Apologies. In the steam thread I mentioned above this weekend, the OP was wanting a new difficulty level because HoE is too easy. And the many replies said nerf the overpowerred perks, specifically zerk and firebug, instead. I got confused between the many nerf zerk threads on steam.
Berzerker is OP now, so how do you want to fix it?
- Thread starter Deathgrip22
- Start date
All I was saying is I have considerable experience with both at the highest level of play. I do, in fact, think that has very direct bearing on comparing the two perks.
Sigh. The direct personal attacks, and mocking again. Don't worry though, I am used to people like you. No hard feelings lol
Anyway, it's not a mystery that many people consider zerk much easier to win with than any other perk in the game. It's not just my playing ability. There are entire threads that zerk makes HoE too easy. There was one on steam over this weekend, where OP someone complained HoE was too hard, and 15 - 20 replies immediately came, all from different people. Their answer? Play zerker instead. And that not the first thread like that. Ive seen several like that, all different people.
I am sorry you have to resort to ad hominem attacks. Honestly, I do. That sucks for you.
If you want to reply about zerker instead of childish personal attacks, I am still willing to discuss it. No hard feelings.
I think you're clearly in a different discussion to the one I'm in.
Actually no, you claim it's so easy again and again. I think it's about time we see you prove how easy it is. With your refusal to prove that you can play to this ability is throwing your posts into question. You claim you're godlike in this game, i'd like you to prove it. Everytime someone asks you to prove it you throw it off saying someone is personally attacking you. We just want to see you support your point. Get a group of 6 go to HoE, get to wave 6 or 7, let them die to the first zeds without putting up a fight, and then do the wave by yourself. Stop avoiding it and then claiming everyone is on board with your opinion. If you can't do that then we can't believe 90% of your posts because they operate on this assumption that the berserker is this powerful and that you claim you can get this out of the berserker when you play it.Sigh. The direct personal attacks, and mocking again. Don't worry though, I am used to people like you. No hard feelings lol
Anyway, it's not a mystery that many people consider zerk much easier to win with than any other perk in the game. It's not just my playing ability. There are entire threads that zerk makes HoE too easy. There was one on steam over this weekend, where OP someone complained HoE was too hard, and 15 - 20 replies immediately came, all from different people. Their answer? Play zerker instead. And that not the first thread like that. Ive seen several like that, all different people.
I am sorry you have to resort to ad hominem attacks. Honestly, I do. That sucks for you.
If you want to reply about zerker instead of childish personal attacks, I am still willing to discuss it. No hard feelings.
@StumbleBum Dude stop it. You keep claiming that people are 'attacking' you with personal attacks but clearly we are looking for results. You keep calling people's opinions these childish attacks when just reading at the message there's nothing to be insulted by it. You make some valid points but you take things clearly with a childs view of "Oh its a bully."
Now to the main point. Yes Berserker is undoubtedly strong especially with a medic but it has its limitations.
-It can handle a scrake by itself (Hard attack the head with the smash perk, block back and back up repeat) but you put yourself in harms way.
-It can handle small waves of zed. Gorefast, stalkers, Husks and Sirens with a hard attack. Other trash zed with a light attack.
What are its limitations?
It needs to be in the front lines. Being swarmed by other zed. Taking large amounts of damage with your armor slowly crumbling down. Once gone you are taking the brunt force of zed. That resistance comes in handy with the large amount of health.
-It cant handle a Fleshpound by itself without some aid. The Fleshpounds attacks cant be parried (I've gotten the confirms from the parry but I still get the full brunt combo with no stumble). It can certainly tank it especially with the help of its medic but its a team effort to bring it down. You can knock it down once.
Is the class easy to play? Slightly but you can see the difference from a good berserker to a bad one.
Now to the main point. Yes Berserker is undoubtedly strong especially with a medic but it has its limitations.
-It can handle a scrake by itself (Hard attack the head with the smash perk, block back and back up repeat) but you put yourself in harms way.
-It can handle small waves of zed. Gorefast, stalkers, Husks and Sirens with a hard attack. Other trash zed with a light attack.
What are its limitations?
It needs to be in the front lines. Being swarmed by other zed. Taking large amounts of damage with your armor slowly crumbling down. Once gone you are taking the brunt force of zed. That resistance comes in handy with the large amount of health.
-It cant handle a Fleshpound by itself without some aid. The Fleshpounds attacks cant be parried (I've gotten the confirms from the parry but I still get the full brunt combo with no stumble). It can certainly tank it especially with the help of its medic but its a team effort to bring it down. You can knock it down once.
Is the class easy to play? Slightly but you can see the difference from a good berserker to a bad one.
Last edited:
Um, this request is absolutely and utterly ludicrous. It is feedback like any other post in this forum. Why shouldn't you have to prove your feedback? Maybe you should prove the perk isn't overpowered.
Look, the fact is there are threads full of people talking about how HoE is too easy specifically because of beserker. I am sorry that upsets you, and it obviously does very much, but it is a FACT. There are other people in this very thread besides me saying HoE is easy with berserker. And I guess I should point out that....The topic and headline of the thread is that zerker is OP and needs to be fixed
Starting to see a pattern? I think maybe you are in the wrong thread, because this one is SPECIFICALLY about nerfing zerker. And that's exactly what I am posting about. And I have been polite and reasonable in doing so.
So feel free to apologize for acting like an aggressive bully. But you are in the wrong here. I am quite very confident of that.
