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Specimenation Versus Mod vs. 200 and over

I agree with u dude but dude I said many times it shall be ADVANCED OPTION like OPTIONAL not like original for mod! XD
But ok, well, I think this is it, no more bugs etc I guess... lol? Or maybe? NAH not any MORE than last time... just probably Server probs... ask Lethal Vortex anyways he's the one who has probs with his server, probably cuz of mod = 32/32 limit, his server limit = 12/12, when 13th joins his server crashes...
There are still tons of bugs.


  • Human players see the insides/backs of their own heads
  • Stalkers are never visible, even when attacking
  • Commandos still see stalkers as cloaked, however, this may be due to lack of real perks
  • Bots don't work at all (at least for me, no matter how many I add, they all die at the beginning and are never heard from again)
  • Gorefasts can't strafe at all (I think this added a challenge to playing against gorefasts, at least make it optional)
  • IMPORTANT: The trader dynamic has been entirely ruined. I don't get how it's supposed to be working at -all- right now. It was better when you had a set amount of zombies coming, and no more than that spawned, and after that you have a set amount of time to buy stuff at the trader- safely. My guess is that the zombies come endlessly because our programmer hasn't yet figured out how to make them stop coming. Either that, or he for some reason decided to ruin what Tripwire decided to base the game on- waves.
  • Bloats easily get stuck on walls
  • Scrake has way too much trouble hitting people
  • Fleshpound doesn't seem to get stronger during rage, and usually seems to have far-too-low health
  • Patriarch can heal whenever, even if he's not hurt (i.e. beyond whatever his max health is set to)
  • Patriarch bazooka and machine gun take long to fire, and if you try to fire again, it resets timer
  • Players start out with far too little ammo, and with dual 9mms which makes it worse, as ammo is used faster unless you drop a gun
  • grenades randomly disappear from inventories, appear in other players inventories (shared grenades...?)
  • humans can sometimes changerace to revive self before trader, although it's harder on this new version
  • Often, zombies attack on their end, but humans don't see it on their end, and often, the zombie dies before dealing any damage, even though on their end, they attacked successfully, sometimes even as often as several times on their end, with not a single attempted attack on human's end
  • zombies seem to lag badly on their own ends, even with more than sufficient PC power, even over LAN (i.e. in my house), so, I know it's the mod, as normal killing floor on the same connection with the same PCs plays flawlessly
I'll add more as we think of them.

And don't get me wrong. I like this mod. I'm not putting it down in any way. But at the same time, I don't want the consensus to be that this mod is almost done, when to me, it seems like in-dev or maybe alpha.
 
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  • Human players see the insides/backs of their own heads
  • Stalkers are never visible, even when attacking
  • Commandos still see stalkers as cloaked, however, this may be due to lack of real perks
  • Gorefasts can't strafe at all (I think this added a challenge to playing against gorefasts, at least make it optional)
  • Bloats easily get stuck on walls
  • Scrake has way too much trouble hitting people
  • Fleshpound doesn't seem to get stronger during rage, and usually seems to have far-too-low health
  • Patriarch can heal whenever, even if he's not hurt (i.e. beyond whatever his max health is set to)
  • Patriarch bazooka and machine gun take long to fire, and if you try to fire again, it resets timer
  • grenades randomly disappear from inventories, appear in other players inventories (shared grenades...?)
  • humans can sometimes changerace to revive self before trader, although it's harder on this new version
  • Often, zombies attack on their end, but humans don't see it on their end, and often, the zombie dies before dealing any damage, even though on their end, they attacked successfully, sometimes even as often as several times on their end, with not a single attempted attack on human's end
  • zombies seem to lag badly on their own ends, even with more than sufficient PC power, even over LAN (i.e. in my house), so, I know it's the mod, as normal killing floor on the same connection with the same PCs plays flawlessly

I agree on those, with some little notifications:
Stalkers, the BOT stalkers, work well, u still can see them well as commando, but HUMAN stalkers not, u can c only their healths, but it dun need fix since commando SEES them, due to their health!
Strafe, as I said before, ye, shall be added back, BUT for gorefast, Scrake and FP shall disable walking forward and backward, and walking forward and backward shall make them unable to strafe.
Pat shooting, well dude, the minigun DOESN'T reset timer, BUT Bazooka does, which is bad.
Healing of Pat = I AGREE! It's lame he can heal at very beginning, there shall be a limit to 100%...

There are still tons of bugs.
  • Bots don't work at all (at least for me, no matter how many I add, they all die at the beginning and are never heard from again)
  • IMPORTANT: The trader dynamic has been entirely ruined. I don't get how it's supposed to be working at -all- right now. It was better when you had a set amount of zombies coming, and no more than that spawned, and after that you have a set amount of time to buy stuff at the trader- safely. My guess is that the zombies come endlessly because our programmer hasn't yet figured out how to make them stop coming. Either that, or he for some reason decided to ruin what Tripwire decided to base the game on- waves.
  • Players start out with far too little ammo, and with dual 9mms which makes it worse, as ammo is used faster unless you drop a gun
Those I disagree at. First of all those are not MAJOR bugs, it's not really a big deal!

Bots a little are bad, I agree, but depends on what difficulty u play at! Remember bots aren't meant to play at Suicidal and Hard! :)

Fro trader, I already said what I think. It shall be OPTIONAL to make it normal, and OPTIONAL to make it as it is now! :)

Ammo at the start isn't prob as all what comes at 1st wave are bloats, gorefasts and clots. Even with only a knife u can make it with no prob.
 
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I agree on those, with some little notifications:
Stalkers, the BOT stalkers, work well, u still can see them well as commando, but HUMAN stalkers not, u can c only their healths, but it dun need fix since commando SEES them, due to their health!
Actually, it does need a fix. When a stalker attacks you, that normally means you failed to see them. No one zombie is meant to kill you by itself until you get into the higher ranking ones. Normally, you get hit by a stalker, you swear at your team's commando, and you kill it, since it's now visible. But with things the way they are, human stalkers can actually run away and toy with you, and catching something invisible out of the corner of your eye isn't helpful. This is a bug, and NEEDS to be fixed.

Strafe, as I said before, ye, shall be added back, BUT for gorefast, Scrake and FP shall disable walking forward and backward, and walking forward and backward shall make them unable to strafe.
I don't think you get to say what shall and shall not be done, but, you may have just phrased it wrong. FP is slow and should be able to strafe while not in rage. Scrake should be able to Strafe when he's not lunging, as he too, is slow. The gorefast is weak, and should be able to strafe at all times. It adds a bit of challenge to it, otherwise they are just easy kills when humans play them. I mean, the computer gorefasts can strafe, I'm sure of it. At the very least, it should be an options:

[ ] Gorefasts can Strafe?

Pat shooting, well dude, the minigun DOESN'T reset timer, BUT Bazooka does, which is bad.
Sorry, that was phrased slightly wrong. The minigun doesn't reset its own timer, but it resets the bazooka's.

Healing of Pat = I AGREE! It's lame he can heal at very beginning, there shall be a limit to 100%...
Exactly. Also, I'm not sure on this, but isn't the real patriarch only able to heal three times?

Those I disagree at. First of all those are not MAJOR bugs, it's not really a big deal!
Maybe not in your opinion. I wouldn't say they are game-breaking, but I would classify them as major, above minor, but below urgent.

Bots a little are bad, I agree, but depends on what difficulty u play at! Remember bots aren't meant to play at Suicidal and Hard! :)
Maybe I wasn't clear. They aren't there. If I have, say, three bots, once we pick teams, there are three messages at the bottom saying they have died, and then there are no bots for the rest of the game on either team. Do you understand?

Fro trader, I already said what I think. It shall be OPTIONAL to make it normal, and OPTIONAL to make it as it is now! :)
I don't get what the appeal of the current setup is. It just seems broken. Zombies keep coming, the trader door never closes, and if you waste time killing them all, you have like, 3 seconds left to trade.

