Are grenades underpowered ?

[Mekhazzio]

The grenades don't clear rooms, unless those rooms are closets and bathrooms. If you don't manage to bounce the grenade right on top of the person inside the room, they'll just be winged at worst. It's just weird to see someone shrug off a grenade 10 feet away from them.

 

[[SP]Alfonso]

Are we talking about defensive or offensive nades here?
I think we have offensive nades, so they are a bit underpowered, but it's ok for me.
The nade fest from RO1 was horrible...

 

[Verluste]

I believe I'm quoting this correctly.

"In Stalingrad grenades were your friends, you sent them in the room first then charged in with your SMG or bayonet or spade"

It's from a Russian Stalingrad vet in a History channel documentary. (Yes the one with the annoying transvestite Bilbo Baggins)

Except in Stalingrad they did not respawn. Sadly.
Or perhaps they did if you believe in a certain religion.
Anyways, grenades are always your friend along with your even bigger friend, BULLETS!

 

[Buzzles]

I'm not worried about normal grenades.

What I would like is to swap one of my normal grenades for a smoke as a SL (so, 1x normal, 2x smoke) and for Elite Riflemen (or perhaps if an Elite Assault ever makes it into the game) to get a smoke, possibly at the cost of a grenade.

Smokes are much more useful in this game, especially with everyone being near robot like accurate with their guns.

 

[Tweek]

I'm not worried about normal grenades.

What I would like is to swap one of my normal grenades for a smoke as a SL (so, 1x normal, 2x smoke) and for Elite Riflemen (or perhaps if an Elite Assault ever makes it into the game) to get a smoke, possibly at the cost of a grenade.

Smokes are much more useful in this game, especially with everyone being near robot like accurate with their guns.

That would be a nice feature, I would gladly trade my nades for smoke.

 

[DarkHunt3r]

Grenades are not as effective as many people here seem to think, for example the grenade being used by the Axis is the model 24, this was NOT a fragmentation grenade, it relied solely upon blast radius damage. It's stick handle and weight meant it could be thrown a good distance, 30 - 40 yards

The Russian F1 grenade is actually a defensive grenade, and is a fragmentation grenade, it was designed to break into 36 smaller pieces upon detonation (although there would be other smaller less lethal fragments) the range was designated to reach 200 meters, effective to 30 meters and could be thrown an average of 35 meters. As such there we only meant to be thrown from behind cover.

Now there are some other things to take into consideration when thinking about grenades, firstly, the fragments and blast will always raise at about a 15 degree angle from the point of explosion, to explain this simply it is because when the grenade explodes the force of the explosion goes in EVERY direction, including downwards with of course hits the ground (or what ever it may be laying on) and pushes back upward, this then pushes all the other explosive force upwards, this effect means that the explosive force and fragments will always raise upwards getting higher the further out it goes from the grenade.

If you actually lay down 5 or 6 feet away from a grenade on level ground, it wont kill you (you may be injured slightly from blast damage and for sure you will be scared witless)

Grenades are far more effective in enclosed spaces, because the pressure wave from the grenade cannot dissipate and does a lot more damage, in open spaces the pressure wave is not effective at all.

The grenades are underpowered, but not by as much as people think, and before anyone asks I am an ex soldier and yes have thrown grenades and know full well how they work)

 

[LOOY]

Modern Grenades are a guaranteed kill within about 5m and a possible wound up to about 15. (Source)Considering that uneven terrain and solid cover completly negates grenades I wouldn't mind a realistic kill radius on the in game grenades.

 

[DarkHunt3r]

Modern Grenades are a guaranteed kill within about 5m and a possible wound up to about 15. (Source)Considering that uneven terrain and solid cover completly negates grenades I wouldn't mind a realistic kill radius on the in game grenades.

No such thing as a guaranteed kill with a grenade, and these are not based on MODERN grenades, they are from WW2 70 years ago and were designed much earlier, for example the Model 24 grenade was designed in 1914 (introduced in 1915) nearly 100 years ago, for use in WW1, nothing modern about it at all

 

[Vesper11]

Still, F1 should have a greater AoE if we want realism here, but for some *khe khe* reason only when it comes to nazi weapons realism matters.

 

[Yellonet]

I for one would like to see the grenades modelled more realistically, sure, teamkills would probably go up for a while until people realize that you should only throw grenades where you know there are no friendlies.

 

[Teufel Hund]

The Russian pineapple type grenade has about 40 big pieces going 360 degrees over the radius - so you only get hit for sure if you are near it when it goes off.

The concussion from it is localized too - you must be close to it unless it goes off indoors in a small room. Ruptured eardrums are another matter.

The US pineapple type grenade had smokeless powder in it and not high explosives, so I'm thinking the maybe the Russian one does too. They clear small rooms pretty well.

The Russian F1 grenade has 60g of TNT. The Stielhandgranate 24 has 170g of TNT, but has no fragmentation unless the optional Splitterring sleeve is added.

 

[Teufel Hund]

Still, F1 should have a greater AoE if we want realism here, but for some *khe khe* reason only when it comes to nazi weapons realism matters.

The German grenade should also have a longer range though since the wooden handle provides leverage so you can throw it farther. The Stielhandgranate also has an optional Splitterring sleeve to provide fragmentation when a "defensive" grenade is needed.

 

[Nebelkind]

I would have to agree with this as I can gingerly run through a barrage, dodging shells that land within 10 feet of my position, and nothing happens to me.

If anything I'm sure this would knock me unconscious from the shock-wave if it didn't shatter every bone in my body

At that range, your average howitzer-level HE charge would be just as likely to pull your lungs out of your mouth/nose.

 

[Nebelkind]

Modern Grenades are a guaranteed kill within about 5m and a possible wound up to about 15. (Source)Considering that uneven terrain and solid cover completly negates grenades I wouldn't mind a realistic kill radius on the in game grenades.

The M24 Stielhandgrenate was an offensive grenade. It was designed to incapacitate opponents in trenches, (not blow them into bloody gibs)while having a shallow enough kill/wound radius that you could safely throw it while running towards the Point of Impact.

It's weak. It's weak on purpose, and the Germans used them in showers of 4-10 at a time. The Splitterring was a later war invention that significantly increased their kill/wound radius.


Edited for sppeeelllong.

 

[Teufel Hund]

The Splitterring was a later war invention that significantly increased their kill/wound radius.

I wouldn't call 1942 a later war invention...

 

[Nebelkind]

I wouldn't call 1942 a later war invention...

Fair enough. Mid-war. Later than 1914 though.

 

[Teufel Hund]

Fair enough. Mid-war. Later than 1914 though.

If I recall correctly, the SS started using them in '42. But the Wehrmacht didn't start until later. The originals were smooth sheet metal, the more effective segmented versions were not until later. There was also a splitterring available for later models of the panzerfaust so that it could be used against infantry, but that's obviously outside of the Stalingrad time period.

 

[RedFlagWaver]

my great-grandfather wasn't killed by soviet grenade shrapnel in Stalingrad for modern games to portray them as weaksauce.

Seriously.

 

[Nebelkind]

a splitterring available for later models of the panzerfaust

Wouldn't that be incredibly directional though? Might work best as an airburst.

my great-grandfather wasn't killed by soviet grenade shrapnel in Stalingrad for modern games to portray them as weaksauce.

Seriously.

But naming yourself "Red Flag Waver" is ok?

 

[Teufel Hund]

Wouldn't that be incredibly directional though? Might work best as an airburst.

It was a ring around the base of the warhead (see pic I just added). It was intended to take out any infantry supporting, or riding, a tank that was hit.