This is something that needs to be in the game. It should have been in KF1. I mean, why wouldn't there be a survival/endless mode in a wave based game?
Endless wave mode
- Thread starter Munk
- Start date
Am i too oldschool if i think game should have win condition and losing condition?
Endless mode has no win condition, eventually you are going to lose, which means it becomes competion of who loses LESS?
In other words, everyone playing endless games are losers by definition.
(Taking me seriously on this note might indicate severe brain misfunctions.)
More content?
Yes.
Forced content?
Get outta here.
Endless mode has no win condition, eventually you are going to lose, which means it becomes competion of who loses LESS?
In other words, everyone playing endless games are losers by definition.
(Taking me seriously on this note might indicate severe brain misfunctions.)
More content?
Yes.
Forced content?
Get outta here.
I really don't see the point in endless horde modes! You can never win, what's the point?
The more modes the merrier. I think it's a great idea and maybe it will reshape the horde mode gameplay as we know it.
It's essentially a challenge mode and I think it's the perfect thing to mix gameplay up. Generally if you last longer it means you're more skilled (or maybe the game needs some balancing) so it would be a great way to train. Also keep in mind that this thread was started 7 months ago. Whether or not you like the idea, the time to implement something like it has already been put in. Tweaks to it should be suggested once we know what we're getting, but otherwise you're essentially arguing for the outright removal of a gamemode from KF2.
Forced content is kind of a silly term too, but hey, maybe we should be concerned about Killing Floor 2 having artificial difficulty.
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I was thinking the same thing. Endless gameplay, playing for the high scores, etc are all hallmarks of old school gaming.
With that said, I actually voted against (course, at this point, they've most likely began developing it, or not).
I've played my share of nazi zombies (and that survival mode in MW3), and I had a blast with my friends trying to beat our best scores. I remember with the zombies one though in particularly, it was became frustrating when you got past wave 40 or so, zombies just became bullet sponges. It just became less fun, to me.
In KF2, the devs were looking to diversify the gameplay between different difficulty settings so that the zeds wouldn't simply become bullet sponges ultimately in higher difficulty.
But for an endless mode, wouldn't that ultimately be what happens? Also, one of the challenges for the zombies mode was the fact that you had to keep getting more ammo. That doesn't seem possible here unless we have way to speed up the process of obtaining ammo, or excluding the zerker class.
I suppose a lot of my concerns come from an entirely different zombie game, and it's possible that the way it's designed here will negate these issues. But that's all I have to work with at the moment.
I'd be interested in how they prevent bullet-sponge enemies too. As for ammo, just spawn more ammo boxes or balance it around the idea of conserving ammo.
But yeah, Munk was the one that brought the idea up so presumably he already had some solutions in mind.
But yeah, Munk was the one that brought the idea up so presumably he already had some solutions in mind.
Except, again, this thread was started by Munk, and it was started a whole seven months ago.
Some people indeed.
If we really want to be 3edgy5u then I guess we'd need some mentally handi-capped, racist, paraplegic zombies from Indochina. Now THERE'S a horde mode!
It's tons of fun! Warframe (3rd person FPS) got it for instance, where you can play Defense or Survival (oxygen runs out and pickups needed) missions for as long as you can, and get out with farm rewards every 5 waves.
Korean team I think (forgot, correct me if any warframe players), did 3+ hours long, 87 waves tough game. And enemies scale by wave, so they were 860 lvl.
Player's are capped on lvl 30...so I can only imagine how epically good they were doing it, coordinating play, builds, everything maxed.
Kills got over 2000 quickly there, for 4 player team.
Me and friend got to 40'th waves...sometime 45, that's like hour+ of play.
PS. some Turkish clan got to wave 116. oh my lord :IS2:
So yeh, its fun with friends/players ! It gets to a point, sooner or later, where you are outclased and outnumbered, you can feel the adrenaline rush.
It would be interesting to see in Killing Floor, good thing there is no rpg like Level's, so the difficulty would be scaled just by sheer numbers of enemies probably. which I realy love. (Firebugs/Demo's will be happy haha)
warframe is an unbalanced mess that started down a decent path then swerved straight into pandering to the nuke crowd.
all you need is vauban, nova nyx and trinity and the team is pretty much entirely untouchable. if this team you mentioned had a zephyr, valkyre, ash and excalibro then i'd be impressed because they had to actually use skills and fight the enemy instead of nuking a bunch of confused thralls while hiding behind invincibility and an impenetrable wall.
if endless mode in kf2 used the "difficulty" scaling of warframe it would be an abomination.
if digital extremes removes some of the grind and replaces it with some gameplay, warframe could become good again.
all you need is vauban, nova nyx and trinity and the team is pretty much entirely untouchable. if this team you mentioned had a zephyr, valkyre, ash and excalibro then i'd be impressed because they had to actually use skills and fight the enemy instead of nuking a bunch of confused thralls while hiding behind invincibility and an impenetrable wall.
if endless mode in kf2 used the "difficulty" scaling of warframe it would be an abomination.
if digital extremes removes some of the grind and replaces it with some gameplay, warframe could become good again.
yeah sorry i don't mean to bash. i just mean that personally i never found 'fun' and 'warframe' to exactly go together at its best.
It is a really cool game in some way and some nice art.
it's a good game to mention as personally i hope that is what killing floor endless waves mode will not be like; just relying on sponge enemies.
I guess the main 3 factors to play with as waves advance is:
1. Specimen spawn speed. (Amount of Specimens attacking at once)
2. Number of Specimens in a wave.
3. Number of types of Specimens in a wave and their spawn density.
Then if somehow that isn't cutting it enough for later waves there is the other 2 factors:
4. Specimen damage.
5. Specimen hitpoints.
Ideally endless wave mode would be seperated by the different difficulties and specimen's hitpoints and damage would never change or if those did change then it would be very small increases later on.
The problem with 1. is game performance and how many Specimens the game can handle on a map at once.
Advantage of total 1. is that it mostly just being that would be awesome.
The problem with 2. is that too much of it will make it tedious ammo management.
Advantage of a good balance of gradually adding to 2. is that it will force players to move around the map to collect ammo.
The problem with 3. is that it is going in the direction of 4. and 5.
but again ofc seeing more and larger teams of Fleshpounds and multiple Patriarchs at a rate increasing in good balance with other factors is important.
4 and 5 are just a cheap resort that should be kept to a minimum.
thinking about it i realise how difficult it is to balance these things to give the best endless waves mode possible to keep a balanced challenge where you always have opportunities to use skill and tactics and strategy to go further rather than just one aspect of the challenge becoming too difficult compared to the aspects.
in warframe it would be very hard to make the gameplay of endless waves exciting and intense as warframe can only resort to sponging enemies and boositng their damage due to the player gameplay they have chosen - large area of effect abilites that can be spammed and and not relying on ammo - the density of enemies, compostion of hordes of enemies and length of waves all become somewhat irrelevant.
but kf2 does not have those flaws with gameplay and could pull off a endless waves mode far more successfully with it being fun.
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