Ammo at the start isn't prob as all what comes at 1st wave are bloats, gorefasts and clots. Even with only a knife u can make it with no prob.
I'm a sharpshooter, and I almost never miss, and I rarely don't hit the enemy in the head. There hasn't been a single match (and I've played around 20) that I haven't run out of ammo before the wave ended, and especially not before all the zombies were dead and I could actually trade. I don't know how amazingly skilled you're pretending to be, but it's damned difficult to kill a bloat with a dagger unless you're a berserker.
 
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  • Human players see the insides/backs of their own heads
That can be fixed its a listen bug.
  • Stalkers are never visible, even when attacking
dont want them to be since its human stalker there are much less stalkers than in real game so these stalkers stay invisible and are more deadly than regular because remember theres only 6 specimens other than a few clots so... balance.
  • Commandos still see stalkers as cloaked, however, this may be due to lack of real perks
because I like girls and i am jealous other men see the stalker.
  • Bots don't work at all (at least for me, no matter how many I add, they all die at the beginning and are never heard from again)
Bots were never meant to be...
  • Gorefasts can't strafe at all (I think this added a challenge to playing against gorefasts, at least make it optional)
You must of never played gorefast when he had strafe. I took out strafe as of b3 because he kicked the most *** sideways.
  • IMPORTANT: The trader dynamic has been entirely ruined. I don't get how it's supposed to be working at -all- right now. It was better when you had a set amount of zombies coming, and no more than that spawned, and after that you have a set amount of time to buy stuff at the trader- safely. My guess is that the zombies come endlessly because our programmer hasn't yet figured out how to make them stop coming. Either that, or he for some reason decided to ruin what Tripwire decided to base the game on- waves.
The original gameplay does not work with this gametype because:

It limits spawning.

Humans camp easier.

Don't insult me and my programming before you even know what code I am handling, its completely obvious that this game mode is a subclass of the original gamemode and so the obvious continuous waves was a OVERRIDE of the limited waves.

The gamemode's fun part for the specimens is surprise and funny situations, Human specimens are not bots, I repeat not bots, they like to have freedom of areas to spawn.

This is versus and if you ever tried all the other versions you'd not suggest this.

  • Bloats easily get stuck on walls
What walls...Be specific of the situations.
  • Scrake has way too much trouble hitting people
See the centre of your screen? Get it on your player when you attack, or get lessons from Benvio.
  • Fleshpound doesn't seem to get stronger during rage, and usually seems to have far-too-low health
FlesPound health is actually more than the original one and it dies slower than the original, and so you must suck at using him at apropriate areas, situations.
  • Patriarch can heal whenever, even if he's not hurt (i.e. beyond whatever his max health is set to)
What would be the point you'll still use the same amount of healing.
  • Patriarch bazooka and machine gun take long to fire, and if you try to fire again, it resets timer
This is stupid. Are you a level 0 playing beginner? You ever seen patriarch instant fire his minigun?
  • Players start out with far too little ammo, and with dual 9mms which makes it worse, as ammo is used faster unless you drop a gun
Find a gun.
  • grenades randomly disappear from inventories, appear in other players inventories (shared grenades...?)
I don't know I dont mess with grenade code and how do you know its other players inventories (god?).
  • humans can sometimes changerace to revive self before trader, although it's harder on this new version
What waves. I remember it was possible in first wave but the rest of waves its not.
  • Often, zombies attack on their end, but humans don't see it on their end, and often, the zombie dies before dealing any damage, even though on their end, they attacked successfully, sometimes even as often as several times on their end, with not a single attempted attack on human's end
It you don't get feedback, you didn't hit, if you get feedback, and the human doesn't budge, its a noob.
  • zombies seem to lag badly on their own ends, even with more than sufficient PC power, even over LAN (i.e. in my house), so, I know it's the mod, as normal killing floor on the same connection with the same PCs plays flawlessly
I'll see to it.

I'll add more as we think of them.
Please think hard.

And don't get me wrong. I like this mod. I'm not putting it down in any way. But at the same time, I don't want the consensus to be that this mod is almost done, when to me, it seems like in-dev or maybe alpha



Well beta and alpha stages depend on the developer. The developer states what he or she wants and that what sets the stages. In my stage right now, I am ironing bugs, and adding non useful add ins just for the eyes. If you look at the first page, and see what I was aiming to do, I have basically done all that I said I would do, meaning, my aim is done, and now the corrections are being made. The only reason there is some unstability and some bugs is not because of my code but because of incapabilities with the original code, and replication. Bugs such as entering game as spectator is a code I can't even imagine what the problem.
 
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Its actually quite easy to decap a bloat with a knife, if you time it properly.

But its still easier and hassle free to just use a pistol shot or 2
That is entirely missing the point. XD I have some trouble with it as a sharpshooter, but, I was more speaking about the people I play with, as I was trying to include their problems as well. I didn't care much about the ammo thing, but I do agree that it's a concern.

Human players see the insides/backs of their own headsThat can be fixed its a listen bug.
Awesome.

dont want them to be since its human stalker there are much less stalkers than in real game so these stalkers stay invisible and are more deadly than regular because remember theres only 6 specimens other than a few clots so... balance.
I agree with you to some extent, but at the same time, they can attack continually without giving away their position. it seems like it should at least be optional.

because I like girls and i am jealous other men see the stalker.
I imagine this would fit in with the last question's answer, so if it is option, also have it optional to fix it for commandos.

Bots were never meant to be...
I don't know what you mean by this. Why would you be able to add bots if they don't do anything? As I clarified in a later post, they don't even spawn. I just get messages saying they have died, and that is it. I never see anything but their guns.

You must of never played gorefast when he had strafe. I took out strafe as of b3 because he kicked the most *** sideways.
No, I did play as them. It was badass. This could go in the same category of balancing the stalkers. Gorefasts are one-hit-kills, so it sucks that they can't even strafe. Most of the time, the lack of strafe is what gets them killed. When they could strafe, it was challenging, and awesome. It made the zombies harder, and in my opinion, made the game more fun. As I said earlier, I think it should at least be optional.

The original gameplay does not work with this gametype because:

It limits spawning.

Humans camp easier.
Well then turn up the number of zombies so there is still a good human to normal zombie ratio, while still providing the zombies with an adequate number of turns or something.

I mean, I just don't get what the trade sequence is supposed to be doing. We all get to the trader, the door doesn't close, zombies keep pouring in, and we basically have to take turns fending them off, and not all of us get to trade. I don't get how that is fun, as it just gets the people who couldn't trade upset, and they die the next wave, and usually want to quit.

Don't insult me and my programming before you even know what code I am handling, its completely obvious that this game mode is a subclass of the original gamemode and so the obvious continuous waves was a OVERRIDE of the limited waves.
That is obvious to an extent, except that I don't know who or what overrided it. It's possible something in their code stopped them from working, just as it stops perks from working. I wasn't at all intending to insult your programming. If you read earlier, I even offered you some web space and a CMS to post changes in versions and post potential features in new versions, and receive feedback as you're coding, without having to wait for a release, rather than just having a thread here. You could even have an [email protected] to get mod-related stuff sent to.

The gamemode's fun part for the specimens is surprise and funny situations, Human specimens are not bots, I repeat not bots, they like to have freedom of areas to spawn.
I'm aware of that. I'm not sure what you're responding to. The only thing I can think of is of humans having trouble spawning because it says they are in the line of site, but, that seems to have been majorly improved in the newest version, and only happens occasionally. I can't comment any more than that since I'm not sure what context you're saying this in.

This is versus and if you ever tried all the other versions you'd not suggest this.
Suggest what? I've played all versions of standard Killing Floor. And I know tons of people that think the trader should be normal. I mean, at least enable an option or something for it, and just turn up the zombies or something. I mean, WE could even turn up the difficulty.

What walls...Be specific of the situations.
Sorry, my fault, I was very tired when I wrote all that. Usually hallways, or parts of things where there are two wall edges very near each other, it can be difficult to navigate between them, like a part of the bloat's body that the player cannot see is getting stuck, you know?

See the centre of your screen? Get it on your player when you attack, or get lessons from Benvio.
Don't condescend to me. I don't need lessons. I can usually hit fairly accurately with the Scrake, but I do admit it's difficult. You have to get a hair-thin line on the center of your screen over your target to hit. I just think said line should be a bit thicker, as most players I've played with (many pretty skilled) die without landing a single hit.

