Berserker nerfed to uselessness

[Sinful Malice]

Having not actually tried the berserker, or melee at all this weekend, (was loving the MP7 too much), I can't say anything from personal experience.

What I've read here does make quite a bit of sense, and cause some worry. I, myself usually play medic, and I always pair a katana with a bullpup. I don't "rush" into things, bullpup can headshot spam enough. Slower ROF for the katana I can deal with, but single click attacks? What am I when I'm stuck with 250 zeds left on suicidal because my team blew out early?

Being mainly a normal difficulty player, occasionally on hard and suicidal, I've noticed that the new weapons are very, very powerful, and even the crossbow, with the hitboxes done properly. How is a medic 1 hitting a scrake/fp with the crossbow not OP, when the same medic tries to katana/chainsaw (not decap) them? I don't have much of an intention to ever use melee (cept for good old kniving on the first wave) much anymore, if at all. It's just far easier and safer for me to use an MP7 + Crossbow combo, than it is to use my old bullpup + katana combo that I used to love so much.

Katana and chainsaw could have just gotten a ROF speed nerf, a slight one at that. I think they went rather over the top with what's happened now.

Anywho, that's just my thoughts.

 

[nath2009uk]

Mmmmmmkkkk.

Berserkers are still not OP.
They can easily take down many specimens, no argument.
They should buff up the chainsaw again, but you can take down most enemies with a

 

[acidchalk]

Ok, i've got my zerker perk at level 5. Last night on a hard game my party wiped on the 8th wave to a flesh pound at somewhere around 60 specimens left. I managed to finish off the pounder with the katana after some crazy amount of swings on the damn thing and then pretty much ran around west london in a circle self healing making sure to pop off the crawlers with my rifle so that i didn't need to worry about them. The only thing that gives me ANY problems is the flesh pounder which i can kill solo after a considerable amount of effort on my part. Guy, lets face it, in an open area with a katana it's impossible to die as a zerker. You would have to screw up and let yourself get cornered but so long as you keep moving you just don't die like all the other classes. Now the weapons damage did get a noticeable nerf but you know whats funny? This whole time i did NOT know you could hold down the attack button on the katana.... i've been swinging it this way since it came out haha. I guess it's just because i was used to swinging the axe and knife. So in conclusion the readjustment of melee weapons damage will help but what the class needs is some serious rethinking, because as it is, it's better for everyone if i stay out of their way so i don't block their line of fire and run off picking things off on my own.

 

[Gridlok]

Seriously you really think a melee weapon is going to be more effective in damage then a ****ing gun.

Ok, I really don't think that killing floor was designed to be that realistic

Lol, did you really just say "OMG HOW IS A MELEE WEAPON STRONGER THAN A GUN!?!?!?!" And then turn around and say "I really don't think Killing Floor was designed to be that realistic"?

and also if they weren't sensitive and didn't feel pain why would they be stunned by a melee attack to the torso.

And pain doesn't cause one to become "stunned", a strong blow to the head or body will cause one to become "stunned". Pain is only mental.


This topic is dumb. So is that topic stating Zerker deserved to be nerfed. It's fine right now, it's weapons are fine, and it performs fine. I've been playing Zerker since release and I can safely say it's still useful on all difficulties.

 

[Nanostrike]

So in conclusion the readjustment of melee weapons damage will help but what the class needs is some serious rethinking, because as it is, it's better for everyone if i stay out of their way so i don't block their line of fire and run off picking things off on my own.

The reduction in melee weapon damage coupled wiht the increase in ranged weapon damage helps balance HOW?

 

[Evilsod]

Ok, i've got my zerker perk at level 5. Last night on a hard game my party wiped on the 8th wave to a flesh pound at somewhere around 60 specimens left. I managed to finish off the pounder with the katana after some crazy amount of swings on the damn thing and then pretty much ran around west london in a circle self healing making sure to pop off the crawlers with my rifle so that i didn't need to worry about them. The only thing that gives me ANY problems is the flesh pounder which i can kill solo after a considerable amount of effort on my part. Guy, lets face it, in an open area with a katana it's impossible to die as a zerker. You would have to screw up and let yourself get cornered but so long as you keep moving you just don't die like all the other classes. Now the weapons damage did get a noticeable nerf but you know whats funny? This whole time i did NOT know you could hold down the attack button on the katana.... i've been swinging it this way since it came out haha. I guess it's just because i was used to swinging the axe and knife. So in conclusion the readjustment of melee weapons damage will help but what the class needs is some serious rethinking, because as it is, it's better for everyone if i stay out of their way so i don't block their line of fire and run off picking things off on my own.

