Class selection suggestion.
- Thread starter Tiger2
- Start date
It's a lame idea because you can not determine how good someone is playing or not, simply because of kills or deaths or whatever ratio there be in someone's head.
What about supressive fire? As a sniper or MG I have laid down a lot of fire power in one direction, forcing the enemy to head another direction with the tanks waiting to take them out.... they get the points, I don't, but as a team, we beat the round.
Yet because I didn't actually take these people out and other team mates did because of my actions, I should be punished because someone else wants to fight a different way?
And how do you expect new players to get good at the different classes in the game if they keep getting kicked out of that class because some big wizz who thinks he's the sh*t takes the class by force and holds that class every single time he/she plays?
They're not, and all you're going to have is a server where one or two people get total rule of whatever they play, whoever they play, whenever they play.
New players should stick to practice then?
Would be a good idea if the bots were worth the time, and you all should know full well the practice doesn't equate to general online game play with players who know how to think. You can't learn how to use a specific class against enemies with brains if you have a select few players monopolizing on all the decent classes every time and all you get to choose from are riflemen.
Might be great for people who already know how to play the game and are too chicken-sh*t to be stuck using a class that doesn't have a scope or hundreds of bullets to make their kills far easier.
Sure I bet they're real good with the MG or sniper class... they're easy classes to begin with.
I got a better idea.... those who are already good with the game, have a lot of kills and dominate the maps all the time should be the one's forced to use only riflemen to give them a bit of a challenge while the new players get the better classes, give them a chance to figure things out, and balance the gameplay between both.
Now I'm sure some here wouldn't like that to happen and if they were stuck all the time just using one class in the game, chances are they'd stop playing. So what makes people think this would be any different for new players to the game who never get a chance?
And you know full well that as soon as all these players who keep complaining about never getting to be sniper or MG get the map mopped with their faces if they don't get them right away, so they come up with this petty idea to ensure they get priority over everyone else for these classes. It sure isn't much of an effort to line up someone in a scope and get a few points, or unload hundreds of bullets in a bottleneck to rack up your points. Unfortunatly some new players still need to figure out these things, to figure out the maps, what works and what doesn't in online play.
Then suddenly after a few deaths, they figure it out and are about to get setup right, only to be kicked out down to rifleman..... Annoying to say the least.
Keep it as it is..... if you want a specific class, try and get it when you get on the server asap..... or keep checking each death to see if it is free. Otherwise too bad, play the game like everybody else and suck it up, or go to another server where you can play that class.
The current way is at least the most fair. And before people start complaining about their computer or internet connection being slower then normal and coming in late after all the good classes are taken...... how is that our problem?
Go buy some RAM.
What about supressive fire? As a sniper or MG I have laid down a lot of fire power in one direction, forcing the enemy to head another direction with the tanks waiting to take them out.... they get the points, I don't, but as a team, we beat the round.
Yet because I didn't actually take these people out and other team mates did because of my actions, I should be punished because someone else wants to fight a different way?
And how do you expect new players to get good at the different classes in the game if they keep getting kicked out of that class because some big wizz who thinks he's the sh*t takes the class by force and holds that class every single time he/she plays?
They're not, and all you're going to have is a server where one or two people get total rule of whatever they play, whoever they play, whenever they play.
New players should stick to practice then?
Would be a good idea if the bots were worth the time, and you all should know full well the practice doesn't equate to general online game play with players who know how to think. You can't learn how to use a specific class against enemies with brains if you have a select few players monopolizing on all the decent classes every time and all you get to choose from are riflemen.
Might be great for people who already know how to play the game and are too chicken-sh*t to be stuck using a class that doesn't have a scope or hundreds of bullets to make their kills far easier.
Sure I bet they're real good with the MG or sniper class... they're easy classes to begin with.
I got a better idea.... those who are already good with the game, have a lot of kills and dominate the maps all the time should be the one's forced to use only riflemen to give them a bit of a challenge while the new players get the better classes, give them a chance to figure things out, and balance the gameplay between both.
