Balance the zerk weaponry thread

[naksiloth]

I think I'm pushing hard but why the eff-not? I really think zerk weaponry shouldn't be that overpowered and stable.

My offering is adding a small shift in balance while swinging such heavy melee weapons (Katana, Scythe, Fire axe, Claymore, Dwarfs?! Axe) constantly. That should only apply in their primary fire; thus secondary fire remains as stable blows. All melee weaponry have area effects in their primary attacks and I see nothing wrong with losing some balance (like recoil in firearms) when you swing it away. Swinging rapidly may cause blade to go off-balance doing diagonal cuts above or below the crosshair, cause zerker to miss head.
Knife and Machete like lighter weapons or Chainsaw should have no shift of balance or a very small one while swinging away trying to cut down the horde with great efficiency.

With katana, flinch locking a Scrake below suicidal, may require zerk to combine primary fire with secondary swings so I hardly doubt that would effect the low level gameplay. As for swinging primary fire, if zerk puts a small delay between swings it should hit precisely at the crosshair again.

As for Buzzsaw Bow, I think it's appropriate to add some recoil on its shots. Even it's a slow reloading projectile weapon it should have some more cons points.

Thoughts?

 

[mrsirr]

I'm not hating on berzerkers, but that thing they do where they just walk up to a fleshpound and swing away until its head jumps off doesn't seem like something anyone should be able to do.
This might not be a major change but mayhaps it would at least mean one would have to do a bit more than hold mouse1 to take down scrakes and fleshpounds.

 

[scary ghost]

No need to change their weapons, just play super zombies or scrn balance.

 

[mrsirr]

But. . .
A mutator for balance?

 

[naksiloth]

No need to change their weapons, just play super zombies or scrn balance.

I didn't change anything, just nerfed them a bit. in real life you're not suppose to swing a sword for hours to the same point by being 100% accurate (or dual wield handcannons or perform a jumpshot with Hunting Shotgun but those are other stories). That would hardly effect their kiting skills yet I do believe it will prevent people to think that zerkers are a "no-skill based perk".
They have trash cleaning skills, speed to kite and always mobile. Since we can't touch the latter two, I offer nerfing his trash cleaning skills a bit. So, that will force the class to be really precise with their swings (such as taking out a Crawler in mid-air with a single swing, ripping the head off from a charging Gorefast with a slow but accurate alter-fire swing once you miss the first chance) and carry a sidearm (such as Lever-action Rifle or Buzzsaw). That will keep them on their toes and hopefully class will be based on threat prioritizing instead of mindlessly cutting down everything. May be I'm too elitist.

How did scrn balance, balanced the zerk? I should look up on it.

 

[Escadin]

Got to admit that dwarfs!? axe is pretty op because it can knock FP and Sc back.
Buzzsawbow is extremely expensive and even more expensive on maps with low chance to ever pick up one of the saws again. Still, it should probably not stun SC with non-headshots.

On the other hand almost all zerker I meet seem to prefer katana + fireaxe anyway. I don't get why they stick to low tier weapons even on hoe and EVEN when everyone is throwing their money out, but they obviously don't believe in the srength or even OPness of Buzzsaw, scythe and claymore. Can't be such a big issue then.

So you want to see strong melee weapons to effectively be slower with their primary attack than their alt attack?
And you want recoil on a weapon which RoF isn't even high enough to be affected by recoil?
Sorry I say nay ^^ I'd prefer a total rework for the chainsaw. Something to give it a purpose (or is it just my lack of creativity?).

 

[naksiloth]

Got to admit that dwarfs!? axe is pretty op because it can knock FP and Sc back.
Buzzsawbow is extremely expensive and even more expensive on maps with low chance to ever pick up one of the saws again. Still, it should probably not stun SC with non-headshots.

On the other hand almost all zerker I meet seem to prefer katana + fireaxe anyway. I don't get why they stick to low tier weapons even on hoe and EVEN when everyone is throwing their money out, but they obviously don't believe in the srength or even OPness of Buzzsaw, scythe and claymore. Can't be such a big issue then.

So you want to see strong melee weapons to effectively be slower with their primary attack than their alt attack?
And you want recoil on a weapon which RoF isn't even high enough to be affected by recoil?
Sorry I say nay ^^ I'd prefer a total rework for the chainsaw. Something to give it a purpose (or is it just my lack of creativity?).

I do tried dorf ax and I think it's not really OP, all you can do is knocking back an enraged target (keep in mind that FP can enrage over and over again) away while the rest of the horde slowly closing down upon you.

