Custom Maps - Qualification Board & Forced Download

[Mike_Nomad]

No fact here. Sorry. It is you who needs to name 20 maps minimum you feel would pass QB.

All the maps would eventually pass the QB.

• Bridge
• Bridges_of_Druzhina
• Butovo
• Climbup
• ColdSteel
• Der Iwan Berg
• DieBresche
• Eagles Nest
• GumrakStation
• Hill-911
• Kaukasus
• Koitos 1943
• Kriegsziet
• Kursk
• MyshkovaRiver
• No Mans Hill
• Odessa
• Red Assault
• Stalag13
• Tulaoutskirts
• Univermag
• West-Harbor
• Yakovlevo
• Zapadnovka Village
• Zhitomir
• Zhukovka

 

[Fishsticks]

No fact here. Sorry. It is you who needs to name 20 maps minimum you feel would pass QB.

Butovo
Climup
Gumrakstation
Kaukasus
Myshkova River
Odessa
Stalag14
TulaOutskirts
Univermag
Yakovlevo

Not exactly 20 but I'm sure I left a few out that have not been recooked recently.

All good playable maps...plus there are more coming down the pipeline eventually.

EDIT.......... Mike listed more

 

[Mike_Nomad]

Butovo
Climup
Gumrakstation
Kaukasus
Myshkova River
Odessa
Stalag14
TulaOutskirts
Univermag
Yakovlevo

Not exactly 20 but I'm sure I left a few out that have not been recooked recently.

All good playable maps...plus there are more coming down the pipeline eventually.

Look above your post you left a few out...

• Bridge
• Bridges_of_Druzhina
• Butovo
• Climbup
• ColdSteel
• Der Iwan Berg
• DieBresche
• Eagles Nest
• GumrakStation
• Hill-911
• Kaukasus
• Koitos 1943
• Kriegsziet
• Kursk
• MyshkovaRiver
• No Mans Hill
• Odessa
• Red Assault
• Stalag13
• Tulaoutskirts
• Univermag
• West-Harbor
• Yakovlevo
• Zapadnovka Village
• Zhitomir
• Zhukovka

We've played and enjoyed all of them.

 

[VietViking]

I wouldn't be so sure of that. This is why the QB definitely needs very high standards. A lot of people were not interested in some of these maps as custom maps, making them official certainly would not solve that, people would just get pissoed off that they had to download another ~200mb of a map that nobody would play. In addition, a lot of these maps are outdated, have had their author's leave the community, development halted, still heavily a work in progress, a direct port using RO1 art assets, or just don't suit RO2's gameplay well.

Making a map an official map means quality. Sadly, some of these maps just won't cut it.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

I wouldn't be so sure of that. This is why the QB definitely needs very high standards. A lot of people were not interested in some of these maps as custom maps, making them official certainly would not solve that, people would just get pissoed off that they had to download another ~200mb of a map that nobody would play. In addition, a lot of these maps are outdated, have had their author's leave the community, development halted, still heavily a work in progress, a direct port using RO1 art assets, or just don't suit RO2's gameplay well.

Making a map an official map means quality. Sadly, some of these maps just won't cut it.

You take for granted that personalities, politics and other influences will never come into play in the judging process.

Sorry, I am not that naive to see it that way...

Just look at this thread.. it sez it all.

 

[-=THOR=-]

Even if at some point in time 20 maps were embedded, that would make what... an additional 3-4 GB when a full recook of all maps is required for a big update? And by the time we reach 20 embedded maps, I wouldn't be surprized if TWI came up with a solution that fixes the recooking issue.

 

[Warishell]

All the maps would eventually pass the QB.

I do hope so.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

I do hope so.

But then.....

The real and genuine problem comes into play.

The downloads - ReCooks with Updates and downloads.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

Even if at some point in time 20 maps were embedded, that would make what... an additional 3-4 GB when a full recook of all maps is required for a big update? And by the time we reach 20 embedded maps, I wouldn't be surprized if TWI came up with a solution that fixes the recooking issue.

Ah yes...... hope springs eternal.

Ever wonder why its not a reality yet?

Or, that the next installment of Contest Winners is still among the missing?

Could it mean another update is imminent? Thus providing for and update/patch and download.... but then, what about the existing maps both MCP and current customs in use?

Factually speaking, the logistics of implementation need to be thoroughly worked out before * any * consideration of Governance is brought forward.

 

[Ducky]

They also will need to be recooked if they are passed to the clients by using a redirect. So what is the difference? If it's the large package size for a RO2 update, then that could be prevented by compiling custom map DLCs (like done for other games). It would also make it easier to split it up in TE, CD, FF or RO2 or RS map packs. Then the players can download the pack which they want to play and don't need to download FF maps if they never play it. Any update on such a pack will then be auto downloaded using steam (not steam workshop).

 

[Moskeeto]

If it's the large package size for a RO2 update, then that could be prevented by compiling custom map DLCs (like done for other games).

This is exactly what I was just coming in to say. People complained about having to download RS Lite which is why I think they should have made it an optional free DLC which they should also do for custom map packs.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

They also will need to be recooked if they are passed to the clients by using a redirect. So what is the difference?

A BIG difference!! With the ReDirect they get ONE MAP sent to them in usually less than 120 seconds and the user does not face an overuse of bandwidth penalty.
​

If it's the large package size for a RO2 update, then that could be prevented by compiling custom map DLCs (like done for other games). It would also make it easier to split it up in TE, CD, FF or RO2 or RS map packs.

Perhaps workable... confusing in concept but workable if the users are willing to think their way through. We saw they refused to do so with the customized Day/Night RS map conversions. It was total brain-lock for many.
​

Then the players can download the pack which they want to play and don't need to download FF maps if they never play it. Any update on such a pack will then be auto downloaded using steam (not steam workshop).

Same deal though, if Steam sees any file(s) missing... you know what's going to occur.
​

Again,
Factually speaking, the logistics of implementation need to be thoroughly worked out before * any * consideration of Governance is brought forward.

Back to square one.

 

[ButchCassidy]

A BIG difference!! With the ReDirect they get ONE MAP sent to them in usually less than 120 seconds and the user does not face an overuse of bandwidth penalty.
​

Perhaps workable... confusing in concept but workable if the users are willing to think their way through. We saw they refused to do so with the customized Day/Night RS map conversions. It was total brain-lock for many.
​

Same deal though, if Steam sees any file(s) missing... you know what's going to occur.
​

Again,
Factually speaking, the logistics of implementation need to be thoroughly worked out before * any * consideration of Governance is brought forward.

Back to square one.

You seem to be confusing redirect with a game patch?

We are talking about adding custom maps to an official game patch that every single player who owns RO2/RS would receive.
Not a redirect from an isolated server.

So yes a big difference.

 

[Mike_Nomad]

You seem to be confusing redirect with a game patch?

No, you are. (Diversions/Smoke & Mirrors)

We are talking about adding custom maps to an official game patch that every single player who owns RO2/RS would receive.
Not a redirect from an isolated server.

So yes a big difference.

Another "Butch" play on words...... You know exactly what I'm talking about.

@ALL;
This entire proposition reminds me of the useless governments in the UK and USA that constantly add bureaucratic layers of do nothing noise just to make titles and satisfy egos.

 

[ButchCassidy]

No, you are. (Diversions/Smoke & Mirrors)



Another "Butch" play on words...... You know exactly what I'm talking about.

@ALL;
This entire proposition reminds me of the useless governments in the UK and USA that constantly add bureaucratic layers of do nothing noise just to make titles and satisfy egos.

I fail to see a play on words.
Its a very simple concept.
Give mappers the opportunity to get their maps included into the game via an official full game patch.
Are you saying that having custom maps added to an official RO2/RS patch, so that every player can enjoy them is a bad thing?

 

[Mike_Nomad]

Are you saying that having custom maps added to an official RO2/RS patch, so that every player can enjoy them is a bad thing?

