Drop weapon only for self option

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nutterbutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 8, 2010
2,010
1,281
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It's a bad sign if they have to take the front lines, because there is no time for specimens to burn, as your teammates are also shooting them.

I agree 100%. What happens is that the SS, support, commandos and such, for some unknown reason, like to fight WAY out in front of a spawn point or a convergence of points (as if there are more mobs out there than in a covered position) and piss through their armor in the first 60 seconds. The medic and I am the only one left with armor. Yeah, I got killed a couple times by scrakes, but as you know, firebug spawns with armor and flame thrower so it isn't that bad dying.

Other than those specimens, what else is there? Hmm, the clots, crawlers, gorefasts, stalkers and sirens. If I recall, Commando's are excellent at taking those down.

That's how I see the Firebug; killing the small stuff and reducing HP. I avoid tapping the FP and scrake so they don't rampage and flaming the husk is a complete waste of fuel. I switch to cannons for the husk. Now if a scrake or FP is RIGHT HERE and wailing on someone then I don't wait for the xbow and it is "flame on" :)

But yes, each players responsibility should overlap somewhat. Plus the flamer can shoot through other players and mobs to reach mobs in the rear as well.

I agree with the fact that flamers don't need more ammo. Yet it would be nice if the flamethrower weighed less blocks.

I agree with that 100% as well.

Lastly, I find your claim that "Firebugs can outdamage every other perk" to be a tad ridiculous. You're telling me that a Lv6. Flamebug (with flamer and deagles for example) can do more damage than a SS with an m14?

Well, yes. Can a flamer kill more? Nope. But an experienced flamer can have mobs burning all over the place and if not kill the mobs can reduce the HP of each of them down to where each die with a single shot from other players.

Say you and I are playing and a group of crawlers spawn. If I flame them and drop each of their hit points to 10 and then you kill them, who did the most damage? I did, but you killed them. The flamer is never going to lead the team in kills (unless it is a really really bad team) but I think an experienced flamer can make the game really easy for everyone else.
 

YFGHNG

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 30, 2010
549
4
0
OCD
The flamer is never going to lead the team in kills (unless it is a really really bad team) but I think an experienced flamer can make the game really easy for everyone else.

Agreed. I notice this best in choke-point maps like KF-doom on pound. When I play zerker, it takes me some 4+ alt fires to kill an fp, assuming I wasn't directly aiming for the head (which is kinda hard for me to do anyways). But after a firebug has burned through a whole mob of them, I can kill each of them easily in 2 strokes.
 

[UIT] Akame

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 5, 2009
1,280
129
0
My own personal hell
@nutterbutter

As for your comments regarding the firebug on harder difficulties, I would have to agree with HaTeMe. Unless you are using a weapon like the HS or Xbow, shooting every mob that shows up still isn't going to run through your entire ammo even if you are killing way more than your share of specs while FB will run through most if not all and kill very few.

As you get to higher difficulties, the necessity of killing a spec before it damages you goes way up. As such, maximizing burn damage becomes difficult and FB rarely kills a spec. Therefore FB mostly get relegated to the task of softening targets before they reach the team. Using FB in this way, all of the other classes do what the firebug does better, quicker, without running through as much ammo.

Certainly there are certain situation where FB might be particularly useful, even in suicidal, but most of the time it is way better to be another class. I've had the most kills as FB (as lv6) in hard before but in suicidal playing FB really just makes you a hindrance.
 

nutterbutter

FNG / Fresh Meat
Feb 8, 2010
2,010
1,281
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@nutterbutter

As you get to higher difficulties, the necessity of killing a spec before it damages you goes way up. As such, maximizing burn damage becomes difficult and FB rarely kills a spec. Therefore FB mostly get relegated to the task of softening targets before they reach the team. Using FB in this way, all of the other classes do what the firebug does better, quicker, without running through as much ammo.

Certainly there are certain situation where FB might be particularly useful, even in suicidal, but most of the time it is way better to be another class. I've had the most kills as FB (as lv6) in hard before but in suicidal playing FB really just makes you a hindrance.

