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Squad leader - arty friendlyfire

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PETERPANs

PETERPANs

Grizzled Veteran
Jul 10, 2009
505
106
#1
Example:
1. You mark capping area and send arty there - all enemy is wiped out.
2. than suddenly your teammates capture objective zone while your arty still firing zone.
3. after that new spawns of your teammates will spawn here and same arty which still fire kill them all. Several times ...
4. you are kicked from server ...

There is lot of other examples, sometimes players - newcomwers dont respect your warnings to not going to area of arty strike ...

That should be fixed, sometimes is hard to do squad leader job due to that. Suggestions:
1. allow squad leader to stop arty strike by radio if something is wrong (I know that you cant stop rounds in the air but you can stop to fire another waves of them. Waves which you succesfuly stop will stay available for another strikes.
2. allow squad leader to manage number of strikes, some zones require only 2 waves some other zones 5 or more ...
3. change friendly fire for arty strike - only for squad leaders - for example you can kill more of your side by arty, arty is not like firearm its very hard to prevent casualties sometimes, or give us better "NO PROBLEM" option for arty strike deaths.
 
#4
Reducing friendly fire penalty for killing teammates with artillery would be good. Compared with new forgive/votekick system could nicely work. For example you get kicked for 3 unforgiven team kills with normal weapon and 6 unforgiven team kills with artillery. Forgiven team kills dont not effect penalties except minus points on scoreboard and reinforcements.
 
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#5
Apos said:
Reducing friendly fire penalty for killing teammates with artillery would be good. Compared with new forgive/votekick system could nicely work. For example you get kicked for 3 unforgiven team kills with normal weapon and 6 unforgiven team kills with artillery. Forgiven team kills dont not effect penalties except minus points on scoreboard and reinforcements.
Click to expand...

By default A grenade kill counts for half a tk. And artillery counts for 1/5th a tk. So that is already there.
 
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#8
Interesting suggestions, but shouldn't you try not to drop arty where players need to go... in other words (example), instead of dropping it on the objective, drop it behind the objective to prevent enemy reinforcements from reaching the area, or at least delay them?

Not criticizing your suggestions by the way...
 
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#9
=GG= Mr Moe said:
Interesting suggestions, but shouldn't you try not to drop arty where players need to go... in other words (example), instead of dropping it on the objective, drop it behind the objective to prevent enemy reinforcements from reaching the area, or at least delay them?

Not criticizing your suggestions by the way...
Click to expand...

The biggest issue is after your area is capped and the arty keeps on falling even though you need to move to the next objective. Sometimes if the enemy is heavily entrenched into a cap zone it can be best to put arty right on top on half the cap zone and attack the other side.

The issue is in how to communicate things well, so you wont get kicked. And how to differentiate between arty with a good intention and arty with a bad tk intention.
 
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#11
As mentioned, arty damage, penalty is server configurable. Sadly, however, this phenomenon is one of the necessary trade-offs of gameplay caused by ne'er do wells that intentionally drop arty on their own team. If the caller knows that the objective being bombarded will become the next spawn point, perhaps he should be a little more careful with the placement. If the caller is not aware of that fact, then he just learned.

Having said that, being able to cancel arty is a good idea. But I wonder how many people hang around the radio after calling in a strike? By the time they returned to it, the strike would probably pretty well be over.....
 
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#12
Artillery strikes sometimes must be risky to works fine. Best example is basovka, 1st line of trenches. If Axis officer get to the radio and use it usually he drop arty on left side of trenches which is in hands of enemy (right side is in smoke, officer made succesfull rush). Axis team should get into trenches too using right side of the map. Many many players just run straight into enemy and don't bother artillery or situation on the map.

Zetsumei, i didn't know that (I'm such a noob - lol).

Anyway team killing system should be improved. I played yestarday in Darkest Hour and i was ******** of teamkillers. I know RO:O votekick system is ancient and i believe HoS will have better votekick/ban menu, but there might be a triggers which kick mean players fast. I'm thinking about auto kick/session ban for players who killed 2 and more players on respawn. One TK in respawn area might be accident, but two and more not. Session bans bcos rude players come back after getting kicked and start team killing again till next kick.
 