Now I'm sure some here wouldn't like that to happen and if they were stuck all the time just using one class in the game, chances are they'd stop playing. So what makes people think this would be any different for new players to the game who never get a chance?
And you know full well that as soon as all these players who keep complaining about never getting to be sniper or MG get the map mopped with their faces if they don't get them right away, so they come up with this petty idea to ensure they get priority over everyone else for these classes. It sure isn't much of an effort to line up someone in a scope and get a few points, or unload hundreds of bullets in a bottleneck to rack up your points. Unfortunatly some new players still need to figure out these things, to figure out the maps, what works and what doesn't in online play.
Then suddenly after a few deaths, they figure it out and are about to get setup right, only to be kicked out down to rifleman..... Annoying to say the least.
Keep it as it is..... if you want a specific class, try and get it when you get on the server asap..... or keep checking each death to see if it is free. Otherwise too bad, play the game like everybody else and suck it up, or go to another server where you can play that class.
The current way is at least the most fair. And before people start complaining about their computer or internet connection being slower then normal and coming in late after all the good classes are taken...... how is that our problem?
Go buy some RAM.
*skipping few sentences about flood and logic existence in posts*
Just few questions:
1. Do you really believe that current system, where you need fast pc to be able to get favorite class is better than any smart class switching mechanism?
2. How current system, based on "Go buy some RAM" paradigm is helpful to New players to get good with different classes (if these players had medium pc)?
3. Don't you think, that for good game experience for gameplay, new players should start with rifleman? (Imagine, if a noob just entered the game and selects Officer, because of his pc speed).
Yes, and my reasons are as already explained which you "skipped"
Is it the best system? Perhaps not, but it's "Better" then the system being presented here.
I've already gotta deal with clowns on servers continually trying to kick someone off the server who's playing the game normally as far as I can see, yet everytime they fail in their vote, they startup another one and then another and another, somehow expecting people to finally give in to what he or she wants, when it'd be far better if they stopped wasting their damn time and played the game or go elsewhere.
Now add on top of that other players tossing in more vote kicks for people in different classes, taking them out of the game, mid-way of their life to suddenly be at the class screen again? Some whiner keeps starting up kick votes so they can get the sniper class, wha wha whaaaaa...... and when they don't get it, they keep doing it until the end of the round.
Hope it was fun for them.
Last I checked, the game and the servers people play on are not a "Democracy" nor did I pay for a Democracy. I paid for a game I want to play, with the classes I want to play so long as they're available...... I don't need or want other clowns trying to vote and dictate how I play the game and with what class.
If I'm breaking server rules, fine, kick me.... ban me even..... but I don't need a little pow wow of other players to determine what class I play.
And getting your PC fast isn't that hard of a thing to do, nor is it as expensive as it once was back in 2004-2005. Sometimes I get on to pick my own class I like.... sometimes I don't. So be it, that's how the game works.
I don't come onto the forums to complain and moan about not getting the class I want when I want it, everytime I want it..... I pick the available classes I can and play..... or I go somewhere else.
It doesn't... it makes things equal to everybody, good player or bad.
But if there is any system to be brought in to pamper one group over the other in regards to class selection, then it should go to the new players, not the one's who already know how to play the game.... they can do just fine as riflemen.
Until then, the current system works just fine. RO isn't the first game people have bought in the past that they eventually figured out they needed to pump their computers up a bit to play it better.... I don't see why the whole system has to be revamped now just because a few people don't always get what they want.
No, because then the new players only get to use the rifle and gain no experience with the other classes. How long do you expect to keep them at just using rifles? At what level or stage do you finally allow them to use something else? Exactly how to you expect them to prove they can use other classes if they're not allowed to?
Yet those who already know and played the game for some time can choose whatever they want, whenever they want, rack up even more points/caps and kills with their better classes and weapons, all at the expense of the new players who got a bolt and a couple of grenades, less capping power and nothing else?
People are already complaining about a small player base, I doubt this will improve anything except for those who already have been playing the game for a while and know what they're doing.
In a multiplayer world, you bring what you got.... which means your attitude, your game style, your experience and your system.