I have backed up my statements about zerk with clearly stated reasoning, and in game tests. I am going to ask that you stop making strange aggressive sounding posts to me. Either that or simply stop replying to me.
If you have a problem with this, you and I can take this to the TWI moderators if you feel I have done anything wrong. I will be happy to do so. Just let me know. Yes, I really mean this. Back off with your bully tactics or let's go to the moderators.
No. Absolutely no. See above post from Nenga and my reply. The tone here has become increasingly aggressive and bizarre, and I am tired of it. Some people are taking valid beserker feedback WAY to personally and emotionally. that is very clear.
My posts have been clearly stated and more importantly ON TOPIC (see headline of this thread). If you have a problem with my clearly stated, on topic posts, with reasoning given - lets take it to a moderator, THIS morning. Or maybe you deal with the concept that someone might have a different opinion of zerk than you.
You have to understand that just because an opinion is popular doesn't mean it is well-founded. And calling everyone who disagrees out to be personally attacking you doesn't make it any better.
@Oldih
Some sort of stamina system seems more adequate than a blunt damage nerf. However:
- If the stamina system touches any mechanic not unique to berserker it needs to apply to all perks. (Sprinting for example)
- I don't like the idea of watching bars filling or emptying themselves. It's not an RPG and in fact I'm against the idea of having any form or shape of bars as a part of the interface regardless of their purpose.
Nope, no backpeddling. Apologies now for the bullying or lets report each other's posts to the moderators for an opinion. I am tired of this. Put up, or back off.
Your response just proves our point(Me and Vastspartan). You say things but you refuse to provide proof when asked and then say we're personally attacking you to try and throw the blame on us. We're just so mean and you shouldn't have to prove your argument.
Unless you can prove the berserker is OP then he's not, and that's my proof that he's not. Your refusal to support your claim is proof that mine is right. The issue only has two sides, you rarely get a nice black and white argument like this. By all means though, go to the moderators because we're not "personally attacking you" like you claim. We're just asking you to provide some official evidence to support your claims about the berserker because we don't think we can go off your word alone.
But you know what, I can humor you. I can record myself being average if you won't just say "well you're bad" afterward and write it off. Please respond to this if you can agree to that ("That" being you'll agree it's credible if it's produced) and I will give you that video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkXvnpxhzCE#t=1m40s
Fleshpounds aren't that difficult to deal with, at least with the Zweihander. In his demonstration, he screws up (and he says in the vid), but I've done this with great success. I even just tested it spawning two fleshpounds (with 4 human pawns) and I took no damage, first try.
You can also do something similar with the Pulverizer using smash instead. But you have to time the distance right and use an uppercut swing. You also will have to parry when he begins to get too close. Doing this I usually take about 20-100 damage, usually around 50. I never can do it damage free.
You can argue that it's much tougher to do when there are lesser ZEDs all around and it's a little more difficult to do both of those techniques in a more confined space. Regardless, you might take more damage, but it's very possible to take on a 6 man HoE fleshpound by yourself.
I wasn't backpaddling at all. Do your worst!
I don't "do my worst". That's the point. I post on topic and with reasons given. That is the problem with your off topic rants at me.
I suggest you take note of the headline, and realize that I am posting clearly and inarguably on topic, and with reasons for feedback given, such as comparisons between perks.
Either respond to me likewise, on topic, clearly stated reasons, or simply not reply to me any more. Please. I am asking politely.
Yes, it is. In accordance with that topic, I discussed altering the style of the maps in order to make parrying and counter-attacking more of a focus than zerkwalling.
Unfortunately, in every post you've made since then, you've snipped everything topic-related out of my posts, and taken everything else as being a personal attack when it was never intended as being so.
I recommend you take your own quote's advice, and keep on topic rather than making this about you.
It's about the topic. Not you.
No "the point" is every time somebody does that you call them out for personally attacking you. So go ahead and report us all. I feel like everything is said anyway.
Then stop replying about me! That's what I am asking for!
Like I said. I discussed changing the map style to accommodate a differing playstyle for Berserkers. If you're not interested in discussing that topic - which was the one I brought up - then feel free to discontinue your input towards me.
Thanks.
Um, with all due respect I didn't respond to you,. You responded to my post addressed to someone else.
Back on topic if somebody would like to continue discussing potential changes to the zerk that might address the imbalance.
Back on topic if somebody would like to continue discussing potential changes to the zerk that might address the imbalance.
Please... That devolved quickly.
Anyways, changing the maps to prevent zerkwalling sounds great, but that means you'd also have to widen a lot of doorways. I mean I guess there are certain popular spots you could do that and it might prevent it. But I think you'd probably have to overhaul a few maps as I've seen zerkwalling in so many different places on several different maps. I almost see a new zerkwalling spot a day. And even if they changed enough of the maps, there's a good chance people would still find more spots. It would also limit the design creativity for maps, especially custom maps.
Changing some sort of mechanic would probably be an easier change.
Someone mentioned making parry an essential component to Berserker (aside from use on scrakes, FPs, Hans).
I'll throw this out there: Make the time between all melee swings longer. Replace one of the parry skills with __% increased melee swing speed for 2-3 seconds after getting a headshot or parry (% would depend on how slowed down all melee swings are).
That would highly encourage headshot combos and making use of parry more often (which seemed like Tripwire's initial purpose in putting in the parry skills for Berserker in the first place).
Probably wouldn't eliminate zerkwalling, but you would have to be much more skilled to successfully do it without taking loads of damage as you'd have to go for headshots/parries.
Last edited: