Level Design New Possible Balance for Orel

[Santini]

Germans:
3 Pz IV F1's
4 Pz III J's
3 Pz IV F2's
2 Stug
1 Tiger

Russians:
3 T-60
3 KV-1
6 T-34/76
3 T-34/65
2 SU-76

That would be a much better loadout, methinks

 

[Kurt Naake]

There is no balance

Or was the 65 supposed to be a 85?
I for one would like to see 1 IS-2 on the russian side.

 

[kabex]

Either the map is set in '43 or '44... if '44 we should see an IS2 and pz5

But we can't leave the tiger behind... T34/85 was a '44 tank btw.

 

[Alec]

Germans:

2 Pz IV F1's
2 Pz III J's
2 Pz IV F2's
2 Stug
1 Tiger
2 hanomag
4 antitank+saper

Russians:
1 T-60
1 KV-1
5 T-34/76
2 SU-76
2 armored cars
4 antitank+saper

More even and less tanks.

 

[Kurt Naake]

LOL! Even?

Let me guess, you like playing axis


Btw, orel is a tank map.

 

[Nebfer]

Remember the map is set for mid 1943 that means no T-34/85! or IS-2s, well panthers where not in that area at the time (thy where all in the south).

So it shuld be something like
3x Panzer 3J
1x Panzer 4F
4x Panzer 4G(aka f2)
1(2?)x Tiger
2x StuG

for the soviets its
2x T-60
2x SU-76
2x KV-1s
6x T-34/76

 

[Kurt Naake]

So total "ownage" for our russian friends?

I mean cmon, a tiger with a good crew can take out alone 6 of the 76.

And why is there a panther now if "well panthers where not in that area at the time (thy where all in the south).". The panther is already hard to get down, now imagine 2 tigers...yea right....


Realism is good, but balance is important. I know you axis friends want revenge for arad but that's not the way

 

[akd]

Remember the map is set for mid 1943 that means no T-34/85! or IS-2s, well panthers where not in that area at the time (thy where all in the south).

So it shuld be something like
3x Panzer 3J
1x Panzer 4F
4x Panzer 4G(aka f2)
1(2?)x Tiger
2x StuG

for the soviets its
2x T-60
2x SU-76
2x KV-1s
6x T-34/76

Pretty good, but I would leave out the Pz IV F1, as it is largely useless (hardly any infantry and buildings aren't destructible) and not that significant in the real battle. I would avoid the current tendency to throw in a little bit of everything. The map would be just fine with T-34s/KV-1S vs. Pz. IVF2/Tiger.

 

[kabex]

There's no reason to include the F1, it's an infantry support tank. The F/2 was the one used for anti-tank.

I, for one, would like to see some tank variety.

6x Panzer 3J
3x Panzer 4G(aka f2)
1x Tiger
2x StuG

for the soviets its
1x T-60
2x SU-76
3x KV-1s
6x T-34/76

 

[Folgore]

If the axis team plays it's tanks right, holding the Tiger back for long range engagements and two panzer IV F2's covering it's flanks, then the entire Soviet team will not be able to take them out.

 

[akd]

If the axis team plays it's tanks right, holding the Tiger back for long range engagements and two panzer IV F2's covering it's flanks, then the entire Soviet team will not be able to take them out.

Fortunately the goal of the map is not to pin the tail on the Tiger (i.e. you have plenty of room to maneuver).

 

[kabex]

If the axis team plays it's tanks right, holding the Tiger back for long range engagements and two panzer IV F2's covering it's flanks, then the entire Soviet team will not be able to take them out.

The map is not about killing the Tiger, but the Tiger brings some interesting tactics into play.

It could be used as a counter-attack weapon, or a tank sniper, or to reinforce a position, etc. It's a VERY important tank and people could use it as it was used realistically, caring for its life while the "lesser" tanks try to manouver, while 2 others protect the Tiger.

 

[Kipper]

The map needs two Tigers. Those plus the current German tanks would make it accurate.

 

[Moz]

I'd like to see limited tigers (espawns) on this map vs a huge fielding of T34/76s and lots of artillery: it's asymetric balance.

 

[kabex]

I'd like to see limited tigers (espawns) on this map vs a huge fielding of T34/76s and lots of artillery: it's asymetric balance.

Tigers were never meant to be used as a main tank, it's a heavy tank, it's meant to support your medium tank/MBT company or whatever.

Lone Tigers vs hordes of T34s would be a rapefest, Tigers would be outmanouvered and annihilated.

 

[komet]

Add Soviet and German infantry. Leave out the SMG's. Standard infantry, with snipers and LMG's would work better. The PTRD would do well. There was an earlier style Panzerfaust in use at the time as well, or just add an AT rifle for them.

 

[Jack]

LOL I find it funny how people want realism so bad...but you can cut the fear/tension with a knife in here when people start talking about removing the T-34/85 and adding the Tiger


Come on guys, you want to use tactics right? If the Axis team gets only 1 Tiger, the Russians can outmaneuver it like in real life. It will require the team to be coordinated, and just like the real Russian armored doctrine, to use speed and tenaciousness.


On the other hand, if the Tiger is handled badly, it will get taken out in the flank before it can even traverse its turret onto the target.


This maps sounds to me finally like a chance to use the historical tactics, not just camping at each team's spawn and blazing away (ahem, *Arad*).

Currently, none of the tanks showcase their historical advantages or flaws. We never see the benefit in the T-34/76's speed, or the Tiger's powerful gun, because the maps we have currently are so short ranged and confined that it is really just "hammers and eggshells" as they say.

 

[Jack]

LOL I find it funny how people want realism so bad...but you can cut the fear/tension with a knife in here when people start talking about removing the T-34/85 and adding the Tiger


Come on guys, you want to use tactics right? If the Axis team gets only 1 Tiger, the Russians can outmaneuver it like in real life. It will require the team to be coordinated, and just like the real Russian armored doctrine, to use speed and tenaciousness.


On the other hand, if the Tiger is handled badly, it will get taken out in the flank before it can even traverse its turret onto the target.


This maps sounds to me finally like a chance to use the historical tactics, not just camping at each team's spawn and blazing away (ahem, *Arad*).

Currently, none of the tanks showcase their historical advantages or flaws. We never see the benefit in the T-34/76's speed, or the Tiger's powerful gun, because the maps we have currently are so short ranged and confined that it is really just "hammers and eggshells" as they say.

 

[Jack]

woah...WTF my post went up like 5 times

 

[Santini]

Wait, why did noone like my original?
It's historicly balanced, except the T-34/85's, and those are needed because they don't have the hex turret '43 models, and it's the only way to balance
(Yes, it was an 85, not a 65)