And who the crap is Benvio? BenioX? If Benvio isn't actually his name, this is hilarious after he was pretending to be a like, hotshot best friend beta-tester of yours. XD

FlesPound health is actually more than the original one and it dies slower than the original, and so you must suck at using him at apropriate areas, situations.
I'm sorry if your ego was bruised from thinking I insulted your programming or whatever, but stop insulting me, and trying to blame instances of potential bugs on me sucking. This particular complaint isn't even from me, but someone in my group. I haven't tested any of it on the new version yet, except that rage seems to reset itself if they click it multiple times, and rage doesn't seem to make it stronger.

What would be the point you'll still use the same amount of healing.
It's the same reason you can't use your healing gun and heal yourself to 10000% health while hiding in a room and then going out and fighting as a human. The max health is geared toward the difficulty you're on and the number of players, as I'm sure you know. This makes it so it has X amount of health and can take Y amount of fire before having to retreat and heal.

Not only does it gear the health toward the damage these players can likely deal, given their numbers and the difficulty they are on, but it promotes you actually playing like the patriarch is supposed to play, where you fight, and then retreat and heal. If they can do it at the beginning, they will just heal up right away, and then run in, going all out. It changes the strategy, and the gameplay. How's that for a reason?

This is stupid. Are you a level 0 playing beginner? You ever seen patriarch instant fire his minigun?
You are misunderstanding me. I'm not saying it fires TOO slow. I'm saying that it takes a while to fire, and if, during that time, the player gets impatient and hits the fire button again, it resets the bazooka's timer. For instance, say the bazooka is supposed to take 5 seconds to fire. If I were to wait 3 seconds, and hit the bazooka (or minigun button) while the timer is going, it resets to 5 seconds, making the overall wait time 8 seconds instead of five.. Ad infinitum. Someone who hasn't used the Patriarch before and gotten used to this glitch might keep trying, and almost never fire. XD

Find a gun.
Not all stages have guns, and the ones we play on usually don't.

I don't know I dont mess with grenade code and how do you know its other players inventories (god?).
My friend and I stocked up on grenades. He threw all of his at a doorway to kill a fleshpound. I saw a group of zombies, and went to bomb them, and I had no grenades. Confused, I exclaimed into our mumble chat "Where the hell did all of my grenades go!?", to which my friend replied, "Hey, I have full grenades now! That's weird, didn't I just use all of them?" And I was like, "What the fuck.". XD

What waves. I remember it was possible in first wave but the rest of waves its not.
First a LOT, and twice 5th, once 6th, and I think once 7th. There were a few more, but, I didn't catch which waves.

It you don't get feedback, you didn't hit, if you get feedback, and the human doesn't budge, its a noob.
No, I had my friend playing, and he's -very- good. On his screen, he'd attacked three times (and had low latency/ping, we checked), and on our screen, he just stood there, and then went and started to swing, and got killed before doing so, and none of his hits that he was absolutely sure he should have gotten counted. He was on a gorefast, if it helps, as that is where it seems to happen.

I'll see to it.
Okay, cool. This is easily the largest and most serious bug.

Well beta and alpha stages depend on the developer. The developer states what he or she wants and that what sets the stages. In my stage right now, I am ironing bugs, and adding non useful add ins just for the eyes. If you look at the first page, and see what I was aiming to do, I have basically done all that I said I would do, meaning, my aim is done, and now the corrections are being made. The only reason there is some unstability and some bugs is not because of my code but because of incapabilities with the original code, and replication. Bugs such as entering game as spectator is a code I can't even imagine what the problem.
Right, but at the same time, I could make a program and call it 4.0 Final, and it could fail spectacularly at what it's supposed to do. Sure, I could call it that, but, it would reflect poorly on my programming. In any event, I'm just trying to keep the consensus from thinking you're done when there's still quite a few bugs to be worked out. It's always depressing when a dev quits a project before it's done, and it never gets worked on further.

Anyhow, please don't misunderstand my intentions. I was never aiming to insult you, your skills, or your mod. I was just trying to compile a list of many of the known and important bugs so it could be seen, and keep people like BenioX from thinking the mod is done.

But u missunderstood about Patty, he meant he heals at very beginning which is prob. Another prob is his weapons, the timer resets on bazooka which I told u about.
I don't think he misunderstood anything about the Patriarch's healing, just why it was bad. But, he did misunderstand the timer issue. He seemed to think I was asking for instafire. XD
 
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Hmm ye I agree with u in 95%, except changing the trader sequence. U know, when all players are in trader, it closes doors and u can finally buy stuff.
And lol I agree about FP having thin hits, actually FP shall be alot better at hitting than Gorefast,a while FP is worst hitting now. Scrake almost same. They all 3, Gorefast, Scrake and FP shall have the hits wide in 180 degrees, and with correct range, like the blade of gorefast hits textures of human, so shall make damage, not be really close to finally damage. Cheetah, u say to aim in middle of screen, try to do that WITHOUT STRAFING and with player who STRAFES ALOT and AIMS UR HEAD at the same time. Before u FINALLY hit u get DEAD. And remember, FP non-versus hits even from sides! And urs hits ONLY middle which is really... bad.
But yes, I agree with Cheetah, u insult him too much, me too, I told u why what u said were bad ideas, and Cheetah basically agreed. But he totally missunderstood Bazooka AND HEALING cuz he thought u meant Pat can heal however many times he wants, and what we both meant was he can heal up to 300% which is kinda lame, shall be like with humen limit, 100%, so ppl will heal when they go like 50% :)
And I am not pretending his friend, I am his friend, he helped me with alot of love issues... ehh... he is smart ;)
And that what he wrote was a TYPO, he meant me! :)
 
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Hmm ye I agree with u in 95%, except changing the trader sequence. U know, when all players are in trader, it closes doors and u can finally buy stuff.
And lol I agree about FP having thin hits, actually FP shall be alot better at hitting than Gorefast,a while FP is worst hitting now. Scrake almost same. They all 3, Gorefast, Scrake and FP shall have the hits wide in 180 degrees, and with correct range, like the blade of gorefast hits textures of human, so shall make damage, not be really close to finally damage. Cheetah, u say to aim in middle of screen, try to do that WITHOUT STRAFING and with player who STRAFES ALOT and AIMS UR HEAD at the same time. Before u FINALLY hit u get DEAD. And remember, FP non-versus hits even from sides! And urs hits ONLY middle which is really... bad.
But yes, I agree with Cheetah, u insult him too much, me too, I told u why what u said were bad ideas, and Cheetah basically agreed. But he totally missunderstood Bazooka AND HEALING cuz he thought u meant Pat can heal however many times he wants, and what we both meant was he can heal up to 300% which is kinda lame, shall be like with humen limit, 100%, so ppl will heal when they go like 50% :)
And I am not pretending his friend, I am his friend, he helped me with alot of love issues... ehh... he is smart ;)
And that what he wrote was a TYPO, he meant me! :)
Whatever, I wasn't insulting him. I know you may be trying to get in good with him, but, this is my favorite Killing Floor mod. You don't get to decide whether or not I was insulting him to try to make yourself look good.

And despite the grammar, you made some pretty good points. This one specifically:

Cheetah, u say to aim in middle of screen, try to do that WITHOUT STRAFING and with player who STRAFES ALOT and AIMS UR HEAD at the same time. Before u FINALLY hit u get DEAD. And remember, FP non-versus hits even from sides! And urs hits ONLY middle which is really... bad.
 
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I really apoligize for my grammar, I am not American or British, and I am kind of lazy to really care about mah grammar. And ye, that really is worst about it so far, as well as some places being unable to get out through cuz are simly too small exits, made for crawlers, not even clot (spawning mode) can make it. IMO the spawn textures shall be just a dot so u can get through and it reminds of spectator-mode/spawn mode alot better :)
 
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Can you cook it vegetarian please? I know KF is full of guts, flesh being pounded into tiny pieces and dead corspes, but please, at least make the vegetarian version for me ;)
Maybe put there a BP? (Banana Pound) :D


Eat your meat or I'll consider you prey, you look quite tasty right now :cool: Do you like to sweat when you see my teeth? mmmmmmmm
 
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