And if you're going to stick to the "My poor computer isn't powerful" excuse to justify this, I used to play Team Fortress Classic on a 33.6k modem, 200mhz CPU, 32MB of RAM and my video settings set to 320x240 hardware and I continually slaughtered people on Pentium II's & III's who's pings were a mere fraction of my own to the point of being called a cheater or a hack.
Make due with what you got or get something better.... don't go around trying to make other player's suffer because you can't be bothered to upgrade your own system.
I have very little sympathy as you can tell.
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The way it is is fine by me.
What would be good however, is the ability to request a class from someone, they could give or not give then.
Maybe give a total time played for each player or something so that you could tell who was more "experienced" and therefore be able to make a more informed choice as to whether to request or give a class.
I absolutely hate unlocks. They never work on how good a player is, only how long they've played, and even if they did work on skill, it still wouldn't be fun to play, especially if you were the bets player and the only one allowed to play as the sniper or officer, constantly battling to get a higher score to keep it ... no, that's more gamey than I'm comfortable with, and restricting.
What would be good however, is the ability to request a class from someone, they could give or not give then.
Maybe give a total time played for each player or something so that you could tell who was more "experienced" and therefore be able to make a more informed choice as to whether to request or give a class.
I absolutely hate unlocks. They never work on how good a player is, only how long they've played, and even if they did work on skill, it still wouldn't be fun to play, especially if you were the bets player and the only one allowed to play as the sniper or officer, constantly battling to get a higher score to keep it ... no, that's more gamey than I'm comfortable with, and restricting.
The thing is.. if you carefully read the first post of this thread it is not as simple as you think. If you are not scoring kills and you are not dying at the same time, you have no threat of someone taking over your class.
I also wondered why people on this forum think of SL as so important. When it comes to public play, no one cares what the SL orders. The only significance of this class is that they get smoke shells and binoculars.
I also wondered why people on this forum think of SL as so important. When it comes to public play, no one cares what the SL orders. The only significance of this class is that they get smoke shells and binoculars.
And as I said to another member who said this a couple of weeks ago, if that's what you believe then you don't understand the game at all.
The class can give orders, mark arty and call it, set rally points, tell the team where to attack and defend, they hold more capping power, and yes, they have smoke grenades and binocs.
And if you're on a map where the majority of other players actually do listen to the commander, like what I see often, if you don't go where everybody else is, then you're on your own and thus you risk getting killed more often.
Right now we have people complaining about not getting the classes they want and how there isn't any team work.... yet these same people scoff at the already existing elements in the game that provide these things like team work, clearly don't understand how the game works, and would much rather change the whole damn thing to something different because they can't be bothered to learn the game as it currently is.
And that's our fault?
And for the record, more often then not, I pick the commander class and find it's very useful, in fact more useful then your standard assault class or sapper class, since you have just as much fire power, a pistol, more capping power and can co-ordinate your team..... even if one or two don't want to play the game right and just think the commander is useless.
And if these people can't figure out this simple fact of the RO gameplay, then I sure as heck don't want them having the ability to shove me around in the game and tell me what class I can use or not when they obviously don't know the classes themselves.
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An average player who can keep a k/d of at least 1/3 is completely secure. If you join in the middle of the game, and the current SL's k/d is 1/10.. is it not logical that you should be given the option to take over? I think it is.
What lion said earlier is a good point: In RO:OST if you join later than others, you will never get to play as SL/Sniper no matter how good your progress is... and no matter how poor their progress is.
What lion said earlier is a good point: In RO:OST if you join later than others, you will never get to play as SL/Sniper no matter how good your progress is... and no matter how poor their progress is.
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Well you think it is, I don't.... since neither of us are in any position of authority on this matter, both are just opinions and thus cancelled out.
Agreed, but them's the breaks. And I know of plenty of people, including myself who never sticks to just on class per round. When I leave a sniper, commander or MG class, etc. I notify my team that those slots are available.
