Are you confirming that points never count for victory in the new CD mode???, or do you say that you think it should not count for victory? I'm a bit confused.
CD is Dead !?
- Thread starter 1conu59
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I fall into the category of people who don't understand why the time of the last objective should matter more than the rest. To me it seems like it would create a false sense of hope for mismatched teams, making for drawn out matches where you know that one team is going to win or lose anyway. You still had the same problem before, but at least then you knew the game was over after a certain amount of time. Now it seems pointless (or rather predetermined) matches can drag on and on.
It seems an effort was made to make the winning conditions more apparent for inexperienced or new players,but aren't the new rules even more confusing; when mostly cap time doesn't matter but at some point suddenly winning or losing the game depends on it? Not to mention it would be nearly impossible to know at which point you're going to lose momentum, and the captime of the previous objective will determine the outcome.
I have to stress that I have yet to try the new changes as of yet. But part of the reason why I like CD is that you don't have to play a lost cause for 40 minutes like you often times have to in TE post Lockdown. Which also promotes teamwork as just sitting put and racking up kills would get you nowhere.
It seems an effort was made to make the winning conditions more apparent for inexperienced or new players,but aren't the new rules even more confusing; when mostly cap time doesn't matter but at some point suddenly winning or losing the game depends on it? Not to mention it would be nearly impossible to know at which point you're going to lose momentum, and the captime of the previous objective will determine the outcome.
I have to stress that I have yet to try the new changes as of yet. But part of the reason why I like CD is that you don't have to play a lost cause for 40 minutes like you often times have to in TE post Lockdown. Which also promotes teamwork as just sitting put and racking up kills would get you nowhere.
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You change CD with the opinion of "Beta tester" but which beta tester have more experience of the game than that ?!
I seriously think about to stop Ro2 Sorry but i cant support more witchers who change gameplay and mode every time...
the old update was perfect for Realism and CD... There were no need to change just correct some bug.
You change every variable but we work very hard since a long time...
I seriously think about to stop Ro2 Sorry but i cant support more witchers who change gameplay and mode every time...
the old update was perfect for Realism and CD... There were no need to change just correct some bug.
You change every variable but we work very hard since a long time...
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Yoshiro, with all due respect this is the most awful thing that could have been conceived... from every standpoint (competitive, public, etc.).
If a team does such good work to cap the 1st point in 1 minute, the 2nd in 1 minute, the 3rd in 1 minute and then the 4th in 2:30, it really should reflect TOTAL time. The other team should then have to complete the 4th cap by 5:29 or lose.
Even if they cap the first in 1:20, the second in 1:20, the third in 1:20 and the 4th in 1:00 (total = 4:20).
AND
Even if they cap the first in 40s, the second in 1:00, the third in 1:00 and the 4th in 2:35 (total = 5:25).
For instance like Abomolith mentions I recall one PUG match last night where we started off attacking and absolutely tore through the caps. We probably capped each of the first three caps in under a minute for each. However, when the teams switched, they had 2 minutes on the timer for each cap.
Now is this a bug? Can we get a pure definition on the new rules of countdown -- because, as it was played last night it was the saddest thing I've ever seen in what once was a wonderfully dynamic and talent-based gametype.
Now, to be honest, with all of the weight on ONE CAP, it's not worth playing. We might as well throw a few quarters in the air and call for heads or tails.
Nothing was wrong with the way countdown was conducted previously. The only thing that could make it better was to make it pure stopwatch mode (total time for total cap). I would be happy to explain the rules for that, but I'm sure you guys already know.
Basically, the attackers should set a time and number of caps. If the first attacking team gets through all of the caps in 5:15 seconds, then the next team needs to cap all of the caps in 5:14 or lose.
If the first team caps 3 caps in 4:00 but cannot capture the 4th point then the next team must only cap the 4th point to win (regardless of total time). The other way they can win is to cap the 3rd point in 3:59 or less.
IT really is THAT simple.
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I understand but disagree. In many ways the focus for CD is not on time at all, but simply on capping the objectives. 99% of the time matches are won or lost because one team capped more objectives than the other, not because the final cap times were different. I view the timer for the final cap as a tiebreaker sort of thing, if the teams are equal enough to reach the same objective then whoever caps it fastest wins.
So far I'm loving the new CD, as are most of the people I'm playing with.
So far I'm loving the new CD, as are most of the people I'm playing with.
If that's the case, why wouldn't the overall cap time be the tiebreaker? I really don't understand the reasoning behind making only the last cap count, besides making the outcome of any given game more random.
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Look into true stopwatch. It provides for what you deem to be the most important aspect while not making the previous caps irrelevant.
For instance, if a team caps the first cap in 40 seconds and the next team caps it in 2:59, I'm sorry, but they should have to account for that defecit for the rest of the match (while still having a chance to win), otherwise, simply-stated, they ARE NOT the better team.
QUOTE=Phenix:
1) Why it's important to capture the last point faster than the other team and not the rest of the points ? Where is the logic ?
We are talking about 3 minute rounds. In the grand scheme of a battle, a 3 minute firefight vs. a 2 minute one matters very little. The last rounds time matters ONLY as a tie breaker. In most matches, one team progresses further than the other. Please also note that teams that were able to save re-enforcement waves from previous rounds for the last round, generally get a better time and win the tie-breaker. The new system is basically simplified and easy to follow. "beat the last round in less then 2:12 is a more understandable goal than "beat all rounds with a combined time of 0:44 seconds or greater remaining". Clearly defined goals are key to a good competitive game.
2) There is on the map, Station for exemple, a russian soldier and a german soldier. The german is attacking the first point and the russian is defending.
* If the russian is outside of the point and he kills the german who is also outside of the point, the russian wins 1 point for kill(Table score)
* If the russian is outside of the point, and he kills the german who is on the point, the russian wins 1 point for kill + 3 points for defending zone
* If the russian is on the point and he kills the german who is outside of the point, he wins 1 point for kill and 3 points for defending zone.
* If the russian is on the point and he kills the german who is also on the point, he wins 1 point for kill and 6 points for defending zone.
Finally, if there is an equality, it's your score in your table score which is important. So i fear that ambushes outside of the point are finished. And when you resupply the machingunner, you win 5 points again and it could be determined for the final results
What are you talking about here? Points don't break the tie. It's silly that farming "MG resupplies" can win you a match. The new system relies on skills, tactics and possibly saving a reenforcement wave for the last cap to break the tie. The old system was almost random.
Sorry but i'm skeptical.
Contrary, the fact that, defend can't see the reinforcements seems to be a good change. Black fade out between each point is a good thing too. The HUD is clear and useful for the beginners.
Just play it a bit. How you win and lose is much more clear making the mode more welcoming to new players and streamlined for old fans.
1) Why it's important to capture the last point faster than the other team and not the rest of the points ? Where is the logic ?
We are talking about 3 minute rounds. In the grand scheme of a battle, a 3 minute firefight vs. a 2 minute one matters very little. The last rounds time matters ONLY as a tie breaker. In most matches, one team progresses further than the other. Please also note that teams that were able to save re-enforcement waves from previous rounds for the last round, generally get a better time and win the tie-breaker. The new system is basically simplified and easy to follow. "beat the last round in less then 2:12 is a more understandable goal than "beat all rounds with a combined time of 0:44 seconds or greater remaining". Clearly defined goals are key to a good competitive game.
2) There is on the map, Station for exemple, a russian soldier and a german soldier. The german is attacking the first point and the russian is defending.
* If the russian is outside of the point and he kills the german who is also outside of the point, the russian wins 1 point for kill(Table score)
* If the russian is outside of the point, and he kills the german who is on the point, the russian wins 1 point for kill + 3 points for defending zone
* If the russian is on the point and he kills the german who is outside of the point, he wins 1 point for kill and 3 points for defending zone.
* If the russian is on the point and he kills the german who is also on the point, he wins 1 point for kill and 6 points for defending zone.
Finally, if there is an equality, it's your score in your table score which is important. So i fear that ambushes outside of the point are finished. And when you resupply the machingunner, you win 5 points again and it could be determined for the final results
What are you talking about here? Points don't break the tie. It's silly that farming "MG resupplies" can win you a match. The new system relies on skills, tactics and possibly saving a reenforcement wave for the last cap to break the tie. The old system was almost random.
Sorry but i'm skeptical.
Contrary, the fact that, defend can't see the reinforcements seems to be a good change. Black fade out between each point is a good thing too. The HUD is clear and useful for the beginners.
Just play it a bit.
How you win and lose is much more clear making the mode more welcoming to new players and streamlined for old fans.
A team performing poorly usually wastes more Reenforcement waves. A great team might have some left on the last cap allowing them to rush in and respawn. The "deficit" lies in the reenforcements. Please also note that capping a point in Overtime is undesireable, but if a team pulls it off, they shouldn't be penalized. Even though every second isn't counted in your final score, time still matters. If you don't cap in 3 minutes, you lose.
Please also note that capping the first point in 40 seconds vs. 2:59 MAY actually matter. What if both teams then don't cap the second point? Team one wins thanks to their speed!
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The problem is that the first team would never know when they're not going to manage to capture the next objective. Which essentially makes the first team have to scurry for all objectives (if they comprehend the new winning conditions), and the second team can just take all objectives at their own pace until the last objective the other team capped. Having the last objective's cap time as a tiebreaker doesn't make any sense to me as opposed to counting the total time.A team performing poorly usually wastes more Reenforcement waves. A great team might have some left on the last cap allowing them to rush in and respawn. The "deficit" lies in the reenforcements. Please also note that capping a point in Overtime is undesireable, but if a team pulls it off, they shouldn't be penalized. Even though every second isn't counted in your final score, time still matters. If you don't cap in 3 minutes, you lose.
Please also note that capping the first point in 40 seconds vs. 2:59 MAY actually matter. What if both teams then don't cap the second point? Team one wins thanks to their speed!
I still haven't played the mode post update, so I might be missing something.
