About the King Tiger
- Thread starter RiccardoTheBeAst
- Start date
If you ever would have worked in the automotive industry then you would know that this is in no way true.
For instance, Aston Martin recently put an all extruded aluminium boot sill finisher in their new Rapide.That thing is UGLY as hell in that car, the trunk itself is angled and swung, the finisher is straight and you can even see the edges of it at the sides. Oh and the overall design of that finisher is ****, a place where kids can hurt their fingers, it'll get scratched after a few weeks of use and overall simply doesn't fit the car.
But yeah, engineers all know what they do... right?
All what Germans tell is 1.000% true and all what Russians tell is 1.000% false? LOL, what opinion is this?
Anyway, i think that the site that i posted is really good, you can see here that penetration table are correct and that match with data posted by Tank! here: http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showpost.php?p=553310&postcount=35
P.S.: the Tank!'s post confirm that ZiS-S-53 can penetrates Tiger's frontal hull armor :O
EDIT: and also confirm that the 85mm gun is better than Germans and USA 75mm & 76mm because it can penetrate a similar thickness of armour using worst ammunition. But expecially, the test was NOT made by Russians
Engineers are not stupid then all tanks are perfectly projected and every thing work just as planned? (referred to all tanks of all nations) lol
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In 1944 to 1945 the bulk of soviet tanks is still the T34 armed with the inadequate 76 mm weapon which has trouble penetrating 80 mm at combat range. As for the back being 40 mm you are thinking of the IS2 or something similar because the Tiger II's back turret & hull is 80 mm not 40 mm. Look it up.
If you are implying that the thin as a tin can 45 mm at 60 degrees glacis on the T34 (for comparison the deathtrap Sherman: 51 mm at 55 degrees) will adequately protect against 75 mm KwK 40 rounds then you are severely mistaken.
They lost their reliability when they started calling Stugs as Ferdinand tanks and when they put up photoshopped pictures on their site a few years ago.
Its more like 79 % true to 65 % false. Why? The western allies tested numerous German vehicles and communism is deception.RiccardoTheBeAst said:
I would disagree with your conclusion by stating that the soviets had to upcaliber to 85 mm to achieve the performance of a 75 mm & 76 mm. In other words the soviet 85 mm is underperforming for its caliber similar to their 76 mm, 122 mm, ect...RiccardoTheBeAst said:and also confirm that the 85mm gun is better than Germans and USA 75mm & 76mm because it can penetrate a similar thickness of armour using worst ammunition. But expecially, the test was NOT made by Russians
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Wow, people are still arguing which tank is the GREATEST TANK OF WWII?
Srsly guise... that debate was settled a long time ago.
Srsly guise... that debate was settled a long time ago.
I was never arguing about which tank is the best. My original point wasnt that it was the best tank in the war. (even tho it comes very close, afterall it was one of the most successful tank on the battlefield, along witht he Tiger I and Elefant tank destroyer, reported with outstanding kill-to-loss statistics).
I just argued about the fact that the King Tiger was a MUCH stronger armoured tank than any other tank in the war, whether it was of less quality of armor or not. Only an idiot would try and argue otherwise. Earlier posts repeated the Soviet propaganda nonsense that King Tigers had poor armour and just fell apart when hit and split their welds. There is NO EVIDENCE for this.
Jeesh. Well at least the russians had tanks in numbers that could deal with the things if they came across them. This Monster of tank still stopped the Soviets at Budapest, gave the Red Army a bloody struggle in the Battle of Debrecen and even pushed the Soviets back into a retreat. It took the Soviets nearly SEVEN MONTHS after the King Tiger saw first action on the Eastern front to properly push into Germany.
Haha yeah they can do anything now with photoshopped images. I've seen some real corkers that look good, but are still faked. There is NO real picture of any King Tiger's front armor being penetrated by 122mm shells. None of the shots penetrated deeply and despite being hit smack bang on the weld seam, the weld seam DID NOT split open. Haha the 122mm D-25T tank gun which was used on the IS-2 could not even penetrate the King Tiger's sloped front glacis at all, as we now know. Because it had not the needed velocity. Do some reasearch about gun penetrating tests, all of this information is available on the internet. these penetration values were derived from real ballistics tests. Only the high velocity 100mm D-10 anti tank gun from ther SU100 could penetrate the 150mm thick sloped front glacis of the Tiger II at close distance. From 1944-45 there were a few encounters between Tiger II's and IS-2s, but most times I can insure you the King Tiger won. (Just google for Georg Diers, Karl K
I am of the opinion that reposting that graphical explanation of the issue you designed would be most helpful.
Yes, you are right. It's obviously necessary.