Do you honestly think that means a thing?

During the weekend i was playing a 6man Hard Farm game with allies that would wipe (even when i was staying with them) with 100-200+ specimens left on about 4 occasions. On 2 of the earlier waves it was as a Commando, allowing me to 1 shot practically everything with no fear of ambush thanks to the health bars. Then once it hit wave 5+ i'd changed to the M14 Sharpshooter, and had to solo everything the game could throw at me, be it Husks, Fleshpounds or Scrakes. And guess what? Aside from Husks and surprise back attacks things were never even CLOSE to hurting me. even the auto-enraging Fleshpound i would just wait until he closed in before unloading on his head and blowing it off before he could get in range.

 

[acidchalk]

Do you honestly think that means a thing?

During the weekend i was playing a 6man Hard Farm game with allies that would wipe (even when i was staying with them) with 100-200+ specimens left on about 4 occasions. On 2 of the earlier waves it was as a Commando, allowing me to 1 shot practically everything with no fear of ambush thanks to the health bars. Then once it hit wave 5+ i'd changed to the M14 Sharpshooter, and had to solo everything the game could throw at me, be it Husks, Fleshpounds or Scrakes. And guess what? Aside from Husks and surprise back attacks things were never even CLOSE to hurting me. even the auto-enraging Fleshpound i would just wait until he closed in before unloading on his head and blowing it off before he could get in range.

Yes it means shut the hell up already berserkers are fine. I'm not trying to say i'm some bad *** godly berserker player, i'm just pointing out that it's not easy to die as one since they don't get grabbed and they haul ***.

 

[acidchalk]

The reduction in melee weapon damage coupled wiht the increase in ranged weapon damage helps balance HOW?

It does not. But no amount of damage correction on berserker weapons is going to fix the things that people complain about.

 

[nath2009uk]

Yes it means shut the hell up already berserkers are fine. I'm not trying to say i'm some bad *** godly berserker player, i'm just pointing out that it's not easy to die as one since they don't get grabbed and they haul ***.

They are fine.
You can decap most things easily, we can shoot their heads with our 9mm.

 

[Nanostrike]

They are fine.
You can decap most things easily, we can shoot their heads with our 9mm.

This is true, but the point is that you can do that with ANY other class at a distance, sharpshooter especially. Aside from faster movespeed with melee weapons and some damage resistance (Medics get basically both of those, only they get MORE speed while using ANY weapons...), Berserkers have ZERO redeeming features...

 

[acidchalk]

This is true, but the point is that you can do that with ANY other class at a distance, sharpshooter especially. Aside from faster movespeed with melee weapons and some damage resistance (Medics get basically both of those, only they get MORE speed while using ANY weapons...), Berserkers have ZERO redeeming features...

Exactly which brings me to my earlier point of having to rethink the perk vs rebalancing damage.

 

[Skunkee]

Been noticing a lot of "herp and derp" within this topic as well as some good posts and good ideas. I've got a topic open in Ideas and suggestions that will hopefully help address some concerns of long time zerkers, new zerkers, or non zerkers if we contribute to it and don't turn it into a trolling festival (starting to happen with a couple of people).

http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=37681

 

[TheHateMaster]

Basically all I see is nath and Sambo trolling and offering illogical "arguments" while ignoring legitimate reasons given by Nanostrike and Evil_Sod.

Pre-patch, berserker's damage output was simply Ungodly and Katana was really overpowered due to its overall combination of price, damage, and weight being simply too good compared to every other weapon. There is no arguing over this fact. It wasn't just berserkers, everyone had to get a katana because they were just too good. The nerf on Katana, however, is completely wrong. Making it physically exhaustive on a player's finger to use a weapon isn't an actual nerf. The balance should be on cost/weight/damage output. Address the problem, damn it!!

I tend towards the belief that Berserkers were relatively easy to use and far too powerful with relation to the cost of their weapons, pre-patch.

However, the whole issue is that the new patch has strengthened other classes AND weakened the berserker to the point where berserkers are completely obsolete. Other classes can match or surpass the killing power while not being a bullet-sponge, a guy that needs to be constantly healed, and a liability to be protected from many assorted ZEDs near him.

Fixing headshot hitboxes, and the m14's introduction make sharpshooter the no.1 class by a mile. With the m14's massive clip size/ammo reserve, crowd control is no longer a problem for the SS. The Commando now has the SCAR, it's basically a smaller clip size for greatly improved damage output and laser sights. Support has the very powerful AA12. These 3 damage-classes have made the berserker completely obsolete where damage-dealing is concerned.

