[Game] ArmA 3, for real

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SiC-Disaster

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 16, 2005
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Or perhaps they are getting sick (or fear us getting sick) of the same M4/M16+MOD's rehashing in every single game and thought it was time for a new weapon to keep things a bit more fresh in terms of equipment, even if they are less realistic.

Also, i have to say, having played VBS2 it isn't that much more of a complete package compared to ArmA 2, except for the training tools like replay function which was impressive.
But when it comes to, for example, movement systems, ArmA 2 is much, much better because VBS2 still runs on ArmA 1-style engine (meaning that in VBS2 you still do have to stop to reload, you cant change stance while moving, etc.)
Next to the AAR functions VBS2 offers (with even visible bullets looking like lasers to make them stand out and let the people see where their rounds went), it offers some additional stuff like being able to build roadblocks (which isnt interesting to most people, but if it is it could be added via mods too), and small other stuff like that (though i cant claim to have seen ALL that VBS2 can do, this is just from personal experience and some promo-video's for VBS2 that i remember having seen).
Most impressive though is VBS2's ability to load a satmap and generate an ingame map off of it. Though highly basic in initial form, it allows for exact replica's of actual situations.

I remember a story one lieutenant told me about, where they had a squad of soldiers training in VBS2 right before they shipped off to Afghanistan.
They had an exact replica of the area they were going to in VBS2, and they practised ambushes in various locations.
Well, during their deployment in Afghanistan one of the situations they trained for actually happened on the exact location they had trained in in VBS2 :p
Because they had some practise in VBS2 on that same location and that same scenario, they had a better picture of how to properly react, and properly react they did: they fought off the ambush and escaped intact.

So in general i'd say VBS2 primarily adds a whole lot of functions that ArmA 2 doesnt have, yet the basics of moving around are far more advanced in ArmA 2.
They even had to add stepping over fences in a patch to VBS2, while we had that ability for a while in ArmA 2, yet they still have to stop to reload, change stance etc.
It's less important for them though i guess, because for them it isnt about a smooth game experience but about proper tactics and training, while it is all about fun for us and we require a smoother experience.

That being said, i dont at all think ArmA 2's movement is clunky.
I can do exactly what i want to do, when i want to do it.
CQB is a lot more troublesome though and on this i have to agree, and i would like BIS to move onto a new engine because this one is made primarily for open ground warfare.
However i'd say the biggest problem in CQB is the AI and it's slow reaction times in close proximity (mainly turn speeds), and not the actual moving around yourself. AI was primarily designed to fight on open ground, and that is why they perform badly in alleyways but are dangerous when crossing an open section in a city like a big town square, or fighting in the woods.
ArmA 2's main advantage in movement is that you can lock most actions by double tapping. I can easily toggle between running and walking, and even toggle on or off leaning to both sides so that i have one less button to press while moving around a corner.
+ when you have a TrackIR system, you can even look around when you are looking over your ironsights or aimpoint.
 
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Flogger23m

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 5, 2009
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Or perhaps they are getting sick (or fear us getting sick) of the same M4/M16+MOD's rehashing in every single game and thought it was time for a new weapon to keep things a bit more fresh in terms of equipment, even if they are less realistic.

I'd rather see improvements on them (animations) before seeing new weapons.
 

Dietrich Graf

FNG / Fresh Meat
For the last 10 years we have been discussing the issue of how dumb bots can be. I'm sorry, they aren't going to get any smarter because they are nothing but scripted actors. If scientists that have millions in grants are having a hard time creating artificial intelligence, then what makes you think a game developer with finite resources could create it? And if they did, I guarantee you that game would be $50K instead of $50.

Having said that, lets move on and devote those resources to human vs. human multiplayer experience. Lets build upon what made OFP: CWC great, before it turned into this tech demo, single player experience that has destroyed the game.
 

Tomcat_ha

Grizzled Veteran
Nov 21, 2005
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ofp and arma actually have always been at the very forefront in terms of AI in games. You need to remember the AI in these games is completely dynamic and is not scripted.
 

