TWI gonna spend more time on KF, but I really enjoy current version. There some room for improvement, but game can't be perfect.

I love Game how it is now, and I only would love to add more friendly 3rd party UI into game. So player can browse and even download mutators directly to game from menu and bigger stats allowance for it.
In other words, all whitelist/greylist files are downloadable via menu, so it would encourage more people to play with 3rd party maps/weapons/zeds etc...
 

timur

FNG / Fresh Meat
I love Game how it is now, and I only would love to add more friendly 3rd party UI into game. So player can browse and even download mutators directly to game from menu and bigger stats allowance for it.
In other words, all whitelist/greylist files are downloadable via menu, so it would encourage more people to play with 3rd party maps/weapons/zeds etc...
That (though probably difficult to pull off) would be truly amazing. We have a great set of maps and muts thanks to the community, which should be enjoyed by more people. On the flipside, there is still a ton of non white/grey listed material that is equally awesome, but you can't have everything, and all that would still be accessible the old ways:p
 

rckrdude

FNG / Fresh Meat
Sep 16, 2009
314
86
0
McAllen, TX
As much fun as it is to play Zerker, I agree that it is a little OP on most maps. Bedlam, offices and icebreaker would probably be the exceptions. Like others have said though, one perk will always have an edge over the others and be deemed OP. If berzerker is nerfed too much, every single HOE team past wave six will be 3/4 supports + 1 Medic + 1/2 Sharp/Demo. As of now, zerker is fun and relatively easy to rambo with on any difficulty. Once you get the 32 specimens behind you, you will be ok if you keep the mistakes to a minimum. This actually becomes easier if the rest of the team wipes since you don't have to worry about random zeds following your teammates to turn on you as you pass them by. Currently, it is the penultimate rambo class but even with a speed/damage resistance reduction, it still will be, just like it was before the update. The buffs just made it more fun and noob friendly. If stopping rambos is the goal, anything short of a completely crippling nerf to zerkers like will not work, so that is out of the question. But, a slight speed and/or resistance reduction would make the class require more skill again.
 
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RainbowCakez

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 21, 2011
199
99
0
The game is VERY VERY close to balance, only a few small details need to be worked out. Pipes, the M14, Firebug (maybe), and Zerker are all UP or OP to some extent. However, Zerker doesn't really matter so much since only the top 5% of players can take advantage of the overpowered tactics, and Firebug simply needs a small fix to make burn effect more useful for the team. For that matter, Pipes can be fixed quite easily through making them less destructible, or cheaper. The M14 might be fixed by simply centering the ironsight, which is off-center at the moment.
I don't think I'd ever want anything more than this. Except maybe the Pipebombs to be left...
After this stuff has been changed, I wouldn't look to say - The Machete and go "Omg, so UP change it to have 250 damage etc.", since there's gotta be a time you can say "Alrighty well, the game has a bit of imbalance here and there; But the game is alright with these :)" - Just, at the moment you can't do that since some things are quite noticeabley stronger.

There'll never be a day where everything is balanced, but at least there'll be a day when it's decent enough to live with.
 

Rainydaykid

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 25, 2010
1,010
203
0
TN
The only nerf I've ever cried hard and long for was back in the wee days of Modern Warfare 2 when the model 1887 shotguns were raping face. I will vouch for this though: the slippery slope happens often enough in games (even though I don't like to admit it). Once those guns were nerfed the crybaby fan base moved on to the next "nerf this" of the month.

MW2 was really close to being a great game. The "fake lag" was an issue, I would put a burst in someone's head, but their killcam didn't show it, again and again, but the game didn't seem laggy. The lack of being able to pick a server, and the skilless weapons, dual glocks, p90's, ect that just required holding down both buttons in the other player's general direction.

None of that would have mattered to me if it wasn't for the lag. 90% of the servers I joined were laggy like that, so I just stopped playing.
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,071
881
0
Sheffield, England
None of that would have mattered to me if it wasn't for the lag. 90% of the servers I joined were laggy like that, so I just stopped playing.
Weren't really servers, they were run off a hosts home internet conenction, same as Xbox Live and PSN. Thats right folks they didn't even bother to make a PC version, they just ported MW2 from the console.
 

ph30nix

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 29, 2010
146
38
0
i dont think they need to worry about making maps realy, Community does a good enough job of that my 2 cents on what they should work on

1. fix glitches/bugs
2. improve mob pathing (for an example do ice breaker get to top of ship by 2 stairwells and stand on edge of stairwell closest to look out, 7 out of 10 mobs will just run up and then jump off the far stairwell and never get to you not going to be anymore specific on location just incase its seen as posting a glitch)
3. New Specimen models, how clean the Christmas ones looked vs normal ones is a huge differnce.
4. few minor changes to server list (show current wave of server for one)
5. better leveling system (im not throwing any specific oh its broken comment about it but something about it just seems like it could be done better ya know? only one i will say is annoying is commando requiring a specific type of mob to be killed is just aggrivating encourages cheating the system in some way to get around it. my thinking would be that if you chose a perk, then play thru every i guess default map on begineer then normal that perk would be leveled enough for hard, play thru them all on hard you would be ready for suicidal etc etc.)
 
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