I think what would suit everybody's best interests would be to have an automatic notification come up on the screen somewhere to notify you of newly available class slots, so that you can change when you can change, rather then randomly looking in the menu to see if something is free, or to force someone out of their position simply because you don't like how they're playing or their ratio isn't to your liking.
It's a game, that everybody should be able to play equally no matter what their skill is. They paid for it just like everybody else and should be able to use it like everybody else. You take what is available or you can go to another server where you have the class you want.
Or as mentioned by others..... make a clan and play with people with common interests as you who will pick specific classes so everybody gets what they want.
These forums, the internet in general, and just about every single game server out there and video game are not Democracies, nor should they be, and unless it's a site/server administrator dictating their own rules, I am totally against the idea of other regular joe blow players like myself being able to force or dictate what other players can do or can't in a game they already paid for.
They paid to play a game with the available options given, they didn't pay for some other player who's in a stink to tell them what to do or to give up a class because they're not good enough, whether it's voted in by other players or if it's automated.
Practice Practice Practice..... you're never going to get good at the game or the class of your choice if everytime you get online and start doing bad suddenly forces you to be a mere rifleman everytime and thus you get nowhere fast.
I'm all for winning rounds and capping objectives, since it's the main part of the gameplay, but not every player out there is going to be equal in skill or know all the ins and outs of the game compared to those who've been playing it for years, and thus it'll be the new players who are handicapped by this idea and will not do anything to improve the community population.
The more punishments and penalties given in a game to slow your progression only take the fun out of the game and people will lose interest much faster, esspecially if they're punished almost everytime they play the game.
When I first started playing RO, I got slaughtered and I'd normally end up with more deaths then I did kills. It wasn't uncommon to end up with 2 points and 10 deaths, but I learned quickly from each death. I learned what worked and what didn't work in each class and weapon. You can't do this if you get booted out of your class after 3-4 deaths, esspecially if you have spawn campers or nade spammers bottlenecking you.
I personally just don't like the idea. Toss it in and see what happens. If I don't like it, then of course I won't play the game, it's as simple as that, like it is for every other game.
The thing you don't want to understand is:
People payed to play a game with the available options given, but they are not able to select that options, since to select that options you need FASTEST pc, compared to other players. It is discrimination by PC specs, which are not easy to change. Your suggestion "go buy some ram" is not part of a game. If system requirements are met - people should have same initial opportunities.
"everybody should be able to play equally".
You have to agree, that people are NOT able to play equally if they don't have top pc. Thats why you see topics like this about Class Selection mechanism. You have to check Americas Army weapon selection mechanism to see how it works. There are no "your class magically changed" thing because of well designed weapon selection system (similar to suggested system).
With suggested feature people will have same chances to select a weapon.
If they play well - they are rewarded by more options.
Everyone except you understand this.
Developers understand this as well.
"Heroes have access to the best and rarest weapons and equipment".
Regarding "Practice Practice Practice.....".
In RO you don't need to practice a lot to get many points. You need to capture objectives, you have to defend objectives, you have to support MG. You can have top points, but not killing a single enemy.
If you don't like scoring system - we can discuss it. It would be nice, if you could suggest BETTER scoring system, if you don't like current.
An error you do is you starting to criticize scoring system instead of weapon selection system.
You tell "officer class is important" but allowing newbies to play that class. thus, destroying gameplay of others.
Hey it's not my fault or anybody else's fault if you have a crappy and slow computer. Every other game I have played online that was a resource hog for me and everytime I ever complained about it, I was told to upgrade my system.
I got people in here telling me to get my head out of the past when it comes to some features from the mod, yet others in here think it's perfectly fine to keep an old computer and expect new or high resource games to work just fine on their systems and that's it's not their fault.
The problem with PC's is that everyone is somewhat different from the next..... but if you are using a 6 year old computer vs. my 1 year old computer and complaining I'm loading up faster.... that's exactly like complaining I'm using a PS3 while you're stuck with your PS2 because you can't be bothered to get with the times.
Once again, not my fault, not my problem. I paid to get my system up to spec to play the games I enjoy, I don't see why I should have to pamper and coddle other people who don't bother to do the same thing.