Well, I disagree with you about the ammo. Out of the entire week that I played firebug, I only ran out of ammo a few time, but in only two games. The firebug shouldn't shoot at every mob. Close mobs and single mobs should be ignored.

I really can't argue that a flamer isn't the best choice in a suicidal game. I kinda view the flamer as a "damage multiplier" for the entire team. As long as a flamer is willing to have low kills counts, he can make every weapon on the team more powerful. But the flamer has to be willing to take himself out of a primary role and accept that he is going to have few kills.

I appreciate all of the discussion so far.
 

Undedd Jester

FNG / Fresh Meat
Oct 31, 2009
3,059
881
0
Sheffield, England
I would just like to point out as a seasoned Firebug myself that there is some truth to what nutterbutter is saying. The only thing I do differently is I personally don't hesistate or regret having to hose down a target if need be.

I don't know if its my play style or whatever, but I find I can quite easily sustain my ammo trhough the round, and still walk away with plenty of kills. Perhaps since I've played Firebug so much, I have subconciously noted when to fire, and when not to fire.

The firebug excels at mass ignitions, and this allows him to reign a group under control very quickly. The specimens the Firebug is good against are as follows: -
- Clots: Aint we all? Seriously though, the firebug, even on suicidal can cut his way through a group of clots faster than any other class in the game. This is simply because he doesn't need to reload, he can penetrate easily through a full mob, and he deals solid consistant damage.
- Crawlers: Unlike other classes a firebug can still wound and burn specimens just as effectively by shooting their lower bodies instead of their heads. This allows him to crouch and aim low to catch crawlers, without hindering his ability to kill other specimens at the same time
- Gorefasts: ALthough the gorefast can cause issue on an unprepared firebug due to their relatively large health, at long range the gorefast will crisp up long before it reaches the player or his team. This means that even if the gorefsat doesn't burn out, he will take much longer to mount an attack on the team, and will be on extremely low health.
- Sirens: The firebugs DoT means he can quit happily ignite a Siren and retreat leaving her to slowly burn out with little fear of taking damage.
- Husks: As an individual firebugs find issue with the Husk because they are awkward to kill, but a husk does zero damage to the firebug. This means uninterupted a firebug can easily knife the husk to death, or merely distract it while his teammates dispose of it safely.
- Stalkers: Easy to avoid, and usually are caught in the crossfire with other specimens. They ave a tendency to run at the player when ignited, making it hard to see other threats, but generally they cause little issue.
- Bloats: They are slow and have high health. Although the firebug might not be the best perk to kill the bloat (although I personally love watching them pop under the flames), he can certainly ignite him and really soften him up for other classes.
- Scrake: Contrary to popular opinion, the firebug does have a useful role against the Scrake. Like the gorefast, the scrake is very succeptable to the crisp up effect, and his charge will more often than not be interupted by this effect. This again as well as softening up the target for an easier kill, gives his team alot more time to dispose of the sScrake before it will attack. Its important to note with this tactic, the Scrake charges when it is at half health, so sustained fire is useless until it charges. Ignite and slow down are the Firebugs best weapons against it.

The only class the firebug is a real hinderance against is the Fleshpound., and accidently igniting one does cause major issue for the team. This however is hjow each class should work, it should have 1 defining weakness that the other perks make up for.

As a general rule of thumb the firebugs role is to hit targets at long range to let them soften up or burn out. As long as you know the pratical uses of the Flamethrower and how much fuel you need per enemy, you can ration out its use very easily.
 

[UIT] Akame

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 5, 2009
1,280
129
0
My own personal hell
As far as ammo goes, I try to minimize my issues but aggressively picking up ammo boxes (which reminds me I have been having trouble with the spawn maxing my ammo at three canisters). I either use the mp5 (if I can get a medic to buy me one) to allow me to heal others or go katana for ammo preservation and anit-scrake.
 

Melon_Reaper

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 6, 2010
116
3
0
California
Nice to have someone on the Firebugs side for once :)

Forgot to add that maintenance of the firebug is dirt cheap as well. And as you stated, he spawns with armour and a 3/4 full flamethrower anyway, so deaths and money are very little issue for the FB :)

Dirt cheap indeed. The only class cheaper would be berserker, once it gets the katana. If I see a decent firebug on a team, I'm assured that they won't be needing money and may even share some with the team.