Buzzsaw is actually meant to rip a new one to awkward targets such as Siren and Husk, I do really believe that its headshot multiplier should be nerfed to 1.15x and it should gain the same capabilities with a melee weapon. Like a behind attack doubling the melee damage it should only double the damage from behind attacks, not headshots entirely. That would add a little spice on friendly-fire servers perhaps.

If ricochets are the problem itself; then, blade characteristic should change to pierce targets, only if blade bounces-off from a surface "first" -thus lower damage; instead of piercing thru it just minces away some meat by being inaccurate. So if you really want to headshot that annoying Husk behind the small horde, you have to get rid of close quarter crawlers so buzzsaw won't stuck on them, then perform a bounce off shot from ground... I know, too try hard but that would allow it to work better in friendly fire servers and nerf its power abit...

Katana has high enough RoF to affect from balance shift, and I'm actually thinking about a stable balance shift not additive recoil with each swing like you're firing a firearm. I mean your consecutive Axe swings might be off 8 to 6 degree at up to level2 and, 5 to 3 degree off at level6, just an example.

 

[mrsirr]

I forgot about the chainsaw. I think the chainsaw could use a change.
But basicly what I'm seeing if I understand right is just something that requires a bit more effort; not necessarily something that makes berzerkers less effective unless they just aren't good at their job.
-still not hating on berzerkers.

 

[Zombie Overlord]

Ugh, please just go. I'm getting sick of these threads. They all are redundant and are all fail to realize that Tripwire has already reached the epitome of balance in their game. They don't see anything game-breaking like with the scrake-stun scythe or the M99, buzzsaw bow-cheapness. At this point, fundamentally changing an entire set of playstyle mechanics that define a class ingame at the moans of whiny forum-goers is a colassal no-no and a no-brainer.

 

[mrsirr]

No one is whining.
Not here at least.

 

[naksiloth]

Ugh, please just go. I'm getting sick of these threads. They all are redundant and are all fail to realize that Tripwire has already reached the epitome of balance in their game. They don't see anything game-breaking like with the scrake-stun scythe or the M99, buzzsaw bow-cheapness. At this point, fundamentally changing an entire set of playstyle mechanics that define a class ingame at the moans of whiny forum-goers is a colassal no-no and a no-brainer.

It's not a plain whine thread, sir overseer. I'm not fundamentally changing the gameplay of the perk, I'm nerfing it just by a small amount...

 

[poosh]

No need to change their weapons, just play super zombies or scrn balance.

Or even better play with both. If all your teammates are dead and you're facing alone against super zombies, then scrn zerker isn't a better choice than sharpshooter or gunslinger.

 

[nutterbutter]

Ugh, please just go. I'm getting sick of these threads.

You can't control who makes these threads but you certainly can control if you read them or not.

Someone else has suggested that the zerker "lose his balance" when swinging a weapon and missing. It was/is a very good suggestion.

The problem is that the zerker's OP is pervasive in every aspect of the game. Every advantage with no disadvantages. TWI has rebalanced the game and they want an OP zerker. It will not change.

 

[Zombie Overlord]

You can't control who makes these threads but you certainly can control if you read them or not.

Someone else has suggested that the zerker "lose his balance" when swinging a weapon and missing. It was/is a very good suggestion.

The problem is that the zerker's OP is pervasive in every aspect of the game. Every advantage with no disadvantages. TWI has rebalanced the game and they want an OP zerker. It will not change.

Exactly.

 

[mrsirr]

Exactly.

That's not what you said at all

 

[ArcheKruz]

I can think of an easy way to balance the Zerk if you're wanting of it. Add a stamina bar for melee weapons. A stamina bar determines the running speed bonus (Stamina depleted = Unperked running speed.), the swing speed (67% ~ 100%, the penalty cannot go lower than unperked swing speed.) as well as damage. (67% ~ 100%, cannot go lower than unperked damage.) Bigger melee weapons take more stamina to swing, and Perk level determines the amount of stamina and the recharge speed of the stamina bar.

 

[mrsirr]

yeah but as Nutterbutter said, TWI wants the Berzerker the way it is.
I just replied to show that I think it's a good idea.

 

[Colorless]

at least people aren't afraid of saying it's OP unlike before because of the chance of zerk being nerfed.

Zerk should be fixed regardless of what twi wants.

 

[Hell-met]

I'm pretty sure it would be wiser to tweak the zerk's passive stats rather than his tools

 

[mrsirr]

Zerk should be fixed regardless of what twi wants.

This is true.
It's just unlikely we'll ever see a change.