No I won't agree because as I already explained in the past, I toasted players on computers three times better then my own in the past. While everybody was using Pentium II's with high speed internet and fancy graphics during Team Fortress Classic/Half Life 1's prime years, I was using a Pentium I with the lowest video quality settings and resolutions, on a 33.6k modem..... and I still kicked most of their arses
I didn't complain then, I'm not going to complain now.... and back when the Mod was out and Ost just came out, my computer was about 5 years old and not the top of the line model anymore.... yet I still played, I still selected the classes available and I didn't moan about other people having better computers then I because that's just the way it is.
I already understand this just like everybody else apparently.... but just because I understand what you are saying, doesn't mean I'm going to agree with your idea.... which I don't.
I know full well what you want in the game, and I still don't like it. You can explain it as much and as long as you want until your ears bleed.... I don't like the idea, I never did, I probably never will.
That's my position and my reasons are as previously explained.
Which to me doesn't sound like a good feature, but we'll have to see exactly what they're planning to do in detail.
Do all of that by not killing a single enemy? I take it you assume the person doesn't get killed in the process from these enemies they're not shooting at? Good luck.
It's not about the points.... you keep going back to points in order to support your argument of a point-class re-classing system and determining who can play what based on their points/ratio.
I'm talking about tactics, which may or may not always include obtaining points, but generally helping out the team. You're not going to know how to defend or attack if you don't fire your weapons, which means you're not going to understand how to use the class properly, which means you're going to die more, which means you get booted out of that class because this systme determined you suck.
And how do you expect these people to get more points by capping/defending an objective with other classes other then riflemen if they're not allowed to use the other classes, their weapons and to know how to use them against real players?
I don't see you explaining this little problem except that they have to suffer and be stuck as a mere bolt for months on end while all the other players who already know how to play the game get to use all the more powerful classes and weapons.
Once again, it is not I who has a problem with the current point system.... I have a problem with what you want to turn the current point system into.
It is not I who is in error. I'm not criticizing the weapon selection system because I don't think there's a problem with it..... and I'm not criticizing the current scoring system either..... I am criticizing your idea of using the current scoring system to butcher the current weapon class system for your own benefit at the expense of new and un-experienced players because you don't like how they play and how they take your favorite toys away from you because you don't want to upgrade your computer.
The problem is, you don't know that do you?
They may be new to the game and not have much experience..... But I didn't have much experience either as a commander in BF2 or in RO, yet the commander class in BF2 was my best class and I organized the team very well. Same as in RO, I use my smoke grenades when needed, I issue out commands, I set rally points and arty marks and I help cap objectives with my team.
Give a new player a friggin chance to learn these things.... help them out by giving them pointers and tips.
That's the real problem in RO.... everybody complains there's no team work and players are idiots. They existed in the old days too, but the community was more open and a hell of a lot more friendlier then it is today it would seem. People didn't have problems giving new players the better classes and helping them along to figure out the game.
Now nobody gives a damn about helping out their team mates or new players and all they want to do is get more codes and programs in the game that help isolate them from other players and their failures or successes. They want to be able to select who they want to select, they want to be able to make people have their own reinforcement levels so they're not affected by their deaths..... people want one life only maps, make different levels of gameplay so new players can play on one server while better players play elsewhere.
All I see is more division in the RO community, more people seem to want to turn RO into the Killing Floor or Americas Army, or Call of Duty..... when RO should be friggin RO.
It seems the community that made Red Orchestra is no longer around and all I see now are people out for themselves and wanting the game to suit themselves, rather then the community as a whole.
Pretty sad times.
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Seems like there needs to be something like America’s where you pick a class buy rank. This would get more experienced players in to the classes that have the most effect on how the round will go. You can have other players apply for a class and if the higher rank player feels like it they can give it up. You would also need the ability to vote someone out of a class so they can’t just use rank to hog a class without fulfilling their roll. Lower rank players may not get to play every class right away but its better then the current situation where the fastest connection gets there pick of class and can lock it up the whole round. Didn’t even BF2 have a vote to boot the commander?
