Dual Wielder

[halbridious]

Cool beans Just checking. a cool feature for this perk would be zed time extensions like commando and zerker, and you could even do a small amount of crawler kills, but make them have to be in zed time so lvl 1 is "kill 15 crawlers (with dualies) in zed time" and level 6 is say "kill 1000 crawlers with dual handguns in zed time". that'd be new, but given the sheer amount of crawlers and zed time, not be that bad

EDIT: As for the icon - looks good. IDK what size you're making it, but teh crisper you can get it looking the better I like your design however. make a gold one next and see how that comes out

 

[RuneHarle]

Cool beans Just checking. a cool feature for this perk would be zed time extensions like commando and zerker, and you could even do a small amount of crawler kills, but make them have to be in zed time so lvl 1 is "kill 15 crawlers (with dualies) in zed time" and level 6 is say "kill 1000 crawlers with dual handguns in zed time". that'd be new, but given the sheer amount of crawlers and zed time, not be that bad

EDIT: As for the icon - looks good. IDK what size you're making it, but teh crisper you can get it looking the better I like your design however. make a gold one next and see how that comes out

I don't want to require zed time as it is somewhat of a random event and it does get zed time extension, they are listed in the description.

The image is the same size in game as the other ones, it looks fine to be but I am also colourblind >.<.

 

[halbridious]

Lol - i was just thinking that the finer you get it when its big the better details transfer when its small. And i just mentioned gold because seeing it in gold is always fun.

as for the zed time, Its cool that it gets extentions, but as to the "randomness" aspect - i understand why you wouldn't want to do it, but it happens all the time, and once they got to lvl 3 or so they'd be able to get 3 or 4 kills per zed time. Very easy to get 1000 crawler kills that way I support your decision - just thought it could be fun to have a requirement that was a bit out of the ordinary. Alot of the times perks feel like "grinding" to get the last few things, I've been trying to think of ways to make it feel less... tedious. I feel like the randomness of zed time could help. It could of course, hinder the case if your terribly unlucky lol.

 

[RuneHarle]

as for the zed time, Its cool that it gets extentions, but as to the "randomness" aspect - i understand why you wouldn't want to do it, but it happens all the time, and once they got to lvl 3 or so they'd be able to get 3 or 4 kills per zed time. Very easy to get 1000 crawler kills that way I support your decision - just thought it could be fun to have a requirement that was a bit out of the ordinary. Alot of the times perks feel like "grinding" to get the last few things, I've been trying to think of ways to make it feel less... tedious. I feel like the randomness of zed time could help. It could of course, hinder the case if your terribly unlucky lol.

It would take a random amount(zed time activation) x commandos leveling time as I am using the commando numebrs to make it fair.

And on that note

GoldIcon made since it was requested

Spoiler!

 

[halbridious]

I understand why u feel the way u do

As for the logo - looks good, but the highlights of teh gun details could be black instead of red, might look better.

 

[RuneHarle]

I understand why u feel the way u do

As for the logo - looks good, but the highlights of teh gun details could be black instead of red, might look better.

Yea again colourblind, My wife helped me fix the colour but I'm not sure if it is the right image cause i can't see a differance in the too ^.^;

Well anyway this is the hope date, just hope I put the right file

Spoiler!

also updated in OP

 

[halbridious]

Ah right - didn't realize that red-black was one of the relations affected sorry
Looks good now

 

[sheaownsaford]

The design of the icon is great!

I literally just had this idea as I'm responding right now -- what if as a class effect, the gunslinger had increasing bullet penetration as it levels up? I'm thinking this because not a single handgun (stock handguns) has the ability to shoot repeatedly by just holding down the fire button, and thus requires spam clicking. In my eyes it would be an effective counterbalance to the limited clip size of handguns as well as reducing some the spam clicking needed to level up.

I don't know how the mechanics of bullet penetration work, but it seems like an appropriate approach would have it be based on the amount of exceeded damage still left after the target is killed and have the leftover damage carry through as penetration into the next target. Like if there's two crawlers lined up and the first has 150hp and the bullet deals 200 damage, have the 50 damage still left hit the second crawler in line..?

Just a few thoughts.

 

[FluX]

The design of the icon is great!

I literally just had this idea as I'm responding right now -- what if as a class effect, the gunslinger had increasing bullet penetration as it levels up? I'm thinking this because not a single handgun (stock handguns) has the ability to shoot repeatedly by just holding down the fire button, and thus requires spam clicking. In my eyes it would be an effective counterbalance to the limited clip size of handguns as well as reducing some the spam clicking needed to level up.

I don't know how the mechanics of bullet penetration work, but it seems like an appropriate approach would have it be based on the amount of exceeded damage still left after the target is killed and have the leftover damage carry through as penetration into the next target. Like if there's two crawlers lined up and the first has 150hp and the bullet deals 200 damage, have the 50 damage still left hit the second crawler in line..?

Just a few thoughts.

I don't like the idea of bullet penetration BUT having extra magazine/ammo is something I would look into.

 

[RuneHarle]

what if as a class effect, the gunslinger had increasing bullet penetration as it levels up? I'm thinking this because not a single handgun (stock handguns) has the ability to shoot repeatedly by just holding down the fire button]

The 44 and handcannon already penetrate , I think it's up to 3 zeds by default and I see no reason to increase that.

OP Edit changed some values to the description of the class, increased some things

 

[RuneHarle]

working out bugs ^.^

 

[halbridious]

HAPPY FACES. beta testers waiting in the wings

 

[RuneHarle]

Expanded discount to all pistols to even out the prices, kinda pointless to buy a handcannon when you can buy 2 for the same price. Planning to remove the fire speed modifier as it really doesn't do anything on a click as fast as you can weapon. Currently hoping to stumble across some draw speed code to give a general weapon swap bonus.

OP Edited to include new discount

 

[RuneHarle]

Releasing alpha soon for testing

OP edited to include new bonuses and remove changed ones

 

[FluX]

Someone has got themself some fans
Here if you need me again mate.

 

[RuneHarle]

I will use the testing to decide if it needs more ammo, BUT I will not be increasing clip size. 8 rounds in a 6 round magnum makes no since to me.

As it stands I have no issues with ammo amounts on normal difficulty because I use the 9mms for everything siren and below, Magnum for crowds because of penetration, HC for anything bigger and if its not dead quick swap to Magnum.

 

[Aze]

Lovely initiative!

Just a question/issue: Why not benefit on everything with both single and dual pistols? If you don't benefit on at least the discount for both single and dual, things are gonna be messed up. A simple example:

1) Buy Dual Handcannons for 300.
2) Sell one for 112
3) Sell the 2nd one for 375 (since you have no discount for the single one)
4) Repeat from step 1

What does that give you? Unlimited money. So, on AT LEAST the discount, benefit for both singles and duals. After all, if this perk gets added oficially one day, i see no reason why not to move over the pistols to this perk completely, thus, benefitting on all bonuses with both single and dual pistols would make the most sense. Then to promote duals, gives further bonuses like:

* A bit more recoil reduction with duals than for singles
* A bit more reload bonus with duals than for singles
* When dualwielding, you get a lasersight on the offhand pistol (Could be a Dual Wielder / Gunslinger bonus that granted at level 3?)

Also some suggestions for further perk bonuses:
* A "run & gun" bonus, which reduces the weaponsway from left to right when you move around. Could also be a bonus that reduces the movementspeed penalty when ironsighting.
* ZED time reflexes, meaning, when ZED time kicks in you get even more bonus to reloading, recoil and weapon swapping. But not damage. Something that also could be nice as a ZED time bonus is that when it activates, you no longer need to spam M1 to shoot, you can just hold in the button and the character will shoot the pistols at max speed

I'd also suggest to increase the damage bonus a tad, to like 50% at level 6. 28% is not that high of a bonus ya know.

 

[RuneHarle]

Just a question/issue: Why not benefit on everything with both single and dual pistols? If you don't benefit on at least the discount for both single and dual, things are gonna be messed up. A simple example:

1) Buy Dual Handcannons for 300.
2) Sell one for 112
3) Sell the 2nd one for 375 (since you have no discount for the single one)
4) Repeat from step 1

I extended discount in a previous post for that very reason. Also I am trying to not alter the sharpshooter perk at all, and by giving bonuses to all pistols on all factors, it would be like I'm completely stealing the pistols. I don't want that to ever be the issue.

I'd also suggest to increase the damage bonus a tad, to like 50% at level 6. 28% is not that high of a bonus ya know.

Until further testing I'm leaving it, but I am not against adjustments, however a 50% increase on handcannon damage seems OP to me, but it IS you power weapon so I will leave it to the testing.

After all, if this perk gets added oficially one day, i see no reason why not to move over the pistols to this perk completely, thus, benefitting on all bonuses with both single and dual pistols would make the most sense. Then to promote duals, gives further bonuses like

Even if they added it, and don't get me wrong, it's a hope but not a need, it is extremely unlikely that they would remove singular pistols from the sharpshooter and that I would completely agree with as those can be precision instruments, however when dual wielding it is no longer about precision and more about dps. That is where this class comes in.


As for the other suggestion, I have read your previous gunslinger posts and have already weighed and considered those and found them to either be unneeded or just for show.

I am currently performing solo testing before a release.

 

[RuneHarle]

Alpha ready, just gotta find someway to host a server because all I have is my laptop.

 

[halbridious]

I'd offer to run one, but recently my net has been dropping my dedi often. BTW, about the damage increase - currently, apart from medic, no perk @ lvl 6 has less than 50% damage increase. So it might be best to kick the overall up to 50%. Some perks even have 60%.