4PLAYERS.DE article & Screenshots

[LemoN]

So that's it? That justifies you guys to say that it's CoD or BF copy?
You don't even know how the recon plane works.

I still don't even like the idea of it. It doesn't even matter how it might work, the basic idea is just wrong and unrealistic.

:IS2:

 

[Pvt.Skoko]

Were recon planes used like this in WW2 I don't know the history behind it.....?

 

[LemoN]

Were recon planes used like this in WW2 I don't know the history behind it.....?

Yes, but they only took photographs for HQ's and they were not used to observe a battle.
Having any kind of communication between ground forces and a recon plane is just plain bull.

The only thing that they also were used for is artillery spotting. but that normally only happened for larghe scale arty barrages that were aimed behind enemy lines.

 

[[TW]Wilsonam]

Were recon planes used like this in WW2 I don't know the history behind it.....?

Were recon planes used over the battlefield? Yes, of course...

How much could they spot? Stuff moving out in the open, mostly, as they flew low and slow. Makes them vulnerable, though...

Could they report back? Yes, they carried radios, as well as indicating enemy concentrations by circling over them...

Is it "ultra-realistic"? No - just like we have dramatically simplified arty call procedures in comparison to the real world, so the comms with a recon plane is simplified...

And how much of a game-changer are they? In testing, it is one of those things that is not often available and the commander REALLY needs to pick his moment to use. Could just give you the vital clue - or just tell you what your squad leaders already know

 

[FlyXwire]

Were recon planes used like this in WW2 I don't know the history behind it.....?

For photo recon missions, which required processing and then interpretation (more for planning operations).

The Soviets had few radios at the tactical levels of command anyway.

Liason between aircraft and ground troops required appropriate commincation equipment, reference maps, and training to manage.

Spotting aircraft could fire flares as warning signals, but coordinated intel required radio links and time to develope.

It's still a bit unclear how these recon planes would provide useable information in a game sense......if by overflight, then how instantaneous is the intel being sent, and how. If the intel is "pre-game", then it certainly could be available for pre-planning, but then how up-to-date would it be to changing conditions on the ground? If the idea is to have real time affect, then flare signals would probably be a plausable option, but then how effective would this be to decisions being made on the ground?

Obviously we need more intel too, on this game feature idea.

EDIT: Just saw Alan's response above, and thanks for the clarifications.

 

[Pvt.Skoko]

So will the commander see what the plane is seeing or will he see red dots appearing on the radar?

It would be alright if the commander catches short glimpses of what the plane sees and then has to relay it verbally to the man calling the arty, so then it isn't so arcadey

 

[Vyllis]

Does it work like that?

Plane + radio -> Comm HQ/HQ -> company arty (not modelled in game)-> infantry/tank officers or arty spotters.

I think tripwire want to make this simplest and with a playable way. Not super realistic but quite correct for a game.

 

[Pvt.Skoko]

The new video shows the enemies appearing as red dots

 

[FlyXwire]

The missing footage from the one gameplay video which shadowwill has located illustrates the recon plane's functionality.

YouTube - Gamescom 2010: Prezentacja gry Red Orchestra: Heroes of Stalingrad (część 2)

 

[DraKon2k]

the drunken russian returns at the end

 

[Stormer]

So that's it? That justifies you guys to say that it's CoD or BF copy?
You don't even know how the recon plane works.

stats, ranks! and medals is what i meant

 

[Poerisija]

Were recon planes used over the battlefield? Yes, of course...

How much could they spot? Stuff moving out in the open, mostly, as they flew low and slow. Makes them vulnerable, though...

Could they report back? Yes, they carried radios, as well as indicating enemy concentrations by circling over them...

Is it "ultra-realistic"? No - just like we have dramatically simplified arty call procedures in comparison to the real world, so the comms with a recon plane is simplified...

And how much of a game-changer are they? In testing, it is one of those things that is not often available and the commander REALLY needs to pick his moment to use. Could just give you the vital clue - or just tell you what your squad leaders already know

Do they require 3 kills in a row to call in? And 5 kills for mortar strike and 10 kills for artillery barrage?

Are there red triangles? Why are you making the game casual friendly?

 

[LemoN]

Were recon planes used over the battlefield? Yes, of course...

Send a recon plane over a hot combat zone to spot a handful of soldiers?
I doubt it. Recon planes were usually used to gather photographic evidence of large scale troop movement, fortifications and landscape.

How much could they spot? Stuff moving out in the open, mostly, as they flew low and slow. Makes them vulnerable, though...

I highly doubt that you can see dusty soldiers in a bombed out urban environment from a couple of 100 meters above, let alone differentiate between them.

There was a reason why tanks put up flags and special markings to not be victim of friendly aircraft. And those are TANKS, not 3 riflemen running around in a bombed out city.

Could they report back? Yes, they carried radios, as well as indicating enemy concentrations by circling over them...

No way. Communication between an airplane that can't even spot the difference between tanks and has nothing to do with the ground forces to having contact with your company/regimental mortar/artillery unit is comparing apples to Ferraris.

Is it "ultra-realistic"? No - just like we have dramatically simplified arty call procedures in comparison to the real world, so the comms with a recon plane is simplified...

Calling it "not ultra-realistic" is the same as calling a secret Nazi base on the dark side of the moon controlled by alien robots with a deathstar nearby "slightly fictional".

 

[[TW]Wilsonam]

Do they require 3 kills in a row to call in? And 5 kills for mortar strike and 10 kills for artillery barrage?

Are there red triangles? Why are you making the game casual friendly?

Comes under the ehading of "don't be silly"... but ignoring all that...

We are making the game more accessible. The aim is to attract more people to the RO style of gameplay - not make RO into CoD. If that makes the game more "casual-friendly", then it will be. We want the learning curve to be smaller, less hard. But the gameplay will be at least as "challenging" in its overall complexity. Ideally, it will be much easier for people to learn to play the game - but it will be at least as challenging as ever to get really good at it!

 

[Mormegil]

From the video, it does seem a bit too gamey for me. Sure the arty's simplified, but I figure mortars (and arty requests) were something realistic for a platoon/company leader to call in. I don't think recon planes were used real-time like depicted here. Maybe it'll make the game better, though less realistic.

Well hopefully, it won't be available in the Realism Mode, or at least be tweaked so it won't differentiate between friendlies and hostiles. Perhaps there might be an option for server mods to turn off / reduce the number of recon planes, for the "realism" players.

 

[DraKon2k]

...

You obviously have the wrong expectations. This is not a military simulation created for Army staff.

 

[[TW]Wilsonam]

Send a recon plane over a hot combat zone to spot a handful of soldiers?
I doubt it. Recon planes were usually used to gather photographic evidence of large scale troop movement, fortifications and landscape.

Fiesler 156 "Storch". Specifically designed to carry a crew of two, plus radio, over the battlefield, low and slow, for liaison with ground troops. Also used for a bunch of other support tasks, but they are another matter. One thing they weren't used for was photo-recon - there were other aircraft designed for that. The Germans very rarely indulged in low-level recon anyway - photo-recon was done from much higher altitudes.

Take a look at some of the old Deutsche Wochensau materials - plenty of low-flying Storchs, even resorting to the old comms method of tossing messages out of the window to ground troops. Plenty of anecdotal evidence of troops being warned of enemy troops movements close by.

Mind you, I wouldn't want to be in one of those things if the enemy has light AA on the ground!

 

[DraKon2k]

Mind you, I wouldn't want to be in one of those things if the enemy has light AA on the ground!

Yeah we got it already, we will be able to shoot them down

 

[LemoN]

Comes under the ehading of "don't be silly"... but ignoring all that...

We are making the game more accessible. The aim is to attract more people to the RO style of gameplay - not make RO into CoD. If that makes the game more "casual-friendly", then it will be. We want the learning curve to be smaller, less hard. But the gameplay will be at least as "challenging" in its overall complexity. Ideally, it will be much easier for people to learn to play the game - but it will be at least as challenging as ever to get really good at it!

Making it more accessible is fine, I love features like dialling in sights, cover system, blind fire, destruction and new game modes. But adding in gamey features like a recon aeroplanes to fit the taste of 15 year old MW2 gamers IS changing the game play and not making it more accessible.

Tell me, in what way does a CoD style UAV benefit in making the game more "accessible" and "easier to learn"?

:IS2:

 

[Das Bose]

Making it more accessible is fine, I love features like dialling in sights, cover system, blind fire, destruction and new game modes. But adding in gamey features like a recon aeroplanes to fit the taste of 15 year old MW2 gamers IS changing the game play and not making it more accessible.

Tell me, in what way does a CoD style UAV benefit in making the game more "accessible" and "easier to learn"?

:IS2:

Remember that the game will have a realism mode as well as the relaxed realism. I had an issue with the double zoom when it was first mentioned, but having watched the clips it looks fine

They just want more players and I don't see a problem so far :IS2::IS2: