This is about Classic Mode
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It was discussed a lot of time and I really think it
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It was discussed a lot of time and I really think it
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Classic: weapon accuracy, hitzones etc.
- Thread starter Kleist
- Start date
i shoot guys in the leg and have them live all the time. maybe it's a classic problem with the lack of being able to bandage that's causing it? 
(i play realism server with custom settings)
(i play realism server with custom settings)
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Kleist, it's not a good suggestion.
When we are under fire, we can push crouch or prone button. It's just not an automatic movement as you wish. (how boring it will be if this automatic movement was in RO 2 ! ).
Tripwire give us ability to do it ("rolls over on the floor") by a button prone or crouch when you are under fire. You are not a bot but a player.
Tripwire gave us abilty to not be a bot...only push button prone or crouch to stay alive. Don't switch a movement who need to be done by player by an automatic movement. Don't make RO 2 a game for bots. Don't make us bots. You are ruining classic. (...If you asking the same suggestion for realism i will answer the same : you are ruining realism.) Here I think your idea will not make classic more realist. So i am afraid you love more animation than gameplay.
Kleist, searching ideas is good, but we need to search ideas who not destroy the game or the gameplay.
You will answer : "ok, prone button, ok, crouch button, i already know them becasue i used a lot in game...but i want new animations in more". (animation of player rolling over on the floor). And you will wrong again : new animations of this kind will not make a game as RO 2 more realist.
Job of Tripwire inside RO 2 is good, no ?
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Whats wrong with this idea? We have this without any special animation in Darkest Hour. When someone hit your leg you will fall to the ground and can
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If the bullet breaks through your bones, you won't be able to use that arm or leg. Not for months.
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Yesterday we played RO1 clanwar and it was obvioius that the weapons were much harder to handle when not deployed.
You didn't see people shooting from the stand in RO1 very often due to this. And so I think the weapon accuracy is in RO2 even in Classic mode still too high.
For the hitboxes:
If you get hit into your arms your aiming should be much harder. Even Operation Flashpoint CWR from 2001 had such a feature
You didn't see people shooting from the stand in RO1 very often due to this. And so I think the weapon accuracy is in RO2 even in Classic mode still too high.
For the hitboxes:
If you get hit into your arms your aiming should be much harder. Even Operation Flashpoint CWR from 2001 had such a feature
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When you are running and get a bullet in a leg, you fall. You do not choose to fall or not, you just fall.
If you are walking and get shot in a leg, you walk slower.
Seems fine to me.
The zoom effect when running have to be removed, destroyed or annihilated. (Off topic, but, I can't afford this stupid thing anymore)
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You mean when you sprint? I wrote a fix for that one in the "What features are not commonly known?" thread.
http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=88518
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Tripwire gave us abilty to push prone or crouch buttons. What you will do after being shooted ? Tripwire give us choice. They let us answer.
You can choose what you will do after being shooted, and it's good. You, you want player CAN'T ANSWER...so making players bots. Be able to push prone or crouch buttons make gaemplay better than a gameplay where soldier fall when he is wounded.
It's not sure that Zoom is a "stupid thing" as you said. (even if we walk or run). Zoom is good idea. Destroying zoom is bad idea.
RO 2 is more interesting WITH zoom than WITHOUT zoom...Gameplay is better with zoom than without zoom. For a big part of players zoom is not a "stupid thing" : even guys who are against zoom in Classic or in Realism ask to switch the way of zoom to be zoom and not to REMOVE Zoom.
Removing zoom will not make RO 2 a better game. But solve problem of zoom CAN make RO 2 a better game.
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+ 1 about the whole accuracy thing. I seriously HATE how easy it is to score a kill or get killed. It just eliminates the whole situation of a firefight. I spot an unfriendly dude at 180 meters in a window, and before i even finished thinking the sentence "i am going to aim for him know" i already dropped him. Now i gotta admit, i have pretty awesome reflexes , but this part of the shooting mechanics is just.....lame. Nah but seriously, at engagements at 200 meters bullets should be flying around like stupid girls who see justin bieber, but in the contrary are those engagements almost always over in 2-4 shots.
In close combat, a la, ok, at 10-30 meters, you can have situations where its simply a "sh.t aim fire ow pfew hes dead".
Shortly said; it should be harder, like Kleist said, especially standing and unsupported, but i want to press that it should not be as hard as it was shooting while standing in ro1, in my opinion at least. that was a little bit ridicilous. We can look a lot further in ro 2, and thats beautiful, and can deliver great long range firefights. In ro 1 a shot at 200 meters was a frigging miracle. Im just saying, we are able too LOOK further, but we shouldnt be able to KILL as easy as we are able too look at that distance. y'all understand?
That i can look at something at 800 meters and see what it is cause it aint no flipping pixel paradise anymore is fantastic, but a shot at 800 meters is tough as hell, and a riflemen might even consider not taking shots at all and close in.
Same goes for 200 meters. Altough 200 is of course 600 meters easier than 800.
, but this part of the shooting mechanics is just.....lame. Nah but seriously, at engagements at 200 meters bullets should be flying around like stupid girls who see justin bieber, but in the contrary are those engagements almost always over in 2-4 shots.In close combat, a la, ok, at 10-30 meters, you can have situations where its simply a "sh.t aim fire ow pfew hes dead".
Shortly said; it should be harder, like Kleist said, especially standing and unsupported, but i want to press that it should not be as hard as it was shooting while standing in ro1, in my opinion at least. that was a little bit ridicilous. We can look a lot further in ro 2, and thats beautiful, and can deliver great long range firefights. In ro 1 a shot at 200 meters was a frigging miracle. Im just saying, we are able too LOOK further, but we shouldnt be able to KILL as easy as we are able too look at that distance. y'all understand?
That i can look at something at 800 meters and see what it is cause it aint no flipping pixel paradise anymore is fantastic, but a shot at 800 meters is tough as hell, and a riflemen might even consider not taking shots at all and close in.
Same goes for 200 meters. Altough 200 is of course 600 meters easier than 800.
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I understand nothing? What are you talking about? What choose? When you get it in the leg, you CAN'T keep running like nothing has happened. What choose, seriously? So people can have the choose to stop or continue to run with a bullet in the leg? So everybody will continue running... >_< I don't see the point here.
I was talking about the zoom out effect when running, not the whole IS zoom system in RO2.
You started with IS zoom, so I reply : I fully disagree with you.
You say "the game is more interesting with zoom than without zoom"? It's your opinion mate, not mine, not at all.
Classic needs to be more different from Realism (And not just boring as now)
Zoom, sway, hitboxes, etc, TWI know what to do to make Classic attractive.
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A "fall to prone" mechanic when hit in the leg by bullets during a sprint would be pretty cool, imo. Is it just me, or did Darkest Hour have something along those lines?
Having been an active Classic player since the mode came out, I think it's actually quite difficult to take aim without support when out of stamina--I've died often because I missed a shot at 30 meters because my ragged, exhausted breathing threw my aim off. Classic weapon sway in general is pretty well done, in my opinion.
Having been an active Classic player since the mode came out, I think it's actually quite difficult to take aim without support when out of stamina--I've died often because I missed a shot at 30 meters because my ragged, exhausted breathing threw my aim off. Classic weapon sway in general is pretty well done, in my opinion.
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can you give me an example of just what map it is you can look at a target 800 meters away, and then i.d. it? how about a nice screenshot of that? cause i not only beleive there's no map you can do it on, but that you would not be able to i.d. the target either.
i fully agree. you get shot in a leg bone, you should fall. if you want to get up and limp, so be it.
thing is, the way the game is, i think all leg bone shots translate to fatal wounds anyway.
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I think falling should result from various injuries, but it needs some more detail than simply going to prone or crouching.
For one:
1) If your character simply drops to prone, your hit is suddenly an advantage; you're on the ground with minimal target profile, at a stable shooting position, and ready to fire.
2) Realistically, soldiers dropping from an injury are just as likely to fall backwards as forwards - at that point, in order to fight back, you'd have to adjust roll back onto your stomach and aim the gun.
3) Even if you sustain an injury and fall flat forward on your face, that's not the same as falling to prone. You will be stunned and disoriented for a split second, to fire you will have to pull your rifle out and prop yourself back up on your elbows.
Here's a soldier taking multiple hits from Taliban fighters in Afghanistan. None of them penetrate his armor, even his helmet (gotta love the long range ballistics of 7.62x39mm). His worst spill actually appears to be simply tripping, of his own clumsiness as he attempts to run down the cliff. Given his position, when he gets hit, he essentially looses his balance and slumps into the mountain wall.
Point being, you may fall from any hit, even if it doesn't cause major damage to your legs, and it may not always be to an ideal prone or crouch shooting position. This is an important differentiation.
Also, in a very RO moment, a bullet hits his M203 and he actually drops his rifle, though his entire stash of magazines and grenades don't spilling down the cliff with it.
For one:
1) If your character simply drops to prone, your hit is suddenly an advantage; you're on the ground with minimal target profile, at a stable shooting position, and ready to fire.
2) Realistically, soldiers dropping from an injury are just as likely to fall backwards as forwards - at that point, in order to fight back, you'd have to adjust roll back onto your stomach and aim the gun.
3) Even if you sustain an injury and fall flat forward on your face, that's not the same as falling to prone. You will be stunned and disoriented for a split second, to fire you will have to pull your rifle out and prop yourself back up on your elbows.
Here's a soldier taking multiple hits from Taliban fighters in Afghanistan. None of them penetrate his armor, even his helmet (gotta love the long range ballistics of 7.62x39mm). His worst spill actually appears to be simply tripping, of his own clumsiness as he attempts to run down the cliff. Given his position, when he gets hit, he essentially looses his balance and slumps into the mountain wall.
Point being, you may fall from any hit, even if it doesn't cause major damage to your legs, and it may not always be to an ideal prone or crouch shooting position. This is an important differentiation.
Also, in a very RO moment, a bullet hits his M203 and he actually drops his rifle, though his entire stash of magazines and grenades don't spilling down the cliff with it.
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great post. i remember watching that poor guy before.I think falling should result from various injuries, but it needs some more detail than simply going to prone or crouching.
For one:
1) If your character simply drops to prone, your hit is suddenly an advantage; you're on the ground with minimal target profile, at a stable shooting position, and ready to fire.
2) Realistically, soldiers dropping from an injury are just as likely to fall backwards as forwards - at that point, in order to fight back, you'd have to adjust roll back onto your stomach and aim the gun.
3) Even if you sustain an injury and fall flat forward on your face, that's not the same as falling to prone. You will be stunned and disoriented for a split second, to fire you will have to pull your rifle out and prop yourself back up on your elbows.
Here's a soldier taking multiple hits from Taliban fighters in Afghanistan. None of them penetrate his armor, even his helmet (gotta love the long range ballistics of 7.62x39mm). His worst spill actually appears to be simply tripping, of his own clumsiness as he attempts to run down the cliff. Given his position, when he gets hit, he essentially looses his balance and slumps into the mountain wall.
Point being, you may fall from any hit, even if it doesn't cause major damage to your legs, and it may not always be to an ideal prone or crouch shooting position. This is an important differentiation.
Also, in a very RO moment, a bullet hits his M203 and he actually drops his rifle, though his entire stash of magazines and grenades don't spilling down the cliff with it.
i'm kinda back and forth on this debate, both sides have valid points. i think i'll stay out of it from now and and just go back to enjoying the game. cause either way, i'll be happy playing it!
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People can make a prone or crouch movement when they are wounded...This is what I mean. It's more interresting than falling movement. Being wounded (except sudden death ) can't prevent people to do their last steps.
With heavily injury you have 1 or 2 seconds to react to keep you alive. (In classic you can only try to hide you. In realism you can hide you and use bandage.)
With light injury you have 4 or 5 seconds to react to keep you alive. (In classic you can only try to hide you. In realism you can hide you and use bandage.)
Falling will just REMOVE all the gameplay of the player to stay alive ! (Staying alive job is the same in classic and realism. After taking cover you can use bandage in realism.).
I NEVER talk about RUNNING MOVEMENT ! Only crouch or prone movement (of few steps...).
Here in RO 2 it's sudden death. In classic and in realism.
I was talking about the zoom out effect when running, not the whole IS zoom system in RO2.
You started with IS zoom, so I reply : I fully disagree with you.
You say "the game is more interesting with zoom than without zoom"? It's your opinion mate, not mine, not at all.
Classic needs to be more different from Realism (And not just boring as now)
Zoom, sway, hitboxes, etc, TWI know what to do to make Classic attractive.
Players hate zoom because they think with zoom each player shoot look like a sniper. Zoom by itself is not bad : it's only players make sniper job that people hate zoom. Zoom is good thing and also an realist way of playing. I have no problem with it. I am ok with Gnam opinion about zoom. He explains very well how zoom is more realist than we can think.
You want classic more attractive ? Classic failed. Realism failed. I prefer play realism than classic because I prefer errors of realism than errors of classic.
I think falling should result from various injuries, but it needs some more detail than simply going to prone or crouching.
For one:
1) If your character simply drops to prone, your hit is suddenly an advantage; you're on the ground with minimal target profile, at a stable shooting position, and ready to fire.
2) Realistically, soldiers dropping from an injury are just as likely to fall backwards as forwards - at that point, in order to fight back, you'd have to adjust roll back onto your stomach and aim the gun.
3) Even if you sustain an injury and fall flat forward on your face, that's not the same as falling to prone. You will be stunned and disoriented for a split second, to fire you will have to pull your rifle out and prop yourself back up on your elbows.
Here's a soldier taking multiple hits from Taliban fighters in Afghanistan. None of them penetrate his armor, even his helmet (gotta love the long range ballistics of 7.62x39mm). His worst spill actually appears to be simply tripping, of his own clumsiness as he attempts to run down the cliff. Given his position, when he gets hit, he essentially looses his balance and slumps into the mountain wall.
Point being, you may fall from any hit, even if it doesn't cause major damage to your legs, and it may not always be to an ideal prone or crouch shooting position. This is an important differentiation.
Also, in a very RO moment, a bullet hits his M203 and he actually drops his rifle, though his entire stash of magazines and grenades don't spilling down the cliff with it.
Here Gnam shows how classic is not so realist...(and how realism is really MORE realist on this point than classic).
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can you give me an example of just what map it is you can look at a target 800 meters away, and then i.d. it? how about a nice screenshot of that? cause i not only beleive there's no map you can do it on, but that you would not be able to i.d. the target either.
This was just an example. I ment to say that we can look further, but that you should not be able too hit anything you see in 1- 2 shots at those distances.
Also, what i ment with bullets flying like girls who see justin bieber, was NOT that bullets should be inaccurate, but simply that it should be hard to zero in cause of sway and recoil at those distances.
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