Dropping ammo

[Old Ranger]

Yes. Somekind of ammo drop should be.

Or if u drop a gun, all of its remaining ammo in it should be in it.


Own edit:
When wave is over, that dropped still gun stays in a map.

But if a weapon is dropped in trader time, that gun disappear if not picked up while the store is still open.

 

[9_6]

You can already drop guns, if someone is out of ammo, drop them your alternative gun.

 

[nutterbutter]

No, no , no.

Dropping ammo only reinforces the poor play of barricading. Some Medic who only heals will be sharing ammo with people with more powerful weapons.

Want to make it so only support can share? Same thing. Support guy drops a "magic" crate that just so happens to have the exact type of ammo that the player needs.

There is already too much ammo and money in the game now. Why people want to make the game even easier or more boring is beyond me. The game is fun when there is some risk involved. When players can die and the entire team can lose. Continually stacking the game in the players' favor is ruining the game.

 

[Major Liability]

The way OP described it would certainly be overpowered. Some guy who just spawned with a 9mm could drop an ammo box for a fully loaded support and give him tons of ammo.

It's a good idea, but I'd rather be able to drop one magazine (or 10 LAR rounds, 8 pump-action shells, etc.) that counts as one magazine ONLY for the gun you have out when you pick it up. Also, 9mm ammo should be undroppable, because it is incredibly cheap and you spawn with it.

 

[C_Gibby]

The way OP described it would certainly be overpowered. Some guy who just spawned with a 9mm could drop an ammo box for a fully loaded support and give him tons of ammo.

It's a good idea, but I'd rather be able to drop one magazine (or 10 LAR rounds, 8 pump-action shells, etc.) that counts as one magazine ONLY for the gun you have out when you pick it up. Also, 9mm ammo should be undroppable, because it is incredibly cheap and you spawn with it.

Read much? D:

I said that people shouldn't be able to exploit this, because they wouldn't be able to drop 9mm ammo to e.g. fill M79 ammo.

 

[nutterbutter]

Read much? D:

I said that people shouldn't be able to exploit this, because they wouldn't be able to drop 9mm ammo to e.g. fill M79 ammo.

Think much? D:

Medic with a SCAR can drop 14 magazines. Each of those magazine will provide "one full load for each weapon they have." So a single magazine will give ammo to every weapon a fully loaded support person has?

Or what if a lvl 3 medic and a level 6 sharpie is playing? Since the sharpie now has almost double the ammo, it is effectively 2 lvl 6 sharpies playing.

Dropping ammo is nothing but exploiting the game. And making it much easier.

 

[C_Gibby]

Think much? D:

Medic with a SCAR can drop 14 magazines. Each of those magazine will provide "one full load for each weapon they have." So a single magazine will give ammo to every weapon a fully loaded support person has?

Or what if a lvl 3 medic and a level 6 sharpie is playing? Since the sharpie now has almost double the ammo, it is effectively 2 lvl 6 sharpies playing.

Dropping ammo is nothing but exploiting the game. And making it much easier.

Troll much? D:

I meant that if someone is to drop, say, 9mm ammo, it would mean that they would drop ONLY 9mm ammo to restock someone's 9mm. It looks like you didn't read and just wanted to argue.

And how is dropping ammo in general an exploit? When you drop ammo, you trust people with your own ammo. You lose ammo, so the other player gains extra ammo in turn.

Think much?

 

[nutterbutter]

I meant that if someone is to drop, say, 9mm ammo, it would mean that they would drop ONLY 9mm ammo to restock someone's 9mm. It looks like you didn't read and just wanted to argue.

I didn't read? You just said "I meant that..."

When a player picks up the dropped ammo crate, they should receive a full load per weapon they have, as if they picked one up at a normal ammo spawn point.

I read exactly what you wrote and what you meant. It is a bad idea and makes the game much easier.

A

nd how is dropping ammo in general an exploit? When you drop ammo, you trust people with your own ammo.

I am a lvl 3 medic, another player is a lvl 6 sharpie, and the other player is a lvl 6 commando. If I drop SCAR ammo and M14 ammo, then that ammo has now transformed from being used by a medic and no perk bonuses to having lvl 6 bonuses.

