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Reload Time in the Tiger

Tiger crews were the elite of the Panzer Korps. But sitting in my Tiger waiting for the reload I'm thinking they must have gotten the geezers from the Volksturm for loaders. What gives with the reload time? I know that we manually reload our Abrams in a much shorter time and that is a much more massive round than the 8.8cm. Anyone studying this yet?
 
The 88mm KwK 36 had a semi-automatic loading system which ejected spent shells, allowing it to be reloaded by operating a single handle and inserting a new shell. The result was a 15-20 round a minute rate of fire. 3-4 second reload time. This is assuming the loader has a new shell ready to go.
 
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hm i don't know about the Short 88mm Ammo, but the Tiger II fired about 1 Meter long rounds... I can't imagine the Tiger I firing rounds much shorter. Though iirc Alan stated a while ago that this is the averaged Reload time, since they hadn't the time to implement the differences in:

-Shells in the Read Rack or down in the Storage
-How fast the Tank is moving while reloading
-Stamina of the Loader (kind of)

Though i believe Alan has his own wishlist (not that this means everything on it will be implemented soon or ever).
 
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[5.SS]Strother said:
I believe that the tiger had a shell ejection mechanism which VASTLY improved reload time but it isn't in the game yet. It may never be added just to keep the game balanced.

Okay I don't want to start a huge argumant about anything, but what is the point of making the game balanced? RO strives for realism and war was not balanced at all. An un-balanced atmosphere adds depth and strategy. Being realistic, lets say you can't penetrate your foes front or side armor, so you have to find a way to get around to the weak rear armor, or even angle your shot to hit the bottom or the top. That will add strategy and cunning to the game. All this talk of keeping things balanced really annoys me if RO truly strives for realism. Balance does not make for a fun game, nor does it create strategy.
 
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Sichartshofen said:
The 88mm KwK 36 had a semi-automatic loading system which ejected spent shells, allowing it to be reloaded by operating a single handle and inserting a new shell. The result was a 15-20 round a minute rate of fire. 3-4 second reload time. This is assuming the loader has a new shell ready to go.

Uh, bull****. 15-20 round minute. Even modern autoloaders like on the T-90 is a top of 9 rounds a minute, and a reload time ot 6-10 seconds. Tiger could never have that fast system when now a days they have computerized systems :rolleyes:
 
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Okay I don't want to start a huge argumant about anything, but what is the point of making the game balanced?

I agree completely but apparently the game is set up to be balanced. Balanced games sell much better because it keeps everyone happy enough to keep playing. If you become to unbalanced you become a niche game and there won't be the thousands upon thousands of people playing.
 
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I would rather prefer that balance was done in numbers of weapons instead of unrealistically balancing seperate weapons statistics and the way they work.
If the reload time of a tiger would be unbalancing, all that is needed is more tanks on the Russian side for instance.
Or even the amount of reinforcements could be altered for more balance.
 
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Artem said:
Uh, bull****. 15-20 round minute. Even modern autoloaders like on the T-90 is a top of 9 rounds a minute, and a reload time ot 6-10 seconds. Tiger could never have that fast system when now a days they have computerized systems :rolleyes:
I agree about the BS with 20 rounds a minute, but don't compare the Russian autoloaders for speed....and I think that probably a 5-6 second reload time in the Tiger might be more realistic

from personal experience, I can reload the M1 (with the 105) in less than 5 seconds, and the A1 with the 120 under 6 - and that's following ALL safety guidelines.

I'll go back a few years (lol) - during TCGST, us poor privates used to have "speed loader" contests...if you're an old CDAT like myself, you know what I mean...and I've seen loaders, following ALL safety guidelines (which means no lap loading) load that old 105 in under 4 seconds.....

I don't know how crowded the Tiger turret was, but the fact that the loader PROBABLY would lap load as much as possible.....the reload time we currently have is way slow....
 
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The turret of a Tiger I was too small for the loader to stand with another round ready. If he did, he would be in the path of recoil for the main gun. Not a healthy place to be when you're talking about an 88. Instead he would have to either press himself against the turret wall or actually sit in his seat until the gun returned to battery, and then he could service the next round.

However, that being said I do believe that the reload time in-game is too long. Well trained, well practiced crews (especially those who have survived combat for any length of time) can usually find shortcuts that speed up the process of getting the gun into action for the next shot. That may involve cutting some corners on safety procedures or whatever it takes to insure that you get your next round off before the other guy does.
 
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[CoFR]BooBoo said:
The turret of a Tiger I was too small for the loader to stand with another round ready. If he did, he would be in the path of recoil for the main gun. Not a healthy place to be when you're talking about an 88. Instead he would have to either press himself against the turret wall or actually sit in his seat until the gun returned to battery, and then he could service the next round.

and ditto with the M1 series....granted, I'm 6 foot tall, but if I stand on the turret floor, I'm out of the loader's hatch almost to my shoulders. I've meet ONE person (thru 13 years in the Army) who could stand upright in the turret of an M1.

When I was a loader - you reloaded either spread legged and crouching, or sitting in the loader's seat. Now, in the A1's - with the stub case deflector and catcher guards - it's even MORE cramped because you have ZERO room for your feet...
 
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SargeDC said:
but don't compare the Russian autoloaders for speed....
Actually, I was just throwing out a random number. The real speed is 6-8 rounds a minute, which is faster than a human loader could do. The main advantage of an autoloader is that eventually, no matter how good you train Human loaders or what you give them, an autoloader can increase in speed with technology. I mean look, in T-80 the speed was 7-9 per minute, now its 6-8 per minute, soon it will be 5-7, then 4-6, then on and on.
 
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That is decreasing... but anyway.
Modern autoloaders are mainly there to have less crew in a tank as well, not just the speed.
Plus the amount of shots per minute are very theoretical. You need to turn the turret to aim as well and specially with the Tiger I this was a very limiting factor. Unless they were shooting at a stationary target.
For the Tiger I they also used to turn the complete tank to aim the gun faster. Turret speed is/was horrible on the Tiger I. This is also the most important reason why angling the tank wasn't used that much.
 
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[5.SS]Strother said:
I believe that the tiger had a shell ejection mechanism which VASTLY improved reload time but it isn't in the game yet. It may never be added just to keep the game balanced.

How could realistically modeling the reload time of the Tiger I affect the balance of this game? As it is currently modeled, the KwK 36 L/56 couldn't stop a hamster so what's a few more rounds bouncing off of T-34s per minute?
 
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Tiger 88 reload and effectiveness vrs balance

Tiger 88 reload and effectiveness vrs balance

Gents:

Personally...
Play balance is not what I want to c... and it sounds like most players here are hardcore gamers and do not want play balance. Historically there wasn't play balance when a four tank unit of Germans was overwelmed by numbers.. The Soviets built over 40,000 T34 of all versions and over 12,000 T34/85, Also, the JSII ... 2,250 were built in response to the Tiger and Panther.

Load times.... let it be historically accurate.

Penetration... I have read a great deal about ...even at the battle of Kursk the russian command was being told the Tiger 88s and Panther A...75s were killing their tanks out to 1600 meters! Make it realistic not balanced. A russian tank squad had 10.. lets say T34s. A german unit might have 4 MKIV or Panthers.

Reinforcements/waives of armour... For the Germans perhaps restricting the Tigers to reinforcements after a set time has passed. Each tank type should be released only as part of a unit ... together rather than one at a time.

Woods.... concealment... If they could allow moving into the woods at least one tank lenght... can u say ambush:<)

I enjoy this game... Voice coms are essential ... calling out threats .. etc...
Great job by the developers..

CyStriker
 
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