Amazing. You say "I understand" and perfectly show you are not by every single post. Now I will try to use your language for you for better understanding.
Hey it's not my fault or anybody else's fault if you have a crappy skill and you can't get points in game. Every other game I have played online I had access to every feature, if my minimum requirements were met.
Actually I have fast PC and I'm loading fast enought to get any weapon I want. Difference between me and you is, that I can see the problem with discrimination, but you are not.
Do you see difference between FAST and FASTER?
People could have no problem playing RO, everything is smooth, fps is high. But map load time is not low enough to select a weapon.
That is called "egoism". But did I say its your fault or your problem?
Why you refer to "I pay" so many times? Other people pay as well. And other people don't see why they should have pamper other people who has better pc than theirs.
You have to agree, that people are NOT able to play equally if they don't have top pc.
You did not get it.
By "play equally" I mean "play with same opportunities", "not having advantage by external things". A player can't have the same gameplay experience in RO if he is not able to select same weapons as you.
Is it clear now? Are you agree?
So your "toasting" does not matter here.
Your suggestion "Go buy some RAM" fixes the problem for one single person. Do we discuss one single person problem? Me personaly got no problems with weapon selection, since I'm loading early.
I'm happy you had no problems with selecting the classes available.
But you can't people force to have no problems with selecting the classes.
Sometimes you understand it wrong. Thats why I try to explain it to you with all possible ways. And I don't need you to agree with an idea.
I want a proper conversation from you. This was described here
Agree with you, you can like it, you can dislike it.
But do not use "i dislike it" as a proof for "idea is bad". As our discussion will turn to trolling.
For example:
- you run to obj
- start capping, captured, got 10 points
- died
- supplied MG, got points
- run to obj, captured, got 10 points.
You said:
Do you follow me?
Thats what i'm trying to achieve. Because in general, successful players has more points. I want to reward successful players. Current system is rewarding players based on their PC speed. Some people don't find it fair.
It looks you did not bother to read entire topic:
Let me explain weapon selection mechanism in Americas army game:
Class selection table looks like:
[1] Leader
[2] Leader of Fireteam A (with standart rifle and binocular).
[3] Regular soldier with standard rifle
[4] Regular soldier with standard rifle
[5] Machine gunner
[6] Leader of Fireteam B
[7] Regular soldier with standard rifle
[8] Grenadier
[9] Machine gunner
[10] Leader of Fireteam C (spotter)
[11] Sniper
Once you entered into Weapon Selection stage you are placed into a queue.
Your position in the queue is based on combination of your points, collected in previous rounds and your rank, collected during your overall play.
Weapon Selection stage occurs each X round, where X is configured by server admin. By default it is 7.
You are able to switch your class at any time, if that class is available.
You will spawn with that class in next round.
You are able to exchange your class with someone else, if both people agree to do it.
Speaking to you on your languange:
And how do you expect these people to get other classes other then riflemen if they're not allowed to use the other classes, since their pc specs are not highest on the server?
I don't see you explaining this little problem except that they have to suffer and be stuck as a rifleman forever, until their pc specs allows them to load faster than any other.
I'm not asking YOU to have problems, I'm not claiming YOU to have a problem. I'm claiming PEOPLE have a problem.
Soooo..... If we change our current scoring system - then new weapon system could work?
Why you mention "my own benefit"? I don't have problems selecting weapons. I have fast PC.
Oh sorry I forgot to use your language:
I am criticizing your points because by changing the system you will loose your favorite toys. You are using your benefits of fast pc in the current weapon selecting system at the expense of experienced players because you don't want to play better and smarter, and collect more points.
If you do what you say, then it means you are good officer. I don't mind you to play officer if you do your job well, even if I have more points.
If someone will ask me to try a weapon I could swap weapons, and a newbie will have a chance to try it.
Thats no problem, they have to ask. I don't have issues to swap my class with someone.
And hey, give a player with slow pc a friggin chance to use other weapons....
They want to be able to select who they want to select.
We want RO to have more OPTIONS. It will still be RO.