That contributes to the theory that some classes (firebug/berserk) aren't "underpowered", they simply have nothing to spend their money on. As compared to the powerful tier 3 weapons of the other classes.
 

YFGHNG

FNG / Fresh Meat
Mar 30, 2010
549
4
0
OCD
That contributes to the theory that some classes (firebug/berserk) aren't "underpowered", they simply have nothing to spend their money on.

True dat. Whenever I play a pound map on zerker mid game, I simply go ,throw a couple nades, kill a few, wait for the rest to finish them off because I don't have the power (unless you want me to knife them to death), and then I'm pretty much set for the next however many rounds there are left.

Buy a chainsaw, set my attack to alt fire, buy some armor, and I'm good. Unless TWi suddenly decides to do KF FF style, and give zerkers Cloud's bigass swords.
 

KingJoker

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 15, 2009
762
3
0
Far Far Away
Dirt cheap indeed. The only class cheaper would be berserker, once it gets the katana. If I see a decent firebug on a team, I'm assured that they won't be needing money and may even share some with the team.

That contributes to the theory that some classes (firebug/berserk) aren't "underpowered", they simply have nothing to spend their money on. As compared to the powerful tier 3 weapons of the other classes.

WTF zerk underpowered? im a medic noob o_O who runs in circiles with flesh pounds and bloats and im sure zerkers can too and since i use axes/katanas/knifes too play around **** man a zerker is not underpowered >_>

And yeah true :/ Medics and Zerkers never get to spend money D: (I see firebugs waste money on other weapons >_> (katana being around 1k pounds and if your in a stable game environment with no rambos thats about 2-3 waves lol)


BUT player specific drops fail. If that was the case id simply drop a lot of m32's as demo, and shoot all six, drop, pick up another one ,shot all six, drop pick up another one on the patriarch. (Like demos weren't over powered enough xD)
 

Melon_Reaper

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 6, 2010
116
3
0
California
WTF zerk underpowered? im a medic noob o_O who runs in circiles with flesh pounds and bloats and im sure zerkers can too and since i use axes/katanas/knifes too play around **** man a zerker is not underpowered >_>

I will point out that the plural form of knife is knives and that Berserkers cannot outrun raging fleshpounds on suicidal.
Berserker arguments can be found in another thread.
Long Story Short: Compared to SS and Commando, zerker is underpowered.

Medics and Zerkers never get to spend money D: (I see firebugs waste money on other weapons >_>

Have you ever played Firebug? There isn't much of a choice for other weapons, as the flamethrower takes up the majority of your weight blocks. The katana is one of the only decent choices (the other being the handcannon).
On the other hand, medics and berserkers have plenty of room for other weapons, most notably the bow.
 

KingJoker

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 15, 2009
762
3
0
Far Far Away
I will point out that the plural form of knife is knives and that Berserkers cannot outrun raging fleshpounds on suicidal.
Berserker arguments can be found in another thread.
Long Story Short: Compared to SS and Commando, zerker is underpowered.



Have you ever played Firebug? There isn't much of a choice for other weapons, as the flamethrower takes up the majority of your weight blocks. The katana is one of the only decent choices (the other being the handcannon).
On the other hand, medics and berserkers have plenty of room for other weapons, most notably the bow.

^^^I believe your trying to be rude pointing out my misspelling of knives.... but whatever.

Zerkers are suppose to be like firebugs/ and demos who use there weapons too kill low level specimens (Demos can kill fleshys but cant do **** too scrakes/barely to patriarch most the time...) but a zerker outrunning a fleshy? i have a question for that? Why the **** was that zerker that far from the sharpshooter. :D



And most medics and zerkers do get crossbows but once a fleshpound jumps on you its nearly impossible to aim at the head correctly so we have to become sharpshooters at that moment usually......
(By the way the commando is overpowered? a scar and an AK do due alot of damage but come on? Over powered? They have recoil... (bug in the game ruins it but still). Their ammo can go quickly...... I believe commando is made actually for people who can use commando and not just spray.)
 
