Changing Player Heal Mechanics

[OCAdam]

What if every medgun's heal would consume 100 heal-points, instead of 50?

Okay, that'd be interesting to see how that works. Actually... combine this with the medguns all sharing a pool with the syringe, but keep the syringe at only 50 per heal. Now you have incentive to use the syringe while keeping the medguns for the ranged 'oh crap need to heal that guy' moments.

 

[poosh]

Okay, that'd be interesting to see how that works. Actually... combine this with the medguns all sharing a pool with the syringe, but keep the syringe at only 50 per heal. Now you have incentive to use the syringe while keeping the medguns for the ranged 'oh crap need to heal that guy' moments.

... and nobody will use Medic perk ever. I don't get it: Medic is most useless perk in vanilla game, but you guys want to nerf it...

 

[Spicy]

... and nobody will use Medic perk ever. I don't get it: Medic is most useless perk in vanilla game, but you guys want to nerf it...

Because the Medic is clearly too good at its intended role of healing. It's probably unfair to the other perks that aren't naturally as good at healing as the medic is.

 

[poosh]

Medic is especially good at pointless healing dart spamming

 

[ChronoLogic]

... and nobody will use Medic perk ever. I don't get it: Medic is most useless perk in vanilla game, but you guys want to nerf it...

Nerfing the entire heal system* to make Medic more useful/valued.

 

[Azukki]

Nerfing self heals sounds good, but only five of them is taking it a little too far. Maybe start with 10?
Nerfing darts could be okay. Extra motivation to carry a loadout full of medic guns sounds good.
Nerfing team heals with the syringe, that's just an awful idea, I think.

 

[nuclearneo577]

Nerfing the entire heal system* to make Medic more useful/valued.

Because limiting healing for Medic and limiting it even more for everyone else is totally a Medic buff. Limiting self heals would be a bad idea too, mainly because nobody ever heals the Medic.

 

[ChronoLogic]

Because limiting healing for Medic and limiting it even more for everyone else is totally a Medic buff.

Did I ever say I was "buffing" anything? It makes the team rely more on the Medic. Atm, players seem to opt for more firepower over a Medic since they can heal themselves/eachother indefinitely.

Limiting self heals would be a bad idea too, mainly because nobody ever heals the Medic.

From my experience, the team heals whoever needs to be healed. That includes the Medic. If the teams back where you play do not, this change will force teamwork amongst yourselves.

 

[Undedd Jester]

... and nobody will use Medic perk ever. I don't get it: Medic is most useless perk in vanilla game, but you guys want to nerf it...

A small story of way back when...

I remember when the M7A3 was added as a mod, and the MP7M was still the only Medic gun we had in the game. A number of people recommended that the M7A3 be added permanently, but the subject fell into alot of heated discussion.

Most of us seasoned Medics accepted the use of the Mp7M, because the biggest problem we faced as a medic was trying to run after people to heal them. Although in my mind the Mp7 made the game a little too easy and kinda boring sometimes when things were quiet, it did away nicely with that little problem, and when **** really hit the fan, swapping rapidly between weapons did create a real rush of excitement. So noone really minded the Mp7M.

The big concern with the M7A3 is that by giving the Medic 2 healing guns he would be able to constantly spam darts, making the medics job less about accuracy, predicitng damage and quick reactions, and more about just clicking alt fire all day long. The idea to give them the same recharge pool was a seriously considered suggestion. Then ofc the MP5 was added with the M7A3 shortly afterwards, without any of that discussion being considered, and hey ho what do you know, all medic is is a dart spam bot.

However the real crap hurler was the bloody medic grenades, which to be honest was the straw that broke my back and made me quit the game. At least the other guns I could ignore and choose not to use, but I had no choice with the medic nades. I raged so hard it turned me from the die hard KF fan who always backed TWI no matter what, to the pissing, moaning, sarcastic, can't leave it the **** alone, surly forum grump that I am today.




Anyway onto the point - I'm not for one second singling the Medic out. If the decision were left to me every perk in the game would be up for the chopping block in 1 way or another. Fact is this game has gone from a game that required wits, planning and tactics to beat, to simply buying the biggest gun you can and melting things. There is nothing rewarding or interesting about it anymore, its now become just another generic shooter. Every perk in the game needs SOMETHING doing to it to make people acutally have to think again.

Except maybe the Demo. God Bless his lack of updates.

 

[becoming-insane]

A small story of way back when...

I fully agree with you. I was disappointed too when MP5 was added to the game and I found out that both medguns have their own recharge pool.

And medic nades... It's so "fun" to watch how 3 fleshpounds are afraid to cross the green smoke while the team is shooting them.

Survival Horror, yeah right.

 

[Spicy]

However the real crap hurler was the bloody medic grenades, which to be honest was the straw that broke my back and made me quit the game. At least the other guns I could ignore and choose not to use, but I had no choice with the medic nades. I raged so hard it turned me from the die hard KF fan who always backed TWI no matter what, to the pissing, moaning, sarcastic, can't leave it the **** alone, surly forum grump that I am today.

Duh, just don't hit your grenade key. You're a medic, you don't need frag nades.

 

[poosh]

Imo medic nades shouldn't hurt zeds at all. Maybe even they should heal them too as well And no fear factor, that's for sure.

 

[poosh]

I'll try to explain how healing mechanics works. Maybe then you'll change your mind on your suggestion.

Here are general facts:

• There is no instant healing at all. Healing points are added to the "healing pool", not to the player's health directly.
• Health restore rate, i.e. transfer rate from healing pool to player's health, is constant no matter are you a medic or not, and is equal to 10 hp/s. Medic can't heal faster, he can only make more healing injections (and that's ridiculous imo).
• No overheal. Health + HealingPool <= MaxHealth. Always! For example, if player has 75hp and received 35hp healing injection, only 25hp will be added to healing pool (100-75). Even if player immediately takes damages after that and will be able to receive full healing - remainder will be lost anyway.
• Every damage player takes additionally decreases healing pool by 5hp, including fire DoT, Bloat's bile and (!) zero-damage. So even if friendly fire is turned off, you can drain your teammate's healing pool anyway. This, however, doesn't work in case of bullet fire, because bullets don't call TakeDamage() of teammate at all. But fire, explosives or melee weapons do the trick. So if you want your wounded teammate be dead (cuz he acts retarded or you're just a dick), continuously hit him with a knife to stop his healing. This fact must be taken seriously in Berserker+Medic+Firebug team. If zerker runs into zed crowd, but firebug spams flamer around him, he also drains zerker's healing pool, and Medic can't help with anything in this case. Zerker certainly gonna die in such cases.
• Each received healing lowers player burn duration twice, even if player has 100% health or full healing pool already. After taking a Husk shot player burns 5 times with 1.5 second interval between each burn. Shooting him twice with medic darts stops burning after the next burn (5/2=2, 2/2=1).

Example #1. Player has 80hp. Level 6 Medic shoots at him with MP5 dart, which can restore up to 52hp (30*1.75). Only 20hp will be added to the healing pool. Immediately after healing received players takes 2 hits from Crawlers, 10dp each on HoE. Player's health drops down to 60hp, healing pool - down to 10 (20 - 2*5). In the result player will have 70hp after the end of the healing. Not a big deal with the current game rules - Medic just shoots one more dart. But if amount of darts will be limited? Then it will be better to replace Medic with Commando, which kills Crawlers around the player first and heals in a spare time - only one off-perk syringe injection is needed to restore HP from 80 to 100. Beside that, it could lead to the situation like "You aren't so badly hurt to waste my dart on you. Take some more damage."

Example #2. Player got hit by a Husk and starts burning. He is supposed to kill that Husk, but now he can't see the **** due to flames, especially if that player is a sharpshooter and must aim to the head. Fast shooting him with 2 medic darts stops burning and makes player able to aim again. After that you'll be supposed to make 1 more healing, because last burn damage will be applied before the burning stops. Once again, currently it isn't a problem, because Medic has infinite number of darts. If that number will be limited, then it will be better to kill Husk first and only then take care of healing, to save some darts. Or maybe player dies until that moment, and you will be able save even more darts But if you are supposed to shoot instead of heal, why would you choose the Medic perk in a first place?..


Conclusion
With current game mechanics, limiting amount of healing won't make Medic more useful, it will make Medic even more useless. If you're limited in amount of healing, the best way to save it is to take less damage. Better defense is a better offence, don't listen to Dr. Zed in the case of KF
Your idea is interesting, but it doesn't fits into KF. To implement this right, all healing/damaging mechanics must be reworked. And doing so for just an idea, even interesting, but totally useless, is ridiculous, especially then there are plenty of more important issues in the game right now.

 

[Tenska]

Self-heal could be limited in co-op. Maybe all healing, would boost the need of medic...but when your playing with one or two friends. It would be a huge problem.

 

[Spicy]

Then it will be better to replace Medic with Commando, which kills Crawlers around the player first and heals in a spare time - only one off-perk syringe injection is needed to restore HP from 80 to 100. Beside that, it could lead to the situation like "You aren't so badly hurt to waste my dart on you. Take some more damage."

I've found that to be the point where poop hits the fan and someone dies. I suppose it's somewhat comforting to know how easily healing a teammate can be effed over.