You have to check forum. These problems was discussed many times by many years. It is handy for you to reject it. I even posted a references to that threads, which was ignored by you.
How sad.
Hey it's not my fault or anybody else's fault if you have a crappy skill and you can't get points in game. Every other game I have played online I had access to every feature, if my minimum requirements were met.
Actually I have fast PC and I'm loading fast enought to get any weapon I want. Difference between me and you is, that I can see the problem with discrimination, but you are not.
Cpt-Praxius said:
Do you see difference between FAST and FASTER?
People could have no problem playing RO, everything is smooth, fps is high. But map load time is not low enough to select a weapon.
Cpt-Praxius said:
That is called "egoism". But did I say its your fault or your problem?
Why you refer to "I pay" so many times? Other people pay as well. And other people don't see why they should have pamper other people who has better pc than theirs.
You have to agree, that people are NOT able to play equally if they don't have top pc.
Cpt-Praxius said:
You did not get it.
By "play equally" I mean "play with same opportunities", "not having advantage by external things". A player can't have the same gameplay experience in RO if he is not able to select same weapons as you.
Is it clear now? Are you agree?
So your "toasting" does not matter here.
Your suggestion "Go buy some RAM" fixes the problem for one single person. Do we discuss one single person problem? Me personaly got no problems with weapon selection, since I'm loading early.
I'm happy you had no problems with selecting the classes available.
But you can't people force to have no problems with selecting the classes.
Cpt-Praxius said:
Sometimes you understand it wrong. Thats why I try to explain it to you with all possible ways. And I don't need you to agree with an idea.
I want a proper conversation from you. This was described here
Cpt-Praxius said:
Agree with you, you can like it, you can dislike it.
But do not use "i dislike it" as a proof for "idea is bad". As our discussion will turn to trolling.
Yes thats possible. Means you don't need to be a pro shooter.Cpt-Praxius said:
For example:
- you run to obj
- start capping, captured, got 10 points
- died
- supplied MG, got points
- run to obj, captured, got 10 points.
Cpt-Praxius said:
You said:
By saying this, you mean that "current point system is not determining how good someone is or not". If we will use logic to continue, than we can assume, that "by changing current point system we could have point based weapon selecting mechanism working".Cpt-Praxius said:
Do you follow me?
Cpt-Praxius said:
Thats what i'm trying to achieve. Because in general, successful players has more points. I want to reward successful players. Current system is rewarding players based on their PC speed. Some people don't find it fair.
It looks you did not bother to read entire topic:
Let me explain weapon selection mechanism in Americas army game:
Class selection table looks like:
[1] Leader
[2] Leader of Fireteam A (with standart rifle and binocular).
[3] Regular soldier with standard rifle
[4] Regular soldier with standard rifle
[5] Machine gunner
[6] Leader of Fireteam B
[7] Regular soldier with standard rifle
[8] Grenadier
[9] Machine gunner
[10] Leader of Fireteam C (spotter)
[11] Sniper
Once you entered into Weapon Selection stage you are placed into a queue.
Your position in the queue is based on combination of your points, collected in previous rounds and your rank, collected during your overall play.
Weapon Selection stage occurs each X round, where X is configured by server admin. By default it is 7.
You are able to switch your class at any time, if that class is available.
You will spawn with that class in next round.
You are able to exchange your class with someone else, if both people agree to do it.
Cpt-Praxius said:
Speaking to you on your languange:
And how do you expect these people to get other classes other then riflemen if they're not allowed to use the other classes, since their pc specs are not highest on the server?
I don't see you explaining this little problem except that they have to suffer and be stuck as a rifleman forever, until their pc specs allows them to load faster than any other.
Cpt-Praxius said:
I'm not asking YOU to have problems, I'm not claiming YOU to have a problem. I'm claiming PEOPLE have a problem.
Cpt-Praxius said:
Soooo..... If we change our current scoring system - then new weapon system could work?
Why you mention "my own benefit"? I don't have problems selecting weapons. I have fast PC.
Oh sorry I forgot to use your language:
I am criticizing your points because by changing the system you will loose your favorite toys. You are using your benefits of fast pc in the current weapon selecting system at the expense of experienced players because you don't want to play better and smarter, and collect more points.
Cpt-Praxius said:
If you do what you say, then it means you are good officer. I don't mind you to play officer if you do your job well, even if I have more points.
If someone will ask me to try a weapon I could swap weapons, and a newbie will have a chance to try it.
Cpt-Praxius said:
Thats no problem, they have to ask. I don't have issues to swap my class with someone.
And hey, give a player with slow pc a friggin chance to use other weapons....
They want to be able to select who they want to select.
Cpt-Praxius said:
We want RO to have more OPTIONS. It will still be RO.
Cpt-Praxius said:
You have to check forum. These problems was discussed many times by many years. It is handy for you to reject it. I even posted a references to that threads, which was ignored by you.
How sad.
The commander yes, but nothing else. (Well I think there was a vote kick off the server as well, but not out of class)
In BF2, it didn't force the person to change class, it just forced them out of the commander slot so someone else could apply for it and that person could still continue playing the game with the same life and class they picked.
Not exactly the same thing and would be a bit difficult to impliment into RO since the commander slot is an actual class, which means the person would have to be force killed and then pick a class, or forced to pick a class on his next death.
The main problem I see with more voting options (besides map and cheater-kick voting) is that I already see many players spend the whole round trying to vote-kick someone out of the round and when it fails, they keep doing it.
There already seems to be a big stink over people wanting certain classes over other players and I think a vote system would only end up like the above, with multiple people trying to vote-kick multiple other people out of their classes, only to then have the kicked people try and vote themselves back in.
If I was going to bend on my position then the bend would come from an automated system. I am not for a system that allows other players to vote/determine what other plays can or can't do and opens up the possibility of vote wars in game over classes.
If it is automated then nobody can really bicker.
Solution for Automation:
Rather then having people vote and kill more game time through these things, do the ratio thing but make sure it's a decent ratio to give someone a chance. Once that ratio sways to the way of you sucking, then after your last death, you are automatically taken out of class and you have the option to choose from any available classes at the time.
This way people are not automatically tossed in as a rifleman if other classes are available, and nobody can hold onto a class through the whole round if they're really bad, thus giving people a chance to have the role they want, even if they come into the game late.
..... and you don't have your screen filled with multiple Yes/No votes for multiple players all the time. Afterall, unless you're paying more attention to what your other team mates are doing then what you are doing, you'd never know if they're playing bad or not...... and if someone isn't getting points, but doing good suppression of the enemy, then the automated system could give them a bit more slack compared to antsy players who just want their MP41.
Thoughts? Improvements?
Wow, Cpt-Praxius started to do suggestions, regarding class switching mechanism! Bingo.
Now to the suggestion:
That will lead to situation, when you will not have an officer at all.
Current officer could be sucking, but it is always better, than no officer at all.
Since he could use the smoke properly, making rally points, communicating with team, etc.
As soon, as team decide he is not doing his job well enough, someone should have an option to swap his class to officer. Then, current officer should loose his class after death.
This leaves the place for new players, who want to try any class, if they load fast enough to select that class first.
Now to the suggestion:
Cpt-Praxius said:
That will lead to situation, when you will not have an officer at all.
Current officer could be sucking, but it is always better, than no officer at all.
Since he could use the smoke properly, making rally points, communicating with team, etc.
As soon, as team decide he is not doing his job well enough, someone should have an option to swap his class to officer. Then, current officer should loose his class after death.
This leaves the place for new players, who want to try any class, if they load fast enough to select that class first.
I could live with that. Say someone else could pick the class over you if you drop below a ratio/effectiveness point. Players could still be that class but if someone else wants it they can grab it.
I still think there should be an option to vote someone out of a class( or at least open it up). It should at least be an option for a sever. I haven't seen to many vote to kicks and i think it has to do with me always wanting to be on a server that has active admins that don't allow it. I have a feeling that everyone will find the severs they like. My buddies and I are already talking about renting a server and would definitely like as many options as possible.