Show me where I said that.. Show me.

More word games....

This convo for me is over.

 

[Sensemann]

A fast redirect still does not guarantee that the player will get the custom map fast. What if he's from Europe or Asia and playing on a North-American server? The download time will be longer compared to NA players and that is the point where the EU and Asian players disconnect and look for an other server. And what if server A is running the newest version while server B is running an older version. We've seen in the past that this gives problems. That problem would not be there (or at least less frequent) if the custom map came with the game itself.

You just described me, a European in Asia . You are exactly pointing out the major issues with map versions and impatience of players to download the maps while connecting to a server which runs a custom map.

All TWI would need to do (and for f*ck sake it's in their own benefit---> marketing) is to receive custom maps from mappers, tell them what has to be done in regards towards polishing and then release them through a monthly update. Additionally, design a loading screen that stats sth like "Connecting to custom map xyz, currently WIP and not final or done by TWI. Have fun".

While TWI could always say when complaints come in "we didn't create this map", they would surely get repetitive free advertisement by their product being constantly updated with free new content (for players and TWI).
If there is no legal issue or problem with STEAM/VALVE for doing this style, I am too stupid to find a reason on why not using this system towards your advantage.

 

[Twrecks]

I can see from the OP that the biggest hurdle is distribution. Without TWI main-lining the content to the public through Steam, the current situation of a defunct SWS or loss of ADD players waiting for redirects will perpetuate.

If Tripwire thinks there are enough new worthy ($$$) maps available, then they may hold another contest, making more maps 'stock'. Given the relatively few entries for the MCP, and since there are no original maps for RS at the moment, that time is indeed a long way off.

Is a QB a solution? Does it generate revenue? As a business answer, NO to both. Legal issues aside, the QB sounds risky and appears as an added expense/responsibility. To give license to an independant body to determine what is good enough to pack alongside with true game content is insane. If packaged as a self installing DLC, it may have a chance.

QB has the heart in the right place. Let Server admins choose a true "Cumminity Map Pack/DLC" to test he waters with. Petition TWI/Steam for public release and see what happens next.

 

[ButchCassidy]

No, you are. (Diversions/Smoke & Mirrors)

Another "Butch" play on words...... You know exactly what I'm talking about.

@ALL;
This entire proposition reminds me of the useless governments in the UK and USA that constantly add bureaucratic layers of do nothing noise just to make titles and satisfy egos.

The clear opposition to the whole idea of Thors you posted here.

Show me where I said that.. Show me.

More word games....

This convo for me is over.

As I stated Thors idea is very simple to understand which is why I asked if you consider not including custom maps into a patch as a better idea?

 

[ColdAs1c3]

I don't understand why there is such confusion.

In regards to this proposal:

• The current process of users designing maps and having to cook maps would not change.
• Server Admins would be able to host any custom map they want (just as before)
• Map makers and users can use the SWS or ignore it (Their choice)
• Server admins can choose to use a redirect server, or ignore it (Their choice)
• The map makers can update their maps as many times as they want.

So what is the proposal for?

The sad fact is, many users don't have the patience or are misinformed about custom content. The hard graft and hours put into custom maps, it's a god damn shame they are not being played more!

There are custom maps out there that have the balance, polish and map design that deserve to be made an official map. This proposal would open an avenue for map makers to submit their map to TWI, if successful the map would become an "OFFICIAL MAP" The map maker wouldn't need to worry about having to constantly recook the map after an update.

All this would be handled by TWI, exactly the same as Winterwald, Rakowice etc.

The evidence is out there for all to see, the winners of the last map competition that got their map added to the official rotation have thankfully seen these maps become accepted and more frequently played.

Admins and the player base alike, don't need to go hunting for new versions after an update from TWI.

How is this anything but a positive proposal for the whole community?

Mike, you have mentioned that you are dubious about those left in charge of approving these maps.

I am curious, do you feel those that have judged the recent map contests are biased towards certain members of the community?