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RELEASE: Realistic Armor Mutator - Armored Beasts

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#81
Sichartshofen said:
I'm not going to change anything to make it balanced. That would contradict the point of this mutator. I will modify the larger tank maps to give the Russians their numerical advantage. Currently I'm working on barashka.
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You get me wrong once again. I don't want a forced balancing. I just think that your mutator is not as realistic as you say it is. You can read my posts again, if you like, to get my idea. I am just saying that you give the german shells 3 times the explosive power (note: not penetration) than the russian shells. And those reload times seem also biased.

Please don't get me wrong. I'm neither a commie (just like I don't think you are a nazi ;) ) nor do I want the soviet vehicles to become better than they were, but this just seems illogical and a littel biased to me.
 
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#83
What it came down to for us was in its current form the mutator is not fun for our members. I'm all for making the Tiger a better tank than in it's stock form but the general consensus was the mutator went too far and made the Germans essentially super tanks. Add to that it was causing performance issues on some maps, namely Leningrad, and we chose to disable the mutator for now. Once new versions are out we'll re-enable but time will tell.
 
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#84
What it came down to for us was in its current form the mutator is not fun for our members. I'm all for making the Tiger a better tank than in it's stock form but the general consensus was the mutator went too far and made the Germans essentially super tanks. Add to that it was causing performance issues on some maps, namely Leningrad, and we chose to disable the mutator for now. Once new versions are out we'll re-enable but time will tell.
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A "super tank" would shoot V-2 rockets out of its cannon. This mutator was made from real ballistics data (and tests) as well as correct armor the German and Soviet tanks used. I even opened this mutator up to make sure. The Tiger I is modeled accuarately (not sure about the reload though).
The only reason the German tanks seem "super"or "uber" is because of the omition of a few Soviet "tanks" that could effectively engage the Panther and Tiger I effectively (ISU-152 and SU-85* ugh I feel "like a broken mp3") but thats not this mutators fault.
 
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#85
I'm not questioning the research you put into your mutator nor your implementation. I'm just stating based on the play testing that was done by our members they didn't find it any fun. Since as part of being a server admin I want full server and for the people playing on it to have a good time I have to take this into consideration. Add to that the performance issues that were noted with this mutator enabled led to us disabling it for now. A balance always has to be made between true realism and what's still fun since this is in fact a game. Given the tank loadouts in the maps and such, in it's current form our members don't find it fun and therefore we had to remove it. Please don't take this personally as it is not intended to bash your mutator but rather give you feedback on what the players are saying.
 
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#86
BSE|Vietcong said:
You get me wrong once again. I don't want a forced balancing. I just think that your mutator is not as realistic as you say it is. You can read my posts again, if you like, to get my idea. I am just saying that you give the german shells 3 times the explosive power (note: not penetration) than the russian shells. And those reload times seem also biased.

Please don't get me wrong. I'm neither a commie (just like I don't think you are a nazi ;) ) nor do I want the soviet vehicles to become better than they were, but this just seems illogical and a littel biased to me.
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What part of "I don't care what you think" do you not understand?

I did not make the German shells 3 times more powerful. The only shell I changed was the 88mm. The only penetration tables I changed were for the 76mm guns and 50mm APCR. You don't know what you're talking about. You have no idea what things I changed or re-wrote. Reload times were changed to give the Germans their advantage in 3 man turrets and better turret lay out. Plus for certain guns it does not take 13-15 seconds to stick a round into the breach.
 
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#88
Field Marshal Rommel said:
Yes I noticed that too on maps like Black Day July and Orel October update it messes up the tank spawning for example both the Panzer IV Ausf. H's should be on those maps yet with the mutator only Panzer IV Ausf F2' apppear.
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Not only that but this mut disables the MutROHudPackage, The MuTROTeamkill, MutROMapVariables and kills the 716IDSoundMut and adversely effects other mutators as well.. Something is not quite right.
 
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#90
Sichartshofen said:
What part of "I don't care what you think" do you not understand?

I did not make the German shells 3 times more powerful. The only shell I changed was the 88mm. The only penetration tables I changed were for the 76mm guns and 50mm APCR. You don't know what you're talking about. You have no idea what things I changed or re-wrote. Reload times were changed to give the Germans their advantage in 3 man turrets and better turret lay out. Plus for certain guns it does not take 13-15 seconds to stick a round into the breach.
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Ok, so I better keep in mind:

> Sichartshofen is unable to read
> Sichartshofen is unable to discuss
> Sichartshofen doesn't seem to work for the community. Why do you even release the mutator here? Kill some bots with a Tiger, it sure is damn funny, because you don't even have to aim, the T34 explodes even if you hit the sky :D

Jeeeesus H. Christ
 
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#91
>Sichartshofen doesn't listen to people who don't know what the hell they are talking about.