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Reaper420

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jan 12, 2010
89
1
0
Lebanon, Oregon
"If you want more gear, you can play support"

I want to be a firebug with another torch on ground, or SS with dual HC on ground. Not a support..

"If you want to make yourself a cozy fortress mind the consequences"

That's quite a stretch to call dropping an extra weapon on the floor a cozy fortress...Uh am I pulling up a Lazyboy recliner and an anti aircraft turret?

"in a battle, a gun lying on the ground does not belong to anyone"

This, is a game my friend. With rocket launcher arm mad scientists, "healing guns" and individuals carrying a rocket launcher, fifteen rockets, a shotgun, 60 shells and a katana all on his person. This is not based on real battles, take that argument elsewhere.

Insert ROFLcopter here. If you suck enough to where the weapons you have don't suffice then you need to go play something else. May I recommend a disney game? Might be less difficult for you.

Also if you are hording guns then it's prolly safe to say that you camp a lot. Which is even lamer.

And what you doin' tellin' him to take his argument elsewhere, he knows this is a game, but in the game a wave is a battle. And in a battle if you need a gun, and theres one on the floor, then F whoever left it there in the A and take it. They didn't make it so we drop weps when we die or need space for just personal gain.

I'm tired of the whole team dying, me running out of ammo, grabbing one of their guns, and getting *****ed at. It kinda makes me not wanna give it back. The failed should be happy that they contributed to a win in some way at least. Even if it's me using their weps for the win.

Why the **** was that zerker that far from the sharpshooter. :D

Is that a real question? Ahhh prolly 'cause of the super lame *** glitch the SS has with that super uber lame *** xbow (For vaginas only). The Zerker was prolly tryin' to have fun, 'cause if he hangs around the SS then the SS will steal all the larger zombies. Making the game boring. You can argue strategies if you like, but all it shows is that you lot still don't understand the point of going off on your own yet. I'll spell it out one more time -> We don't care if we win or lose, camping is boring period. If I wanted to sit in one room and push my mouse buttons I would go get an MMORPG. This is an action game, show some balls and jump in the action. Camp and i'll laugh at you. (Mostly 'cause despite all the *****ing at rambo, once rambo dies usually the whole team follows suit. Funny how they rely on and ***** at Rambos.)
 
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KingJoker

FNG / Fresh Meat
Jun 15, 2009
762
3
0
Far Far Away
Is that a real question? Ahhh prolly 'cause of the super lame *** glitch the SS has with that super uber lame *** xbow (For vaginas only). The Zerker was prolly tryin' to have fun, 'cause if he hangs around the SS then the SS will steal all the larger zombies. Making the game boring. You can argue strategies if you like, but all it shows is that you lot still don't understand the point of going off on your own yet. I'll spell it out one more time -> We don't care if we win or lose, camping is boring period. If I wanted to sit in one room and push my mouse buttons I would go get an MMORPG. This is an action game, show some balls and jump in the action. Camp and i'll laugh at you. (Mostly 'cause despite all the *****ing at rambo, once rambo dies usually the whole team follows suit. Funny how they rely on and ***** at Rambos.)

I know no gitch the sharpshooter has except being over powered. and personally Camp or not or even rambo they all suck and having fun because you are killing specimens is sad i have fun being a medic and healing... Woo. I even rambo on occasion as a medic but thats when i just wanna kill specimens and not contribute exactly too the team. Also i like playing the few story maps KF has so i say **** you when it comes too rambo'ing in story maps :D.

A zerker should at least carry a crossbow them selves. If you truly are a godly rambo you should have experience in the game and know :D. if not he should at least be prepared. SS's stealing kills is natural, **** before demos and crap all you saw was supports stealing every kill imaginable.


and ive yet too see a team fall apart because a rambo died. :D Rambos just knock off the numbers. if your trying to say that a team of players dies then thats retarded..... Rambo'ers usually are no better so infact the accumulated players should be more then enough to survive so im guessing you play on servers less then hard or something down those lines. *SUCKY GROUPS.*


Fun in KF = Seeing your team die by a ninja bloat/fleshpound.....
Not fun = LOOK AT MY KILLS, LOOK AT EM!
 
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