Sure, let's just double the ammo for our lvl 6 players. That won't affect the game, huh?

That is how it is an exploit.

 

[Major Liability]

Read much? D:

Yes.

And here is the problem:

When players pick up an ammo crate, they get one full load for each weapon they have.

So you can drop one bullpup magazine, and an SS with M14, handcannons, and an M79 will get ammo for each of his weapons. That's magical ammo creation, and it's OP.

Make the ammo drops worth ONE MAGAZINE and ONLY for the weapon you have out when you pick it up. Then it would be balanced, and would contribute to the co-op gameplay.

 

[C_Gibby]

Yes.

And here is the problem:



So you can drop one bullpup magazine, and an SS with M14, handcannons, and an M79 will get ammo for each of his weapons. That's magical ammo creation, and it's OP.

Make the ammo drops worth ONE MAGAZINE and ONLY for the weapon you have out when you pick it up. Then it would be balanced, and would contribute to the co-op gameplay.

*facepalmtree for self*

I shoulda put "E.g. if they have only a 9mm, they will only drop 9mm ammo, and if they have a bullpup, they will drop only bullpup ammo"

 

[Major Liability]

It is a good idea, and it would make the LAW less underpowered if players with an abundance of ammo (like dual assault rifle commandos or M14 SS) sacrificed a bit to keep the rocket launcher guy resupplied.

If you were going for realism you could have the exact type of ammo drop. That way there wouldn't be any ammo transmutation and people with similar ammo could share across perk lines. For example an M14 user could give a SCAR user ammo or someone with an M32 could resupply an M79 user, but if you're using a unique weapon like the crossbow you'd be on your own unless someone else also has one.

 

[Vaecrius]

No, no , no.

Dropping ammo only reinforces the poor play of barricading.

Agreed.

And going back to my earlier point... if this is done in enough detail to keep it from being broken-exploitable rather than merely boring-gameplay-exploitable, it would be so fiddly you'd have to hole up somewhere so you can drop and count and pick up all the right stuff.

I play KF for running around shooting stuff, not Starcraft-style learn-a-bazillion-menu-combos-by-rote resource management.

 

[Uk1t4k3]

Support specialist need more ammo for AA12 so this idea could easily solve the issue of lacking ammo.

 

[WhiteTigerShiro]

lol yea, this idea would definately need some polishing before it could be implemented.

I think it would be better if Support Specialists could buy some sort of ammo packs from the trader which he could then drop to his teammates or to himself if needed. They could take up one or two slots of weight too. And obviously there would be a limit of how many boxes he can carry, perhaps determined by his level. Something like, level one could carry 1 ammobox, and it would increase by one box each level, so lvl6 would have 6 boxes. Or is that too much??

But oh well, I doubt TW is ever gonna implement this.

Definitely a cool idea, and I say this as someone who mains Support. Only problem is that being able to drop an ammo cache feels like it would minimize the value in having to conserve ammo. It becomes a slippery slope.

On the one hand, they could leave ammo as-is and implement the ammo cache anyway. Then you have the M14/SCAR problem where every gun in the game has way too plentiful of ammo, and it destroys the aspect of the game where it becomes necessary to carry two weapons. Except that now it's applied to every weapon instead of just the two.

Then on the other hand, they could reduce the amount of ammo held by each weapon. Then it creates the problem where these crates are TOO vital, and any team without a Support Specialist is completely crippled. As a result, you'd end-up seeing just as many Support players as there are currently Sharpshooters; which is to say, at least 3 per server.

So it's a cool idea, but probably one that would probably have to wait until a Killing Floor 2 where they could balance the system from the ground-up around the idea of deployable ammo caches.

 

[Compass]

Another way to balance it out.

Have the Support be able to drop a 30 second ammo resupply crate. It is the size of a gun chest and glows green like normal items. (magically pops out of his back pocket, where he stores the LAW)

Ammo Crate
Weight 5
Cost $200, Takes Shotgun Discounts
Cannot be Dropped/Stacked
Discarded when Used

Once deployed, you can use it as an AMMO DISPENSER for 30 seconds. There's a catch, though. Ammo for a gun will be it's 1/10th of its undiscounted price, or its undiscounted reload value, whichever is MORE.

So...
Handgun Ammo - 15 Bullets $15
Handcannon Ammo - 8 Bullets $50
XBow Ammo - 1 Bolt $40
Hunting Shotgun Ammo - 2 Shells $75
AA12 Ammo - 20 Shells $400
SCAR Ammo - 20 Bullets $250
M14 Ammo - 20 Bullets $250
M32 Ammo - 6 Grenades $250
Flamethrower Ammo - 1 Tank $75
MP7M Ammo - 20 Bullets $300
PB Ammo - 1 PB $400.

So in other words, the more expensive your primary gun, the more difficult it is to buy magazines and justify the cost. The cost of obtaining the chest is negligible, because it provides no benefit by itself, and the expensive price of ammo when compared to a trader which could be much sooner makes it a much harder choice than simply running up to a crate and grabbing it. It also makes you vulnerable to attack when you're using the ammo crate. Money spent to the crate is simply removed from the game. It is not given to the Support Specialist, donated to the poor, or sent to finance Horzine's monsters. Or is it?

 

[WhiteTigerShiro]

An interesting thought. Rather than the ammo being free once the cache is dropped, it would open a sort of "mini trader" menu that only lets you buy ammo at an inflated price. This would be a little more balancing were it not for the fact that money is plentiful once you have your weapon.

When I'm ending every wave with over $1,000 (yeah, I know it's UK currency, but I don't know how to get that symbol =P), I'm not gonna think twice about spending twice as much, or even three times as much money on ammo. So it brings us back to the issue of inflating ammunition in a game where wise usage of ammo against the right opponent is key to surviving the round.

The only way I could think to balance this at all would be that the Support Specialist would drop the cache, and everyone can use it once to get a single ammo crate's worth of ammo. Even then, however, we're basically talking the equivalent of 6 ammo crates being spawned within handy reaching distance. Even though it's being spread-out amongst the team, that's still a lot of extra ammo being added to the wave.

 

[Compass]

$1000 is still a lot for 4 magazines, and there's no guarantee that you'll live even with extra ammo, so dying and wasting $1000 on ammo that doesn't help is another way of balancing it out.

 

[Undedd Jester]

Yes to drop ammo. But I think that if I drop one bully clip, it should contain one bullyclip and nothing else.

Other than that I think it's a great idea.

Kissies and Huggies /Anemia

If added, only this ^

Although personally I don't see the need for it. Even as Firebug I almost never run out of ammo myself.

 

[C_Gibby]

If added, only this ^

Although personally I don't see the need for it. Even as Firebug I almost never run out of ammo myself.

[herp] Exactly what I meant in the first place. [/derp] And I made this thread a few months ago, anyway

But there is another idea I'd like to discuss: Should perk discounts apply to ammo as well?

 

[Undedd Jester]

I wouldn't say so, I feel the money situation is pretty well balanced myself in general, although I will admit the ammo prices for some weapons needs to be balanced a little better. Some weapons ammo is insanely high priced and others are just pathetically cheap.

I worked out that when buying Crossbow ammo, if you have less than 33 bolts of ammo it is cheaper to sell and rebuy. Now 10 or 15 bolts that would make sense, but 33 out of 40? Something needs to be done. Price bump for Xbow seems fair.

But yes now that I have reread your OP, I realised you meant 1 clip/mag of ammo from each weapon to go into the ammo box. So it is the direct oposite of what happens when you pick up an ammo box. Not sure I like the idea, especially since none medics with the Mp7 get like 18 clips overall. There should be a total ammo cost for the clips that go into the ammo box. e.g. if all you have is a pistol and you drop an ammo crate, it should take maybe 3 or 4 clips of ammo to make up the cost replenishing ammo for other weapons. HS for example will get very few extra rounds from dropped pistol ammo, whereas the AA12 will get quite alot of ammo.

Of course even with this idea, ammo prices still need to be rebalanced.