Concealment Benefits of Decoy Layers?

[jeffduquette]

I have another question relating to decoy-layers\decoy-meshes...

As I understand from the UNREAL tutorial on decoy layers -- and from watching how grass decoy meshes "grow" around a player during game play and movement across a map, I am wondering about the potential concealment properties of decoy layers. While playing, unlike my fully erect, constantly charging forward, grenade tossing and submachine gun spraying compatriots, I sometimes find occasion to lay prone in the grass when the bullets come wizzing back at me.

Let’s say the decoy layer radius equates to something like 100meters (whatever that means in terms of a game map scale). So as I move around the map, the grass decoy mesh is constantly "growing" and receding from my line of sight at a distance of 100-meters. If I am outside of the decoy mesh "growth" radius of a bad guy, am I gaining any concealment benefit from lying down in the tall grass? Or have I been kidding myself that the decoy mesh actually obscures or blocks line of sight during game play? In other words from the bad guys frame of reference, no grass decoy layer has grown around me, but from my perspective I feel like I am concealed by the tall grass.

 

[Shurek]

Actually Deco layers shouldn't be counted on for concealment because players can turn it off on the client side, just like weather effects. While deco layers may look cool (and I like to use them too on my maps as window dressing, as it were), they are basically useless as cover, and all it does is block the view of the person who is hiding in the grass (if they have deco even turned on) and not the other way around. You can set the effective render distance of any deco mesh/deco layer in the Terrain Info actor under the Deco Layer section. Deco Layers are also hard on the frames per second for most mid to low-level video cards too, if you apply the layer too densely.

If you're trying to create areas of vegetative cover, it's better to use groups of regular static meshes.

FYI: 1 real world meter = 60.352 RO Unreal Units

 

[Lt_Kettch]

100 meteres are about 6000 Unreal unit's

And if you both (the enemy and you) are within the radius you have set in the fade out distance (you know what I mean) the deco layer should be visible for both of you.

Maikop is good example for a deco layer which provides good cover.

 

[Greenhell]

You can force the decolayer on the map, btw...so it cant be turned off clientside. Its in the terrainediting window at the decolayer-tab. There you can right-click on the layer itself and check Forcedraw on. This feature wasnt possible in unreal 2 engine, but is in the 2.5 version RO is build on.

 

[jeffduquette]

Thanks Shurek, Lt Kettch & Greenhell. All very informative.

By the way

 

[Shurek]

You can force the decolayer on the map, btw...so it cant be turned off clientside. Its in the terrainediting window at the decolayer-tab. There you can right-click on the layer itself and check Forcedraw on. This feature wasnt possible in unreal 2 engine, but is in the 2.5 version RO is build on.

That's very interesting indeed. I was going off of what I knew about the Unreal 2 engine. See, even I learn something new everyday

@jeff: My avatar is a picture of the character Shurek (or sometimes transliterated to Shurik) played by the actor Alexandr Demyanenko. The character was a favorite in a series of famous Soviet-era comedies. He's my alter-ego

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Y_and_Other_Shurik's_Adventures

 

[jeffduquette]

wrong thread...

 

[jeffduquette]

@jeff: My avatar is a picture of the character Shurek (or sometimes transliterated to Shurik) played by the actor Alexandr Demyanenko. The character was a favorite in a series of famous Soviet-era comedies. He's my alter-ego

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Y_and_Other_Shurik's_Adventures

I guess I have never seen this series. But thanks -- the picture was bugging me as I thought the guy looked familiar to me.

 

[REZ]

..yeah, he kind of looks like Mike Myers.

 

[jeffduquette]

..yeah, he kind of looks like Mike Myers.

Yeah baby...

 

[Slashbot_427]

I have another question relating to decoy-layers\decoy-meshes...

As I understand from the UNREAL tutorial on decoy layers -- and from watching how grass decoy meshes "grow" around a player during game play and movement across a map, I am wondering about the potential concealment properties of decoy layers. While playing, unlike my fully erect, constantly charging forward, grenade tossing and submachine gun spraying compatriots, I sometimes find occasion to lay prone in the grass when the bullets come wizzing back at me.

Let’s say the decoy layer radius equates to something like 100meters (whatever that means in terms of a game map scale). So as I move around the map, the grass decoy mesh is constantly "growing" and receding from my line of sight at a distance of 100-meters. If I am outside of the decoy mesh "growth" radius of a bad guy, am I gaining any concealment benefit from lying down in the tall grass? Or have I been kidding myself that the decoy mesh actually obscures or blocks line of sight during game play? In other words from the bad guys frame of reference, no grass decoy layer has grown around me, but from my perspective I feel like I am concealed by the tall grass.

If you are outside the deco radius there are no meshes dislpayed so all concealment is lost. Also the deco layer cannot have any collision so it cant block bullets etc.

There is a fine line between too much deco statics and not enough. You need to really balance how the deco layers are done so that players dont even think to use then as concealment, yet they are there to add the "right" amount of detail.

for example, if you have a larger level then you should always put actual static meshes in, but design it so that a few static meshes will allow the advance of the attackers. Otherwise large amount of statics will kill the performance of your map, and deco layers won't work as concealment. If you have a really small level then the view distance is shorter so you may be able to use deco layer meshes to act as concealment.

There are some maps where deco layers are used as concealment, but the range of the map is such that if you go prone you cant see above the grass, but the enemy has a clear view of you as you're basically on a bald hill, and you get nailed. Please try to avoid this with your maps. For eample the grass on Black day in July would be completely inappropriate for a small scale infantry map as its too tall and the view range of the map is too far. But tank shells dont care about grass for effect, and there aren't really any infantry wandering about. So appropriate usage is key

Also, deco layers can really sap the performance of your level, and need to be used sparingly. Try putting 200m (12000UU-medium rifle shot) of rocks, grass, and small shrubs (3 separate deco layers), on a 512x512 terrain with the default 64UU quad size and u'l see what I mean. Especially if you use polygon-heavy meshes

 

[jeffduquette]

Excellent post Slashbot. Thanks for your insights.