The berserker, on the other hand, lost the chainsaw as a viable weapon because it is completely useless as of now. The katana has become terribly annoying to use.

I don't really miss the berserker, I'm a guns-player myself, but it is only fair to recognise the merit of their argument. Every other class(except firebug) is now more viable than the berserker, and this severely affects the balance of the game. Why would you want to rush into melee and expose yourself to damage from ZEDs if your damage output were mediocre/inferior? That is totally not logical.

 

[Evilsod]

Yes it means shut the hell up already berserkers are fine. I'm not trying to say i'm some bad *** godly berserker player, i'm just pointing out that it's not easy to die as one since they don't get grabbed and they haul ***.

No what you said is the Zerker can hold his own against the final crappy enemies in a wave after all the challenging ones area dead and there aren't that many spawning anymore. I'm saying the Sharpshooter can hold his own, full stop. Plus his weapons are actually FUN to usea nd more to the point, he doesn't have to stand 2 inches from his foes to do damage.

 

[nath2009uk]

But you stand up close and don't take much damage from what your attacking since the katana has good range and you stun most of them.

 

[Evilsod]

But you stand up close and don't take much damage from what your attacking since the katana has good range and you stun most of them.

Your right... i must've missed the update where the Katana unleashed a Shockwave upon striking that stunned not only the target but everything nearby.

 

[Nanostrike]

Your right... i must've missed the update where the Katana unleashed a Shockwave upon striking that stunned not only the target but everything nearby.

Not to mention that you need to tap the mouse like an RTS player on crack to get said speed and if/when your clicking slows, so do your attacks... I often switch to the knife simply so I'll have a melee weapon that I don't have to clickspam!

Couple this with the fact that Gorefasts deal the damage BEFORE they play their animation now and the result is that while you're hacking one, the next one who's BEGINNING his swing (Which you could usually interrupt) has already hit you. Ack!

 

[Marls]

Not to mention that you need to tap the mouse like an RTS player on crack to get said speed and if/when your clicking slows, so do your attacks... I often switch to the knife simply so I'll have a melee weapon that I don't have to clickspam!

It's the same thing as firing 15 rounds from a 9mm.

Whats the problem here ?

 

[Gunthak]

It's the same thing as firing 15 rounds from a 9mm.

Whats the problem here ?

POV movement is far more erratic in Katana melee at point blank range, compared to plunking out 9mm rounds. When you're unloading 15 shots from a 9mm, let's face it, you're attempting to group your shots in a pretty narrow and efficient focus, not erratically flicking the 9mm to foes far apart from each other. And of course, you're usually about 10-30 feet from the enemy.

The Katana-engaged berserker at point blank range has no choice but to quickly flick perspective from foe to foe, high and low, surrounded like he's inside a box and the walls are closing in; as opposed to the ranged attacker who sets himself up to fire into the fray from a distance, like shooting at a painting--headshots available on a linear axis from multiple safe ranges. While we have scenes like the Berzerker attacking a disabled Scrake and nobody is shooting the 4 stalkers and 3 crawlers tearing into the undefended Berzerker's flanks.

It profoundly sucks when you have to peel off the big mob and insta-flick your PoV in four different directions to remove those vermin. Meanwhile, your screen is filled with contact effects from teammates: red bullet streaks, dense smoke, and bright fire fill your perspective at point blank, with some extra bloat bile for sh!ts and giggles. As one's teammates can't resist killing the big scary chainsaw guy, the one that didn't charge at them because their zerker squadmate intercepted it--the same teammate they don't bother protecting from the fodder. The fodder they specialize at killing. Irony.

So you have all this insane PoV flicking around at point blank (you can't be casual about suicidal damage, especially), while simultaneously having to spam-spam-spam the Katana attack? Not a good situation for the user's body or mind. TWI needs to return continuous swinging to this weapon, but re-calibrate the damage, swing rate, or range. And re-visit the chainsaw. It's been weakened to the point where you sustain far too much ancillary damage from not-quite-dead foes still attacking your slow ***, point blank.

 

[nath2009uk]

I was watching Zerkers earlier today easily kill them like pre patch.
So, learn to play.
'waits for another post about stuf no u fgt and other lul related pointless crap'

So you have to press to fire, big deal.
I fire like that with my bullpup, 1000 times a match, my mouse still works.
'Oh but your not upclose with mah nerfed down to **** katana and crap'
Come on, seriously. Just go play the game.

It works.