It's about time we get some logic and reason in this tread!
manowar wanted to write a song about the IS2 but said that even they couldnt get a proper epic tribute done.
Did Manowar ever do something epic? Besides being an overall epic fail by calling themselves "true" metal and wearing slightly homoerotic pelt shorts.
About the sources, i wouldnt trust to any internet page which tell facts
without showing sources was it german russian or american.
Because source points out where that fact comes from, mostly books.
Loan that book, and sources in end pages usually
point to original documents.
Other thing why i trust to german source more than allied sources and allied sources more than soviet sources is that.
On western countries, products(tanks etc.) are made by companies
and tested by different institution like army and if the product sucks
they change company.
How ever on Soviet Union its all one big institution. So if the Colonel
ranked dude design a tank,(oki now someone comes to say colonels didnt designed tank, but it can be any high rank example. Higher Sientistic Armor
Engineer..jaada jaada)
And a major ranked dude is responsible by testing.
He cant say "You know our enemies got beter ones, this sucks" or he makes his life difficult.
So Soviet tests got that kind of "if Goodyear would make test about
this summer tyres, and it own product would win it, would you trust it"
effect.
Oki but thats about it. What's the difference beetween German and Allied
sources. Its that germans didnt have change to retouch them after the
war.
During the war its really important to keep facts and propaganda separate.
Like allied trainers said to american tank crews that their sherman is the
best tank in the world. The facts would just cause fear on tank crews
which doesnt help anybody.
However in the same time they knew
enough about german tanks, to knowing that Sherman isnt the best and
that they need to maker better and better tanks to be able to knock
down germans more easily. Propaganda to people, Facts to scientists
and Officers.
How ever after the war old facts doesnt have much value anymore.
But propaganda got even bigger value. Its important when the
history writeing starts to be able to retouch the facts so that
history writers are mislead and the nation gets it heroes.
Are the heroes, brave soldiers or brilliant scientists, that doesnt matter.
And why are those propaganda made heroes so important. Well example
your country puts 10 million to training professional runners and then
they go to olympics and loose. What people do then, they questionize,
count money and looses which went to that. Was it reasonable.
But if they win and to home comes only heroes and winner, nobody
doesnt count what went to that, they are all just happy from their heroes.
And because independence of USA wasnt never really under threat they
need even more heroes. Otherwise people would ask, "why my son died
because of France, i dont even like France".
without showing sources was it german russian or american.
Because source points out where that fact comes from, mostly books.
Loan that book, and sources in end pages usually
point to original documents.
Other thing why i trust to german source more than allied sources and allied sources more than soviet sources is that.
On western countries, products(tanks etc.) are made by companies
and tested by different institution like army and if the product sucks
they change company.
How ever on Soviet Union its all one big institution. So if the Colonel
ranked dude design a tank,(oki now someone comes to say colonels didnt designed tank, but it can be any high rank example. Higher Sientistic Armor
Engineer..jaada jaada)
And a major ranked dude is responsible by testing.
He cant say "You know our enemies got beter ones, this sucks" or he makes his life difficult.
So Soviet tests got that kind of "if Goodyear would make test about
this summer tyres, and it own product would win it, would you trust it"
effect.
Oki but thats about it. What's the difference beetween German and Allied
sources. Its that germans didnt have change to retouch them after the
war.
During the war its really important to keep facts and propaganda separate.
Like allied trainers said to american tank crews that their sherman is the
best tank in the world. The facts would just cause fear on tank crews
which doesnt help anybody.
However in the same time they knew
enough about german tanks, to knowing that Sherman isnt the best and
that they need to maker better and better tanks to be able to knock
down germans more easily. Propaganda to people, Facts to scientists
and Officers.
How ever after the war old facts doesnt have much value anymore.
But propaganda got even bigger value. Its important when the
history writeing starts to be able to retouch the facts so that
history writers are mislead and the nation gets it heroes.
Are the heroes, brave soldiers or brilliant scientists, that doesnt matter.
And why are those propaganda made heroes so important. Well example
your country puts 10 million to training professional runners and then
they go to olympics and loose. What people do then, they questionize,
count money and looses which went to that. Was it reasonable.
But if they win and to home comes only heroes and winner, nobody
doesnt count what went to that, they are all just happy from their heroes.
And because independence of USA wasnt never really under threat they
need even more heroes. Otherwise people would ask, "why my son died
because of France, i dont even like France".
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ITT: butthurt Russian fanboy fags are jealous because they got pwnd in ww2.
ITT: butthurt Russian fanboy fags are jealous because they got pwnd in ww2.
U MAD?
ITT: butthurt Russian fanboy fags are jealous because they got pwnd in ww2.
U MAD?
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