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QUOTE=greenlemonade
What are you talking about here? Points don't break the tie. It's silly that farming "MG resupplies" can win you a match.
Yoshiro has already answered to this question. And he said that point counts if no objectives are captured at all. But it is finally logic.
The new system relies on skills, tactics and possibly saving a reenforcement wave for the last cap to break the tie. The old system was almost random.
You speak about skills and tactics ? Do you realy think that the old one did'nt need these things ? I can show you 6 months of trainaing and the results of my team in CD Match, and then, tell me what is random ? (green=victory / orange=equality / defeat)
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Stop saying anything just to defend the new CD. I do not criticize it for fun, just to note what seems to be errors for me.
And for Yoshiro, i would like to know, if it's possible to desactivate the automatic reinforcement ? Because, when we are playing it's not usefull to have to click on F5...
Yours faithfully.
What are you talking about here? Points don't break the tie. It's silly that farming "MG resupplies" can win you a match.
Yoshiro has already answered to this question. And he said that point counts if no objectives are captured at all. But it is finally logic.
The new system relies on skills, tactics and possibly saving a reenforcement wave for the last cap to break the tie. The old system was almost random.
You speak about skills and tactics ? Do you realy think that the old one did'nt need these things ? I can show you 6 months of trainaing and the results of my team in CD Match, and then, tell me what is random ? (green=victory / orange=equality / defeat)
Stop saying anything just to defend the new CD
. I do not criticize it for fun, just to note what seems to be errors for me.And for Yoshiro, i would like to know, if it's possible to desactivate the automatic reinforcement ? Because, when we are playing it's not usefull to have to click on F5...
Yours faithfully.
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there is no long discourse to have!
here it is only a problem of principle!
You do not change the rules of the game just before the release of TWILadder!
We want to recover the exact same game before the update or nothing. This conscerne Cd as well as various modifications as to Realism!
Leave the old CD a baptism of fire!
It was perfect !
Do you want proof of our experience in Cd ?
http://gfa.xooit.fr/t428-Calendrier-et-Resulltat-des-matchs.htm
We fights against every teams which play CD mode !
So the question is do you follow the way of people which dont play CD mode in the past or your old Cd fans ?
here it is only a problem of principle!
You do not change the rules of the game just before the release of TWILadder!
We want to recover the exact same game before the update or nothing. This conscerne Cd as well as various modifications as to Realism!
Leave the old CD a baptism of fire!
It was perfect !
Do you want proof of our experience in Cd ?
http://gfa.xooit.fr/t428-Calendrier-et-Resulltat-des-matchs.htm
We fights against every teams which play CD mode !
So the question is do you follow the way of people which dont play CD mode in the past or your old Cd fans ?
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With the way CD was changed I don't see it being played competitively at all. Like others have said we did a 8v8 or so and the way the timer was done really took away from the whole game. I don't think I will participate in the Twi ladder if CD is to stay this way. Keep Cd the way it was as far as how it functions or do the stopwatch like traxx said. The logic behind the new system is crazy.
I think that the people who voted for the new CD didn't actaully play CD before they voted either. Or they voted and aren't even serious about the game mode. I say crazy once again. Don't shaft us old CD players to gain new ones that probably won't stick around very long for the game mode.
Once again if Cd is going to be in twi ladder then it would play much better in the previous state or in stopwatch form.
Agree 100%
I think that the people who voted for the new CD didn't actaully play CD before they voted either. Or they voted and aren't even serious about the game mode. I say crazy once again. Don't shaft us old CD players to gain new ones that probably won't stick around very long for the game mode.
Once again if Cd is going to be in twi ladder then it would play much better in the previous state or in stopwatch form.
Agree 100%
Is anybody could tell me where can i found a player's topic that he ask for changing CD mod ?
I found no topic about this, so why should we participate to the beta if nobody is asking about changements ?
It doesn't make sens, the community did'nt ask this to TWI.
And they put more bugs now...
The countdown feedback can be found here: http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=83120
--SNIP--
Stop saying anything just to defend the new CD
--SNIP--
This is a public thread. Any member can reply to it as long as it is civil. You are allowed to speak out about what you dislike. Even so are others allowed to speak out the opposite. Accept it!
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Stop saying anything just to defend the new CD
And for Yoshiro, i would like to know, if it's possible to desactivate the automatic reinforcement ? Because, when we are playing it's not usefull to have to click on F5...
Yours faithfully.
I'm not defending the new CD for no freaking reason. I'm defending it because I feel its better. The old CD left players feeling far too rushed. Time was much more important in the old version. Now it doesn't come into play as much. It's more fun to be able to choose when to move in and attack without the clock dictating your actions so much. And yes, points come into play if both teams don't capture any objectives, but this hardly ever happens. Especially considering both teams have reenforcements when attacking.
Speaking from some experience with the new CD, aside from the glitches that are still occurring
, I love the changes. It is a more enjoyable experience that allows for more diverse tactics. Not just speed rushes to get the best times. It's also more forgiving. A team can have a slow round and recover a lot more often than before which is a good thing. It creates more interesting, close matches.Above all things, the new CD is simpler and easier to understand.