Bolt handles and ejection ports (and other stupidity)

[skypirate]

Well, not in RO. But you'll see how this relates in a sec.

For those of you who have played counterstrike, battlefield, black, and other war games... What's the whole deal with the bolt handle and ejection port being on the LEFT side of the weapon? AK-47s, M-16s, M-4s... WRONG, WRONG, WRONG.

WHY DO THE GAME MAKERS MAKE THIS BLATANTLY OBVIOUS MISTAKE?!?!

The bolt handles and ejection ports are supposed to be on the RIGHT side of the weapon. This is mainly so that a right-handed shooter doesn't have hot ejected cartridges flying in front of or into his face.

The funny thing is that the player in all of those games IS right handed (shoulders weapon on his right shoulder). Do the game makers think that it looks cooler to have cartridges flying all over the screen, despite the lack of realism?

THANK YOU, staff of RO, for respecting realism and modeling weapons correctly. We appreciate it. Only little noob kiddies prefer unrealistic weapons with "shellz spray1ng everywhere lolz."

 

[Mobius One]

Not exactly RO related, but I shall add to this topic.

A lot of games do that, I suppose just for the sole factor of letting the player see bullets shell casings flying around the screen. I don't really mind myself if a game has incorrect bolts or ejection sides.

 

[skypirate]

That's what I think too. But it really kills the immersion. I prefer combat simulators like RO rather than games like battlefield. I love realism and that's why I love RO. If I want to play a first-person shooter GAME then I'll play Halo.

 

[EvilAmericanMan]

The reason they are backwards in CS is because the modeller prefers modelling left-handed, and then he just mirrors them for right-handed views. It's CS, why would they care about any sort of realism?

 

[K.Johansen]

No. I l1ke shellz spray1ng everywhere! Real1sm sux lolz!

 

[Lonyo]

"I'm left handed, motherfucker"

 

[Moe_Rahn]

The reason they are backwards in CS is because the modeller prefers modelling left-handed, and then he just mirrors them for right-handed views.

Yeah, I can remember back in the olden days of the CS betas, the weapon models were only left-handed, and they all looked fine. When they put the right-handed ones in, instead of remodeling everything, they just mirrored them, and the rest is history. To this day, I still only use left-handed models in CS and CS Source, because I'm left-handed myself, and they're the correct-looking ones.

 

[skypirate]

Go to any army. Russian, German, American, Syrian, Iraqi, British, Israeli, whatever. The infantry weapon you will be issued will have the bolt handle and ejection port on the right side.

While there are special left-handed versions of weapons, these are EXTREMELY rare. For example, I have yet to see a single picture of a lefty AK-47 (and I've seen hundreds if not thousands of AK pictures).

But I suppose every soldier in counterstrike was issued a specialized left-handed weapon, despite all of the players shouldering the weapon on their right side?

It's a mistake, plain and simple. The game developers decided that shells ejected all over the screen looked cooler and were willing to sacrifice realism for what they thought looked cool. But there's nothing cool about a weapon that is plain wrong. How about you turn the AK-47 into a plasma rifle while you're at it?

 

[Moe_Rahn]

But I suppose every soldier in counterstrike was issued a specialized left-handed weapon, despite all of the players shouldering the weapon on their right side?

Not if you use the "correct" left-handed models, which have the player using a normal, right-handed weapon from the left shoulder (which, with many of them, would normally get you hot brass sprayed in your face, but that's another story).

 

[skypirate]

"I'm left handed, motherfucker"

Well accept the fact that you are a minority. Guns are designed for right handed people who are the majority. Lefties can still use them, it's just a bit less ergonomic. But I wish game developers would stop trying to make a universe where all guns are fictional lefty versions used by right-handed people. That's just absurd.

 

[sharpshooterklj]

I guess I'm a strange commodity, because I always have my unrealistic guns on the right side of my screen, or else it looks wierd. I just so happen to be a left-handed shooter in RL though. I do agree that having the bolts on the wrong side of a weapon is pretty lame, and I'll put money on it that they just did that so it looks cool. Also, has anybody noticed that the dirt flap on the CSS M-4 goes up and down after each shot? In reality the dust flap comes down and stays down once you fire it, unless you manually snap it back up. And as for the hot shells spraying in my face, only one gun does that to me and that's my Rugger 10/22. My other guns, M-4, AK-47, 30-06, .270 Safari, et cetera don't eject the shells into my face, thankfully.

 

[Mobius One]

Well accept the fact that you are a minority. Guns are designed for right handed people who are the majority. Lefties can still use them, it's just a bit less ergonomic.

Especially if you want to get those bolt-action rifles, it'll be a ***** to find left-handed versions.

Then again, if you can somehow acquire a Steyr AUG, that's an ambidextrous gun for you.

 

[skypirate]

Actually, the only lefty gun I've ever seen in a gun shop was a bolt-action Remington 700. Of course, it's a civilian rifle and Remington wants to cater to the lefties in the civilian market (because otherwise a lefty would buy from someone else).