DraKon2k

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 22, 2005
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For the 3h max that I played Dragon Rising I didn't have one single problem with the AI. What stopped me was the terrible averageness of everything that stopped me from playing any further.

ArmA2's AI is still worse and even if it wasn't, just because another game has an AI that's even more terrible doesn't make it any better.
 

DraKon2k

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 22, 2005
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2,802
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Vienna, Austria
Show us an AI that can do what ArmA 2's AI can do, but better.
I don't care what it could potentially do if there still is a ****load of AI problems that break the whole sp campaign and completely break immersion in anything below encounter range of 500m. I stopped counting how often I had enemies in front of me in ArmA2(and OA as well) who simply ran past me in 1m distance without even recognizing I'm there, and if they react then you get the usual turn head 270
 

fiftyone

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 6, 2006
5,451
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You can do anything you want, with a ArmA bot.

The reference "bot" I find, is detrimental.

"Show us an AI that can do what ArmA 2's AI can do, but better."

Anyone ?

They are as good as the guy next to you...
 

Dwarden

FNG / Fresh Meat
Nov 23, 2005
205
29
0
I don't care what it could potentially do if there still is a ****load of AI problems that break the whole sp campaign and completely break immersion in anything below encounter range of 500m. I stopped counting how often I had enemies in front of me in ArmA2(and OA as well) who simply ran past me in 1m distance without even recognizing I'm there, and if they react then you get the usual turn head 270
 

Colt .45 killer

Grizzled Veteran
May 19, 2006
3,996
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Hey Dwarden. Does this mean we are likely to see redone player animations ( reload being a particular one ) only? or will there be animations for entering / exiting vehicles as well ( a bit more of a tall order ).


Also Concerning things like ACRE and ACE. Many of the ACE features were adopted ( switching sights on weapon for example ). Is there any word on how many features / ideas from ACE, and possibly ACRE, that will end up being standard in ARMA 3?

( IE medic system instead of 'heal at medic' )
 

Apos

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 3, 2007
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Hey Dwarden. Does this mean we are likely to see redone player animations ( reload being a particular one ) only? or will there be animations for entering / exiting vehicles as well ( a bit more of a tall order ).


Also Concerning things like ACRE and ACE. Many of the ACE features were adopted ( switching sights on weapon for example ). Is there any word on how many features / ideas from ACE, and possibly ACRE, that will end up being standard in ARMA 3?

( IE medic system instead of 'heal at medic' )

Yep, you should hire guys from ACE and ACRE. I play in ArmA 2 (and have great fun!) mostly because of friends and these mods tbh.
 

Flogger23m

FNG / Fresh Meat
May 5, 2009
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you can count on that :cool:

That is good news.

As I said, release an addon that changes some of the things listed above from ArmA 2 CO and I'd pay $10 easily. Probably up to $20.

I would also like to see the "quick inventory check" from ACE standard in ArmA 2. Something that simulates you looking down to see how many mags you have and whatnot. Resistance and Liberation had such a feature as well.

Of course, if we could look down and visually see how many mags we have left, that would be great to. But I think that might take too much effort.
 

Reddog

FNG / Fresh Meat
Dec 7, 2005
2,572
476
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Australia
I just want to see proper animations for the gun handling, throwing grenades, etc. It would honestly improve the immersion tenfold.

As cynical as I am about Arma in general I would still like to see them succeed and make a game that looks good, runs well and has a high degree of realism.
 

Colt .45 killer

Grizzled Veteran
May 19, 2006
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Yep, you should hire guys from ACE and ACRE. I play in ArmA 2 (and have great fun!) mostly because of friends and these mods tbh.


ACRE is awesome, but the team seems somewhat dilusional. They report 99% stability, when we did test with ~20 players it was like a revolving door, people dropping out/crashing and rejoining TS/the game. Not to mention Emails/ forum applications to report these defects have all fallen on deaf ears. The idea behind ACRE, sure put it in game; the ACRE team itself.. pff wouldnt bother..