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#13
The only idea that I support is the ability for the squad leader to stop the artillery barrage. If he can call it in, he should, technically, be able to stop it.

Placing poor artillery is the squad leader's fault and getting kicked is the just reward. Team-killing is very important feature in the game (when it happens from stupid decisions and not from "stupidity), so I don't think adding features to mend that would suit the game.
 
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#14
OneBloodyHero said:
Placing poor artillery is the squad leader's fault and getting kicked is the just reward.
Click to expand...

Even though it's rare I've seen squad leaders getting kicked even when they placed a good artillery inbetween their current objective and their spawn as after the first barrage the objective was captured and almost everyone proceeded to rush towards the last objective (Basovka train station in this case) and 20 seconds later the SL got kicked due too many teamkills.

Instead of taking a note of both visual (boom boom) and audio (bang bang, shells falling in) cues and actually going around to avoid it they made Lemmings look like highly intelligent beings.
 
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#15
OneBloodyHero said:
The only idea that I support is the ability for the squad leader to stop the artillery barrage. If he can call it in, he should, technically, be able to stop it.

Placing poor artillery is the squad leader's fault and getting kicked is the just reward. Team-killing is very important feature in the game (when it happens from stupid decisions and not from "stupidity), so I don't think adding features to mend that would suit the game.
Click to expand...

It shouldn't be :rolleyes:
 
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#16
I've gotten kicked several times for team-killing with artillery barrages. I took a risk and placed it too near an objective, and got kicked. Other times people blindly went into the artillery and that amounted to me getting kicked. I try to tell people over voice command that the artillery falling is friendly and that they should avoid it. Also, I usually announce over voice chat where I will place artillery, so others know not to go in that area. But, people still go and I usually get one tk.

I think using voice chat is the best way to go; if they don't speak your language, lol, well then your are royally screwed. Team-killing is a part of the game, and can be avoided through voice chat; if not, servers, like suggested previously, should reduce tk damage for friendly artillery deaths.
 
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#17
can't blame others if you made a bad call, and by bad i mean downright stupid. most every map allows you to safely put arty between the capzone and the enemy's approach to it. the issue is the placement of the spawnzone upon capturing objectives. imo many maps aren't setup well as capzones will turn into spawnzones right after the objective is captured. an experienced SL knows when and where to put the arty depending on the situation, whereas inexperienced players may run into trouble with what appeared to be "good calls" gone "bad". regardless of the map layout, it's part of the game and players need to learn the role, learn how to use arty and learn when and where to use it for each and every map. it's all trial and error.

as for canceling an arty strike, i think it'd be a little too unrealistic to immediately stop arty from coming down. in RL once those guns start firing, the shells are on their way. in the time it'd take you to radio the gunners to cease fire, they'd already be through firing the typical 3 salvos that come with each firemission. ff is part of the game just as it was part of real war. mistakes are made, people are killed, bad things happen.
 
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#18
It would be nice if Squad leader had some more options. I like the idea of selecting how much arty will come down, perhaps still let mapper have some control of max salvos but I don't know how realistic that will be.

Another thing I might suggest is expanding on overhead map(If its added). Say have a feature like "Rally Point" only for arty so you can show your team where it will be. Or perhaps have the area where the arty icon is be shaded RED so it will get some more attention(Working off what is in RO:Ost).
 
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#19
-[SiN]-bswearer said:
as for canceling an arty strike, i think it'd be a little too unrealistic to immediately stop arty from coming down. in RL once those guns start firing, the shells are on their way. in the time it'd take you to radio the gunners to cease fire, they'd already be through firing the typical 3 salvos that come with each firemission. ff is part of the game just as it was part of real war. mistakes are made, people are killed, bad things happen.
Click to expand...
The OP didn't suggest that the salvo on the way be cancelled, just those yet to be fired. But like you say, by the time you realize the error its probably too late to cancel any but the last.
 
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#20
Theoretically speaking if there would be abstracted version of Forward Observer class in some maps (let's say in bigger ones) he could react faster in terms of being able to stop the fire to some degree - or start adjusting it and thus delaying any further barrages until new coordinates are given.

Personally I would like to see a class like that if they could make a reasonable system how to direct fire without making it complete cluster**** while alot more difficult\demanding than simply clicking mouse button twice.
 
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