The military is different though. Soldiers don't have a choice. All of the weapons are designed for right-handed soldiers. If they are lefty, tough luck.

Things may change in the future though. Some modern military weapons are ambidextrous, such as the P-90, which ejects shells DOWN instead of right or left.

 

[Coey]

It's a purely aesthetic feature, because seeing shell casings flying across the screen is cool. IMO game developers can afford to make this tiny mistake that hardly anyone will notice and hardly anyone will care about.

 

[sharpshooterklj]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention bolt actions. Those things are a *****. After every shot, you gotta take the gun down, move your trigger hand to the forward stock, and use your right hand to operate the bolt. If I'd ever buy a manually operated gun, it'd be a lever action.

 

[Byte Me]

For non bolt-action rifles, it is mostly due to the fact that the cocking handle is usually on the same side as the ejection port (like the AK47) and it would look even more wierd to have the cocking handle and ejection on opposite sides if they aren't IRL (like the FN FAL is, though it the only rifle of I can think of off the top of my head that is like that so it is a pretty rare design). Though weapons designed for right handed people only is a trend that is changing. The previously mentioned P90 ejects cases from the bottom, the G36 has its ejection port on the right but the rounds are deflected down so a left hander can still shoot it without getting a hot casing lodged into their eyeball . However, for pistols it confuses me, it doesn't look good at all, and IRL some pistols can still hit you square in the forehead even though the ejection port is on the right side (happened to me several times). As for why bolt action rifles would be depicted this way... I have no idea, that would be a ***** to cycle the bolt (not that your left hand can't do it, but having both hands next to each other will seriously unbalance you with a long and/or heavy rifle, making the task much more difficult).

 

[[CoFR]BooBoo]

The reason they are backwards in CS is because the modeller prefers modelling left-handed, and then he just mirrors them for right-handed views. It's CS, why would they care about any sort of realism?

Affirm. The gent (can't remember his handle - Gooseman, maybe) who modelled the guns for CS back when it first got started was left-handed, therefor all his models were left-handed. Consider it his way of poking fun at the right-handed world.

 

[{YBBS}Sage]

Actually, the only lefty gun I've ever seen in a gun shop was a bolt-action Remington 700. Of course, it's a civilian rifle and Remington wants to cater to the lefties in the civilian market (because otherwise a lefty would buy from someone else).

The military is different though. Soldiers don't have a choice. All of the weapons are designed for right-handed soldiers. If they are lefty, tough luck.

Things may change in the future though. Some modern military weapons are ambidextrous, such as the P-90, which ejects shells DOWN instead of right or left.

Remington 700 is also military. It's the basis for the M24 and M40 sniper rifles.

 

[Moz]

what the **** are you talking about. Besides the MG42 throwing shells sideways instead of down, I can't think of a single weapon in RO that has the shells ejecting in the wrong direction.

You = fail

 

[skypirate]

It's a purely aesthetic feature, because seeing shell casings flying across the screen is cool. IMO game developers can afford to make this tiny mistake that hardly anyone will notice and hardly anyone will care about.

If they are developing a game for little kiddies, then they can get away with it. Battlefield and Counterstrike comes to mind. On the otherhand, if they are developing a serious military-sim game for adults, they'll receive a lot of heat. Anyone who has ever shot a gun before or even looked at pictures of guns would immediately recognize the error. So if your game is for kids, you'll get away with it (most kids don't know anything about guns) but don't try to pull that crap with adults.

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention bolt actions. Those things are a *****. After every shot, you gotta take the gun down, move your trigger hand to the forward stock, and use your right hand to operate the bolt. If I'd ever buy a manually operated gun, it'd be a lever action.

While it is true that most lever actions can be operated faster than a bolt action, you neglected some major points:

1) Bolt actions are a much more simple and reliable design. Lever actions are far more likely to jam.
2) Bolt actions are usually more accurate than lever actions.
3) Trying to operate a lever action while prone is very difficult and cumbersome.
4) Due to their tubular magazines, lever actions cannot use pointed ammunition or they risk piercing or damaging the rounds' primers.
5) Bolt actions are much more sturdy than lever actions.
6) Lever actions can be short-stroked. Oops. Now you're dead.
7) Some bolt actions, such as the British Enfield, can be operated VERY quickly.

Lever actions were cool for cowboys in the late 1800's. They were some of the first "repeating" rifles. But then bolt actions became mainstream and these were far superior. Mauser, Mosin-Nagant, and Enfield made bolt actions the standard infantry rifle for two World Wars. That speaks volumes as to the effectiveness of the design.

Remington 700 is also military. It's the basis for the M24 and M40 sniper rifles.

True, but the Remington this guy bought was a civilian version. Remington has both civilian and military markets.

They offer lefty guns for civilians: http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/left-Hand/

But good luck trying to find a lefty gun from their military catalog: http://www.remingtonmilitary.com/