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Level Design Tripwire is runing our maps

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#63
Hey.

Hey.

avp2501 said:
sounds like a plan :D

knightmare make a steam group and theddle can host all the maps.

i'd definately help out with other maps as long as people help out with mine.

hmmm what could we name the group

The Killing Floor Mad Mappers Association. lol :p
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Sounds good to me. I have no problem hosting servers. Just let me know what maps you want and where to get them. I got a pretty good start.

Below are both my servers info. More then happy to test all maps on my server. Leveling or not. Just would like them to be populated like they used to be. That and be able to get in when I want to play. :D


 
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#66
Murphy said:
What about people who play offline, either alone or in a Lan? There are no seperate whitelists for online and offline and up to now there are no seperate perks either.
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Obviously caching of the most recently downloaded whitelist when offline would be used in practice to mitigate that...

I agree that my solution is the ideal over-engineered "Programmer's perfect world" one since that is my viewpoint ;)

However any long-term solution to this has to be twofold:
- Elimination of the current bureaucracy of getting a map whitelisted
- Technical improvements so whitelists can be updated faster
 
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#68
I'm not a mapper, but I do think Tripwire has been doing a good job of keeping the community stable by adding the whitelist. Imagine how many people would still be playing just on leveling servers instead of playing new maps from the community.

Truthfully all I see this affect are those who are stubborn, and will not play on play on servers without perks.
 
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#69
So, it seems that the truth of the situation is that the majority of the community wants to play with Perks earning enabled. Our player numbers have not dwindled, but the servers with non-whitelisted maps running on them are losing players.

I know we have delayed the White List update quite a bit this time, a lot longer than we ever wanted to, but truthfully it was taken out of our hands. We wanted to update almost 2 weeks ago, but we couldn't. I wish that I could explain to you guys what happened and why, but we're under NDA to keep our mouths shut about it. Just know that Tripwire has not been intentionally delaying for any internal reason, we have wanted to get all the contest maps onto the White List because we love the maps, and we will discuss the other possible implementations for the White List internally(such as making it web based).

Thank you for the suggestions and understanding of our undesired situation, which has had an undesirable outcome on some servers.
 
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#70
TWI is a team of great people and we fully support you in your works :D.

As for getting all the maps on the white list; i still don't want kf-hiddenfacility to be on there until the very last version. I'm currently on v5 and it probably won't be final until v7 (thats another 20 updates :eek:). Looking back at V4.9 which is the one i entered into the competition i'm actually ashamed of it compared to V5

Here's some pix of people abusing the whitelist LINK. And yes they stayed for the entire game and kept replaying it. The server stated that out of all the Maps 'concert hall' had been played over 200 times when almost none of the other maps had been touched.

It's really sad when you have people only there to level up instead of enjoying the journey to the next level. These are the kind of people i don't want to play with online :(.

PS. if at some point in the future TWI or community member releases a new gametype, can we have a seperate whitelist / leveling up process for it? that would be so awesome. Something new to achieve once i've maxed out the deathmatch whitelist :D
 
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#72
Thanks for the candid input.

Back when Steam and valve games had a separate "custom" tab in the server browser where all the non-conformist servers were relegated, users would be presented with a little popup balloon saying:

"Fancy something different? Try clicking here"

There is free chrome in the server browser UI in KF so perhaps a similar little message next to the "perks enabled" checkbox would help send users flowing to the more diverse servers out there.

I know players who have never even noticed that checkbox, which when ticked completely hides all these great servers (including ours!). Small UI changes can sometimes be all it takes :)
 
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#73
I VOTE TO GET RID OF THE WHITELIST. Just cause some losers would exploit maps and such to gain something we REAL PLAYERS worked so hard for is complete BS!! I am also a MAPPER and nothings more frustrating then having to wait for your map to be added to the list when changes are being made a lot even after its done cause someone always finds something wrong in the map no one else did. I'm losing players everyday cause they say hey wait i'm not leveling up on this server and i have to tell them whitelist not updated yet. yeah i can go to the normal maps on my server that came with the game but more and more people want good and hard custom maps. Please i know you guys are like having issues with steam and stuff but please REMOVE THE WHITELIST.
 
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#77
Warning: Wild speculation and extreme opinion ;)

I believe whitelisting or similar measures is a condition of implementing steam achievements that Valve imposes on game developers.

Case in point is Epic Games with UT3 who had to add in a similar white listing system for maps and mutators after they added steam achievements with the Titan Pack and which is having a similar effect on the modding culture there as here in KF (stifling it).

It's an anti-cheating measure to protect the "currency" of steam achievements but what it actually serves to foster is ridiculous situations like this one and distorts what is supposed to be an FPS modder-friendly gamer-centric environment into some sort of monochrome RPG land with achievement-whoring XBox-owners playing within a walled garden of "Officially" sanctioned ESRB-rated Gabe Newell-approved content while us real gamers and modders striving to innovate and be entertained are hung out to dry.%
 
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#78
rallfo said:
Warning: Wild speculation and extreme opinion ;)

I believe whitelisting or similar measures is a condition of implementing steam achievements that Valve imposes on game developers.

Case in point is Epic Games with UT3 who had to add in a similar white listing system for maps and mutators after they added steam achievements with the Titan Pack and which is having a similar effect on the modding culture there as here in KF (stifling it).

It's an anti-cheating measure to protect the "currency" of steam achievements but what it actually serves to foster is ridiculous situations like this one and distorts what is supposed to be an FPS modder-friendly gamer-centric environment into some sort of monochrome RPG land with achievement-whoring XBox-owners playing within a walled garden of "Officially" sanctioned ESRB-rated Gabe Newell-approved content while us real gamers and modders striving to innovate and be entertained are hung out to dry.%
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Let's not point fingers without solid proof, there are many steam games now adays with achievements that do not have this kind of white listing and moreover, i could've sworn TWI said themselves they introduced the white listing to protect the perks, the achievements have no in game impact so protecting those is idiocy.

Btw, i recall that Valve games actually have a console command to unlock almost all achievements, so if Valve really were out to protect achievements, which they aren't, then they would've disable those commands ages ago.
 
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#80
Fel said:
Because of their slacking on the whitelists, noone wants to play any of the new maps because you cant lvl in them. If they would update the white list once a week, then us mappers can get a chance to play our maps with other people.

My clans server has most of the maps from the compittion on it, and noone wants to play them. Why? Because you cant lvl. I know it was about 2 weeks since the maps were summited, and no one will play any of the maps.

Tripwire needs to update more often so us mappers can actually enjoy our maps with random people. They are runining KF becasue all people want to play is the TW maps. Thus people will get bored easily. If the new maps were perkable, then more people would be playing them instead of playing manor, over and over and over and over and over.

Thus noone will even play on our server and probably alot of other peoples server.

The whitelist was a good idea, but now since they like to take their time updating, noone wants to play ANY of the new maps, which will ruin most servers that has mostly new ones.

This is starting to get frusterating. :(
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You're kidding right?
i'd love to play on custom maps but usually 90% servers only have 4-5 default maps.

The server admins are slackers because of not uploading maps.
 
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