And if you think I changed the power of all Germans guns, here is the code from my mutator.

Code: 
//===================================================================
class ABPantherCannonShell extends PantherCannonShell;

defaultproperties
{
    BallisticCoefficient=1.8
    Speed=56427 //935 M/S
    MaxSpeed=56427 
}
//===================================================================
Nothing changed! In fact, there's nothing there because nothing changed.
 
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#92
So why exactly does the T34 explode if you hit the last pixel of its mudguard? That's all I complain about (maybe the reload times are a tiny bit too fast now for german tanks).

Ammo storage, Engine - should definately blow up

But why when you hit any random part between? And why don't Tigers, Panthers or Pzkpfw IV explode when you penetrate them and hit a critical area, but need 3-4 hits INTO that area?

I hope you don't take this as an offence and can asnwear in a calm and normal way. It's not meant to bash your work, I would just like to see good armor mutator, like you do, too.
 
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#93
So why exactly does the T34 explode if you hit the last pixel of its mudguard? That's all I complain about (maybe the reload times are a tiny bit too fast now for german tanks).
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I don't this has anything to do with his mutator, but how RO models damage. You can still kill vehicles by "hitting the last pixel of its mudguard" without the mutator.
 
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#95
Let's See now;
  • The German Tanks are too strong.
  • The German Reload Times are TOO FAST.
  • The Russian Tanks are TOO Weak.
  • The Russian Tanks blow up too easy.
Perhaps its time to make the Russian Tanks do what the German Tanks do and the German Tanks act like the Russian Tanks... or better yet, in the best interests of realism, leave everything the way it was even though Realism is relatively abandoned in favor of the obvious clamoring for Russian bias.

I know that's ridiculous but that's what it seems like when you read some of the comments here. Are we going to be accurate or make allowances for Armor Russian deficiencies? German optics alone were vastly superior to what the Russians used in their tanks.

German Tank Technology was/is superior to all Allied Tank Technology and to this day, much of the German Tank Technology is still seen in modern day Tanks. Yet we continue to see people demand the German tanks represented as weak slow junkers. Sure the German tanks were weak and slow NOT! Especially, when Battle accounts are portrayed showing one Stug knocks off 30 some odd Russian hulks.

When one Tiger hammers large numbers of T-34's on the Eastern front and on the western front one Tiger put away over 25 Sherman's and a large number of British tanks. People have got to understand that the German Tanks were vastly superior but were heavily outnumbered.

The only thing that allowed Allied Armor to beat the German Armor was the Allied behemoth Tank Killers like the IS2 and SU152 and sheer quantities of T-34's and Sherman's. The Allied Tanks out numbered the Germans by the hundreds.

Truth is;
  • The German Turrets can GO FASTER (Rev engine, Turret turns faster).
  • The German Tanks can LOAD even faster if tank crew and rack loading is figured into the equation.
  • Early Eastern Front Battles were WON by the Germans.
  • The Russian T-34 76/85 were NOT invincible at all.
  • The Russian SU-76 was never as strong as a Tiger.
  • The IS2 needs to be in more maps
  • The Russian Tank Killers are not in the game yet.
This mutator is quite accurate in its present state. But it still needs work... the incompatibility it shows towards other mutators and certain maps must be corrected if it is to gain widespread use.
 
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#98
Sichartshofen said:
Beta 1.1 is ready. It adds support for BDJ. Plus I will release the AB version of barashka that gives the Russians 12 T34's against 5 German tanks.
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When?

BSE|Vietcong said:
This has some truth in it. Even if the shot didn't penetrate, the IS2's charge even in AP shells was often enough to blow a Pz4 turret off.
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The same is true with the Tiger I's 88mm against T-34's:

German Tanks of World War Two In Action said:
It was observed that the 88mm armor-piercing shells had such a terrific impact that they ripped the turrets off many T-34's and hurled them several yards. The German soldiers' immediate reaction was to coin the phrase: "The T-34 raises its hat whenever it meets a Tiger".
Click to expand...
 
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